To be fair, we DO have “non-instanced” dungeons “as normal maps”. Maps like Residence of Fallen Legwyn Family, Sicarius. Those are “normal maps” with restrictions like “can’t set up base camp” and what not.
On the other hand, it was made clear that HG would be different from what we already had (that included “normal dungeons”) so you can’t compare HG’s to “normal dungeons”.
To be fair, we have open dungeons with and without quests:
https://tos.neet.tv/zones/1051
https://tos.neet.tv/zones/3560
HG are different only in the fact that they have high HP mobs (that are not more difficult than mobs with the same HP that you might meet in open fields or open dungeons).
https://tos.neet.tv/zones/4780
But let’s just ignore it, I already conceded and gave my foot. 
Monsters on HG tend to have higher attack stats compared to monsters of their same levels.
Example (just ignore the boss entries, can’t put both normal and elite together otherwise):
https://tos.neet.tv/npcs?lvlmin=240&lvlmax=250&stats=MaxPATK&order=statd&f=1
(monsters of hunting grounds have the prefix ERD_ on their className)
I’ve searched for maximum patk, but you would find similar results for min PATK or MATK too.
Can you guys take your fight to another thread please?
Ah, good old Tree of Cleric era begins again. You either have heals or die to everything all the time.
I think they buffed healing potions and hp regen tho?
Obviously clerics would help. Why would you be able to sustain as well without a cleric as with a cleric? That’s such a big problem ATM where people just take zero damage so healing doesn’t matter.
Isn’t it because of that there is no safe way to remove Revenge Sevenfold now? Before you could at least do like 1 dmg auto atk, but with the new dmg formula you will always deal 1-2k dmg and reflect back like 15k in self.
The ktest patch changed quite a few stats around, not that it matters since these mobs are new to it anyway. They do have similar stats to almost every average 270-320 mob, see here: https://tos-kr.neet.tv/zones/4910
But, they do have increased health pools, and an increased sfr of 200%. (so x2 dmg instead of the usual 100%.)
I’m not quite sure what boosts an elite/berserk variant gets though. But the old stats are really not relevant to current ktest/ktos versions.
I have read in somewhere imc will balance non-damage skill like ausrine and r7 after this patch.
You can actually do it right now. HP pots are at 450ish right? An [aukuras] scroll is 700 to craft and squire food lasts long enough for it to not matter.
They have to, all this effort would be for nothing. It’s pretty clear IMC has no problem with majorly changing all aspects of gameplay in the name of rebalancing, so I see this as likely.
I agree to a certain extend.
However with how powerful Clerics are they don’t need parties at all and just solo instead.
So how about make it equal and nerf all cleric damage output to mere 50% scaling?
That way I can come back at you with a “well you’re a healer, find a DPS to party with” and then we can talk about the game being party oriented and balanced around that fact.
Until then, that argument you said is pretty weak.
A good solution would be for Clerics to have a damage reduction vs humans compared to monsters/demons.
Fit it into lore because Clerics are not the type to fight another human.
Won’t hurt their fun gameplay for PVE but will fit them in better for PVP. I don’t see why we should hurt them in PVE when people enjoy the class and it doesn’t affect other players much there. But for PVP they should be winning roughly the same amount as others. Not 90% of the time.
How much the reduction needs to be is obviously something that would need testing/tweaking over time.
Thank goodness I will still be able to do Siaulia mission and farm… ?
If clerics can’t solo there are no clerics. Clerics can solo; non-cleric classes can solo; optimal party isn’t 5 clerics; therefore, I see no problem.
This is talking about PVE obviously. PVP balance is just a joke. It’s not even “tree of cleric” it’s “tree of a couple possible builds”. You can easily make a cleric that is godawful in PVP. Old combat system also made healing/support clerics generally awful in PVE because their buffs were usually unnoticeable and healing unnecessary.
That’s not necessarily bad, I enjoyed it when the game was genuinely challenging (before trascendence and R8), but maybe I’m biased because I have two clerics and I started with one of them at launch 
Btw… Someone can tell me if this mechanic is still to be considered bugged or not?
Edit: scout is not as bad (for a farming toon) as people were portraying it:
In Ragnarok Online clerics couldn’t solo almost at all until later levels, but they were everywhere. Well, they could solo one or two maps of undead but that was it.
Way more slow than now :(. It’s not bad burst damage, but is only that, not a true 170 farmer.
