Tree of Savior Forum

To IMC SHOW R9 content

General Discussion
#42

No matter R9 or what, it still temporary solution to the population and gameplay.
There is some core issues happening to the game/company itself, I think Mr Kim have many ideas but lack of resources to fulfill and the game is crippling dead.

The Most Critical Problem that ToS is having now >> Lack of 'Dynamic Contents’
Dynamic Contents = engaging content that able to generate a lot of expected/unexpected outcomes and experiences. Instead of end game, i would just say dynamic since it yield unexpected results which keep it interesting.

Such content is more sustain overtime/replayable as compare to new but plain dry content like fishing/hetran/world bossing. HG is still good after update, but yet the choice and variant is still very limited, if it revamp to Diablo 3 liked, giving random stats and ranges it would be much more interesting, instead of random slot/potential in small range only, Revamp Gem System into RO’s Card liked or Diablo2’s Gem/Rune liked also good idea to uplifting the itemization. The current gem system is worse than the similar Diablo3 gem system.

Currently all the new contents are very straight and dry, expect sharp fall after small amount of period.
Hethran Badges / World Bossing / Fishin / Farming Bless Shards / Farming ET / Farming Orange Mats / Farming World Bosses / Farming Silvers for attribute, all are dry and boring. Yes, you saw many ‘farming’ words where this is what ToS has became > endless farming.

What is the most common dynamic content? PvP/GvG/Unique Itemization/Dynamic Class System/Dynamic Battle, these 4 things are generally the core impact of most successful games.

  1. PvP/GvG - We have been talking it forever since day 1, and it is like taking forever to implement properly? as well as it may just because restriction from game engine itself that constantly generate bugs.
    (Example: GW2/early-RO/Tera)
  2. Unique Itemization - The developers are too conservative on this, where are items like Ignition, Toy Hammer, that give special combat effects? Where are items that can trigger magic so something like Magic-Corsair (aka magica Stalker in RO) will exist? They can revamp monster gem / gem system to do so, but they are not bothering about creativity. (Example: Diablo2-3/RO)
  3. Dynamic Class System - It looks dynamic but it is not, diverse? yes; dynamic? no. developers are ignoring or killing creativity of class synergy, while focusing on Raw Value and Modifier % to powercreeping, even synergy it is just about bonus % but not mechanics. There is no advance customization to unique battle style. Alchemist/Sorcerer/Necromancer/Templar are mean for unique system but has been abandoned. (Example: PoE/FF14)
  4. Dynamic Battle System - I think the game engine itself is not support, monster AI hardly improve, nothing to expect about this. Peltasta was required to hold key for tank, and Pelta/Squire was something in ET, but tanker is no more a thing in ToS with more def upscale. (It is either action/AI-dynamic like GW2/Tera, or strategy-dynamic like RO, in ToS have none of both)

A successful game at least master 1 of it, a popular game master 2 of it, an epic game master at least 2 of it with epic lore.

Conclusion, the game is becoming cute and costume collection, eventually it will become Maple Story, fast leveling and power creeping with big number in the future.

6 Likes
Dev Roadmap: PvE
#43

yea i hope the would make new or work around unique weapon(s)/equipments.
i think they fired the person who in charge of making these kind of items

1 Like
#44

They let the Gacha Costume Maker promoted :joy:

1 Like
#45

Inb4 shepherd class.

#46

I also find it that some of TOS content are really neglected in most cases the never ending quest.
Those mini games, and yes badges which I think
no one bats an eye on those accessories, more costumes which are for me is not that appealing and they stopped at making C3 costumes.
If R9 comes in I have no idea what will come out, all of my characters are hanging now waiting what to expect.

#47

He or whoever is responsible for the content has no clue.
Either single activity in TOS apart from questing/exploring new maps is super boring. Monotonous, boring and most of the time even frustrating. So what do they do to keep the game alive? Add fishing. Congratulation! Resources put into another boring activity.
RIP TOS. Could have been good. Splendid art, music and class system but horrible and stubborn ‘content’ designers.

