[Solved!]Trading System

[Bald_Dad]

I would to present the solution to our current problems with trading system in this game.

I will be answering questions about it.

Q: But what about Unique items with enhancements or gems?
A: Might as well not group them, keep them as they are in the system and remove them from personal trade. This means grouping only monster items or anything else that cannot be modified. This also means the delay of payment will stay on equipments.

Q: But why not just use the market instead since the personal trade will be regulated based on market prices?
A: Its a Personal Trade, the current system does not allow for personal trades with players without token. This trade would be without 10% Tax and it allows trade of items as long as the difference between the items is payed.

[D3ATH]

I like the Auction solution, I don’t mind your trading solution. However, I rather have the silver for items trading disabled [ except for token users (?) ] This will force players to use the Auction to extract their Silvers. Which will lead to the Auction’s input and output delay while the input makes sense [3 minutes would make more sense rather than 30-2hours] but the output, Collected your silver barely makes any.

[Bald_Dad]

However, I rather have the silver for items trading disabled [ except for token users (?) ] This will force players to use the Auction to extract their Silvers.

Could you elaborate? I did not understand that bit. You are saying i would need the market to retrieve the silver i earned from personal trades?

[D3ATH]

oh no. I am explaining why I prefer the current trade system (As long as it’s not restricted) currently you can’t trade silver for items, you are going through all the trouble for either buying talt or getting the other user satisfied with other items. In order to convert the item which you just received into pure silver you will need to user your only option, the Auction.

[Bald_Dad]

you are going through all the trouble for either buying talt or getting the other user satisfied with other items.

Only if there is interest into such an item.[quote=“D3ATH, post:4, topic:183177”]
In order to convert the item which you just received into pure silver you will need to user your only option, the Auction.
[/quote]

The fair trade system would work as the market, you trade an item for pure silver. Only the Silver that goes above the market price that goes into Donation Funds.

[rexzshadow]

Still issue of hey I got his amazing drop I want to give to my friend or guildie but with your system they are forced to have the money to buy it to get it from you. Or say we trade items we both need but that won’t work either in this system you have.

[D3ATH]

Yes, yes. Which is a problem on it’s own which is why I am not disagreeing with your solutions, anything would be better than the current system to be honest.

“Sometimes I feel like they just want to create drama in order to fix everything at one go and looks good afterward, example would be the founderpacks”

[Bald_Dad]

Still issue of hey I got his amazing drop I want to give to my friend or guildie but with your system they are forced to have the money to buy it to get it from you. Or say we trade items we both need but that won’t work either in this system you have.

Trade him, and with the money you get from the Fair Trade you just give to him back.

Trading between itens are allowed, but the difference in required silver must be payed out.

ie: imagine, i give you arde dagger(800m) for your karacha recipe(1mm) , i would still need to pay you more 200m Silver.

[Darkon]

Grouping items wouldn’t help as much as you think it would.

For starters, Alchemists awakening option is random (similar to enchant scrolls) so you have a very wide variety of possibilities on items. Other factors include potential, if the item is socketed, what type of gem is in the item, the level of the gem in the item, durability, crafted items with unique names, crafted items with unique memos, items with charms attached (subs into which charms are attached, how many are attached), and more.

Grouping by duplicates only would defeat the purpose of grouping them in the first place; items would still be easily identified with a unique identifier as they would be grouped separately i.e. the item with an extra +19 Holy attack would have to be separate from the vanilla item because it is different and thus is able to be singled out from within the market for shady transactions. And ignoring the unique traits would be disastrous. If we ignore all unique differences between the items then players would be buying items with 1 potential, horrible names/memos, etc etc etc.

[Bald_Dad]

For starters, Alchemists awakening option is random (similar to enchant scrolls) so you have a very wide variety of possibilities on items. Other factors include potential, if the item is socketed, what type of gem is in the item, the level of the gem in the item, durability, crafted items with unique names, crafted items with unique memos, items with charms attached (subs into which charms are attached, how many are attached), and more.

True to dat, in fact the current market have limitations on both minimum and maximum price, i dont know how to solve this but we problem already exists.

Grouping by duplicates only would defeat the purpose of grouping them in the first place; items would still be easily identified with a unique identifier as they would be grouped separately i.e. the item with an extra +19 Holy attack would have to be separate from the vanilla item because it is different and thus is able to be singled out from within the market for shady transactions. And ignoring the unique traits would be disastrous. If we ignore all unique differences between the items then players would be buying items with 1 potential, horrible names/memos, etc etc etc.

Lets imagine that item exists, the silver seller buy it and then try to sell it for real life money.

Since it was unique to the market group system it would also carry with it the price payed on it. The buyer would have to spent the same amount the silver seller did on it.

[NasiBubur]

Auction solution nice like Runescape
Lowest price sold 1st
But there are many items in TOS
Still good option

[MonkeySpider]

I think he means he can’t “gift” people items they are forced to pay in your system.

[Gringe]

I actually really like the group items idea for the auction house. It will only work as long as there’s at least 1 of everything from legit players though. Also theres different variations of items like mentioned above.

As for the second currency thing, IDK. You might as well just buy the item off the auction house. Many people (not all) actually don’t mind not being able to trade silver, they just want to trade items. A roll system like in WoW could solve the issue with an item dropping for the wrong person.

Edit: i rethought it. If someone puts an item worth lets say, 700k and they trade it for an item worth 600k, then they would be able to do it as long as they add 100k more? if it worked that way it might actually work.

Add your suggestion, plus the roll for item drops while in a party and i think it would work out.

So, i like both ideas if it works like that

[CookyKim]

Quick response:

Grouping items make it hard to understand the market price structure. Also items with different enhancement / enchantments will be a nightmare to group.

More to come later.

[Bald_Dad]

i rethought it. If someone puts an item worth lets say, 700k and they trade it for an item worth 600k, then they would be able to do it as long as they add 100k more? if it worked that way it might actually work.

Yes, the basic point of a fair trade.

[Bald_Dad]

Grouping items make it hard to understand the market price structure. Also items with different enhancement / enchantments will be a nightmare to group.

Perhaps it make a bit hard but like any other new system. Gems and enchantments are out of this solution right now. Did not have time to think about it but i tell you this, our current market system have minimum and maximum price for specific Item. This means that we cannot sell a super rare enchantment on market because it wont allow the fair price for it.

Now, enhancements are possible to solve by simply creating another group for that item expecificly for that nivel of enhancement, ie: +0 +1 +2 +3 +4 +5 etc.

[Daenerys]

If the only way to 1:1 trade with someone is to make them pay market price… then why bother letting people 1:1 trade in the first place? Why not just have the market?

There is no, “Hey, you’re a friend so I’ll sell you this item for less than market value”.

You are also going to run into the problem below since it is too hard to assign a proper “market price” to every item since there is just too many ways to modify an item:

Market Price Limitation RUINS selling Amazing roll Enchanted Hairs Accessories

I have an amazingly rolled 3 stat hair accessory and I’m limited to a very low price on the market…
The highest I can put it on the market for is 40,000

[CookyKim]

I do not really understand what the Required silver concept is all about.

[Bald_Dad]

If the only way to 1:1 trade with someone is to make them pay market price… then why bother letting people 1:1 trade in the first place? Why not just have the market?

To allow for Personal trade using the basic of fair trade.
Now let me explain the benefits of this solution for the trade system.

-Trade between players with token or not
-No tax
-No delay on payment.
-You can negotiate some bonuses for the buyer if buying from you or market. you could give back the 10% tax in Donation Fund.
You could give as Donation Fund all the silver required in the trade.

Now for the enhancement, well that i did not had time to think about a solution yet. The solutions i came up with were unrelated to that problem to some extent.

[tzxazrael]

it’s a nice try, but too complicated for the average user, and it’s also completely open to exploitation.

firstly, there MUST be some margin above the “standard market value” of an item, to allow for supply/demand to increase the price of an item over time.
and using this margin, RMT’s will exploit the “current market value” of certain items slowly over time. eventually we’ll be right back to 50k for kepa stems.

if there’s no margin, then there’s no room for upward growth. if there’s no room for upward growth, then the base price of EVERY POSSIBLE ITEM EVER must be individually set by hand, before the market can ever open. then a couple of people will undercut an item on the market (to make theirs sell first or whatever), and suddenly, the price is permanently reduced by a few silvers, forever, because there’s no room to go up.

eventually the market is destroyed because nothing in the server sells for more than a handful of silver. at silver becomes pointless, and no one will ever spend any money on anything -but- basic supplies, because no one will waste their time with the AH since it’s impossible to get a reasonable value for anything. everyone will just be rolling around in piles of silver, with nothing to spend it on. and since no one can spend their silver, trade dies
the game dies
everything is over.

grouping items would be a nightmare. everything would be reverted to baseline when it was put up for sale, because you can’t group items that don’t have the same stats. that amazing enchant roll you just got on a new headgear? gone when you put it up for sale. etc.

alternately, grouping would require that enhancements be shaved down to bare minimums: instead of +XX to Str… ALL items that added Str would add 7 points. and you couldn’t mix-and-match enhancements anymore. any enhancement that affected multiple stats would only/always affect those stats, by only/always those exact amounts.

also, where would the baseline value come from? right now it’s a free-for-all for the first bunch of any given item type listed on the AH… it’s only from a series of sales that the system can decide what a reasonable baseline is.