1 Like
#48

Let’s face that they wasted too much time on wrong systems and game approaches, this throws them at least 3 years backwards in developement. To have a splendid game that starts good and becomes extended and improved over a long timeframe like RO, you need a lot of time,assets and manpower.

Looking at e.g. Gravity corp., the enterprise which was Mr. Kims previous employer, we have to see that only the years after the enterprise grew and improved their staff situation, RO was able to take up pace in both adjustment and content. And it’s the only game of Gravity that survived to this day,although it is nearly 18 years old already.

So, the problem is not being clueless, or not, it’s the missing input,control and criticism of coworkers. Their company is way too small to handle developing a complex game like TOS, that’s why it’s still but a husk.
Yet, they seemingly do not want to fund their company by selling TOS merchandise which could net them a lot of money.

That’s their greatest flaw as a company, they don’t know how to seize opportunities, to balance management with customer service and to keep the system running at the same time.

#49

Some people would pay without hesitation for more cosmetics:

  • to not look like 9 years old but from every possible age to even elderly (+ body sizes + skin color etc)
  • a lot of lodges and not the 3 same still the release…
  • all circles 3 costumes available with several choices so people can have a large choice of costumes with unique animations
  • They should sell emojis with sounds effects.
    They want money, sell 50 differents laughs in tp currency
  • Did they notice there are games outside of korean with 3 euros haircuts with sometimes up to HUNDREDS of choices?
  • why not sell tons of voices packs for every class?
  • why don’t they add like 50 fun mounts with no bonus stats?

Imc games is lacking so much common sense that people stop expecting anything and finally leaving in masse silently.

2 Likes
#50

IMC doesn’t need more money, they make plenty with just ganchas and letitia’s cube. They need competent devs.

1 Like
#51

tbh I find it weird no new c3 costumes or even hair styles have been added for a long time. It’s nice they keep making more costumes (at least I enjoy it) but I would love more variety like the things youspoke of. :confused:

#52

Even the costumes aren’t as good as they used to be imo. Now they feel too generic for me.
Before they had a real theme, and they were unique (whether you found them cute or not). They event took common themes but gave it a twist, like the swimsuits that were more vintage/vacation - unlike the new ones, meant to be sexy/moe like every other MMOs.
The fact TOS was trying to be mostly cute and original in its fashion was one of the things that made it interesting… Having this kind of generic costumes sure doesn’t make me want to get them. I hope they won’t mostly do this kind of costumes now.
Also I know some hated it, but personally I liked the idea of some class-locked costumes. It’s bad if it’s done too much but doing it from time to time is a nice idea, it makes people try out other classes just for the costume.

#53

C3 costumes mean only 1 type of character can use it, which means less money for imc :whitepopoface:
Its all about those all-class costumes so everybody can buy them now for max $$$.

2 Likes
#54

If they’re running out of Ideas (costume design or companion cough* recolored penguin cough* ) they could always relay on the forum and set up an design a costume/companion event. With this much people playing… even tho some might say that its dwindling… there’s still ton of artistic people that are in the community.

#55

I think is they find that making vanilla items such as the entire 1practo/2practo sets takes up a whole lot lesser design and development time than items with unique properties. No choice as they are in a rush to put R8 out. The entire R8 content feels rushed and incomplete.

Probably like what IMC did previously… we probably will get fleshed out R8 content and equipment when R9 is out for at least 4-5 months, just like how we get R7 equipment and items when R8 is out for months. :sweat:

#56

Well, they failed with the hairstyles because they are way,way too overpriced in this game (like seriously, who pays nearly 16 Euros for a single virtual hairstyle? I can go get a cut at the barbers for that money already[not a good one,though]).

C3 costumes take too much time since they have to build these costumes from scratch and they can’t sell them to us through gacha. It’s easier to build those typical cosplay costumes/leisure wear to make money (yeah the marketing department that decided on that strategy has thrown away their intelligence as they became blinded by their greed for money; South Korea is not a role model of lived capitalism for nothing, their society is so full of vanities that cry for money to buy them).

About Rank 9 equipment: honestly,it isn’t needed at all, given the recent changes in armor and possibility to trans your weapon up to stage 10, which should be enough to beat even Rank 11 content, unless they drastically increase content difficulty.

More powerful items are but convenience nowadays…

#57

I don’t think they failed. :x I see a lot of people having them and I personally don’t mind the price, sure if it was cheaper I’d buy more of them I guess but it’s not that bad.

Also the hair cut argument is so bad in my opinion. I have said it multiple times in the past but real life hair cut only allows you to literally cut hair, not grow, not recolor, not reconstruck (thickness etc, huge importance of visual aspect of the hair), not a hair do etc. In this sense a virtual hair style change goes way beyond what a hair cut can do for a person irl.
If you really want to compare irl with virtual people should take into account hair coloring, extensions, paying for a professional made hair do etc. Then we’d end up with the price easily over 100dollars/euros depending on the quality of work obviously… :thinking:

About C3 costumes I can’t say I disagree on that.

1 Like
#58

isn’t tos release rushed as well, is it?

4 Likes
#59

I think they better make C3 Costume as special quest rewards which give you new attribute.
This attribute will scale with your class circle, for example: Pyromancer +10% for all fire damage skills of each circle when wearing that costume / or skill modifier like now you shoot fireballs like energy bolt instead place on ground.

Revamp it as attractive content instead of commercial.

Anyway, there are a lot of suggestions and ideas given,
as being in software development line myself, all depend on how the Product Manager choose them wisely base on priority, potential and resource.

4 Likes
#60

They failed for me. Just check the male hairstyles and tell me, do the so-called premium hairstyles look distinctively better, compared to the non-premium cheap 15 TP hairstyles? Also, are the players you see with premium hairstyles using female or male characters? [I never really noticed a player using a premium hairstyle on a male character + it’s hard to see if they wear head accessories…]

They don’t even look distinctive enough to count as male hairstyles, some make my character look like a trap because of the cute face…

About the price: that argument isn’t bad, it’s fair because I compare it with a real life activity where someone has to work and use ressources for my sake. Cheap cuts come at 10-20 Euro, and expensive modulations have several hair care intermission and/or overwork included,thus taking longer, increasing the personal costs and affecting the price by a huge margin.

In TOS there’s no such a thing like use of work force and ressources included, you design and program that hairstyle once [investment phase] and then the heap of 1s and 0s is sold for ridiculous amounts of money although it is generated solely by machines and is virtual [exploitation phase].

Sorry but I don’t think that[ considering normal hairstyles cost 15 TP (i.e. like ~1 Euro)] 11-15 Euro is an acceptable price for a virtual byproduct that has no effect or impact in the/on the game at all, especially since we can get a whole costume for the same price.

#61

To be fair, A LOT of the hairstyles bought were from another time. When events gave you event TPs (what happened to those ?!), when GvG also gave TP, and when people had early access packs which gave quite a lot of TP.
For all the players I know, more than 3/4 of the hairstyles they have were bought during that time.

If they sold it for like 5$ people would more blindly buy several. But if you sell it at 15$ people are relucant to even buy one. People tend to think “It’s cheap, it’s fine !” without paying too much attention and not realizing buying a few rapidly get them to 25$. But if the base price is already expensive (for what it is), people will more carefully consider their purchase and not even spend the 15$. It’s like that for anything, really.

The texture or whatever doesn’t matter. It’s just pixels. 15$ is too much for pixels, even if the hairstyle is beautiful. The NPC or the staff making it don’t spend more time on your character because of the difference between your base hair and the result you want. This comparison doesn’t make any sense. It’s something that was drawn and is applied to every characters, regardless of their base hair or hair colour.

Also… where does it cost over 100$/€ for that ? I have butt-long hair and live in an expensive country, getting my hair done, cut, dyed and not in a “low” shop will cost me 80€, not 100+.
100+ is only if you get some wedding/special occasion hairstyle that will take at least half a day and several staff to be on you. Usually includes make-up as well.