Tree of Savior Forum

[Suggestion] Token price reduction compensation

General Discussion
#90

i’m fairly aware that IMC doesnt listen to the reason. And i can prove it.

I’m also not waiting for any change just because they already announced the way they will be doing it. Backtracking on that will be not understood by community. I was just expressing my opinion but found out that tons of people on forum have severe reading comprehension problems.

I am also aware that people like free stuff and suggesting anything that will partially take that away will always generate negative reaction no matter how logical or reasonable your suggestion is. Thats just human nature.

1 Like
#92

You know if they refund the original Token owners 99 TP. It would literally mean they bought the Token for 99TP before the price change and sold it for silver. Refunding only the Tokens that are bought from the TP shop by the original owner is extremely fair.

Refunding the people who own Tokens after buying it using silver is actually very strange, there is fairness, but it benefits RMT so hard. Defending the current refund is very difficult unless you support RMT.

3 Likes
#93

That implies that IMC has logs of all TP shop purchases which i doubt they have. Else it would have been the most logical way to do it.

#95

It wouldn’t have been neither logical nor fair.
Again, think about supply and demand.
If they costed less to begin with, we would have had an higher supply compared to the one we’ve got now. And an higher supply with the same demand inevitably lower prices.
Thinking that people would have bought them at the same silver price if the TP price was halved from the start is economically nonsensical.
If they want to compensate someone for the changes, the only ones that deserve it are the end users of those tokens. Whether they got it themselves or via market doesn’t matter, in that regard. Either they paid 198 TP and got the token effect for that price, or they paid a silver value that depended on tokens having a 198 TP price. In both cases, if a compensation is given, it must be given to them.
Giving it to people that sold tokens would be nonsensical. They already profited from tokens having a 198 TP cost, as the market prices would have been lower otherwise. Again, that’s basic economics, like it or not.

1 Like
#96

I agree with your idea @nizidr, when I first saw the way they would be performing compensations being advertised I thought it was a joke.

I for example didn’t use any TP with in game cash items yet but I have 4 tokens bought through silver with my in-game farming. So basically I’m receiving 396 TP for no reason at all. This should be a compensation for people that spent TP to buy tokens and not people who merely have tokens in their pockets.

Not just that but the fact they advertised HOW they would perform the compensation before actually doing it… That’s god awful. I imagine many people now are actually buying tokens through silver to earn those pesky 99 extra TPs. This compensation idea feels like an opportunity to abuse an inverse RMT system: Trade in-game silver for TP points.

People who have token monopoly right now will be made even richer. I’m pretty sure RMT sellers will be using this dumb compensation system IMC advertised to earn even more TP so they can waste it in enchant scrolls to sell absurdly enchanted headgears later (or w/e they plan to do with free TP points).

Neither compensations (yours or IMC’s) are completely fair, but IMC’s compensation idea is much more open to abuse than yours.

#97

I agree with @Loonie on that part.

Those who are into RMT bought silver at a much lower cost than the game’s TP-to-silver value at that time and could have hoarded a lot of tokens with that silver. That means they already have indirectly purchased TP at half the cost.

A simple solution to this is just to double the 30-day TP shop tokens that everyone currently have but make them untradeable (the compensation tokens only). This way RMTers will not gain additional TP at all, and no one probably cares if they get a lifetime supply of untradeable tokens.

Though not right, maybe it was just easier for IMC to compensate in TP form instead.

I don’t agree with OP’s suggestion though about compensating just those who have tokens that were directly purchased via TP and don’t include ones purchased via market. Not everyone are into RMT and a lot of people actually worked hard to earn the silver for buying those tokens.

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TP compensation is fair. Here's why
#99

Yeah, it’s kinda tricky.

If only RMTers were out of the question, it would make sense to compensate with either TP or even silver - the latter though might be difficult to backtrack knowing how volatile the market is the past few weeks.

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#100

Loonie’s method is obviously the fairest but it’s impossible due to the fact IMC probably doesn’t have precise logs of TP items sales (as @nizidr stated before).

I would be upset too, but if you did that for a token you don’t even want that’s a clear example of you trying to abuse the system to earn TP through silver.

This should be a compensation for token TP price changes, not a TP giveaway parade.

Furthermore, if IMC gives tons of TPs to everyone they will be losing out money on the future because people will have less need to buy TP packs for real cash.

#102

You may think that then the supply was halved for that time then, but did you think that the supply of Token was really that high naturally? Right before F2P with the 50% founder pack, the cheapest one included 380TP and a 30 day Token. The bots most likely purchased Tokens to cut their losses by selling them on the market. This also creates the illusion that TP to silver is cheap and RMT becomes over valued.

Refunding original spenders as close as possible is the best solution no matter what. In the end you’re only giving more value for their real money spent, which is the whole point of reducing the TP value of Tokens.

#103

snipping my post bc my opinion on this is actually not worth the effort.

1 Like
#104

I think that the exploiters where banned and their unsold tp/token was gone with them.
However The already sold tokens where not deleted as they can’t punish player who bought their token in a fair way

buyer -> fair;
seller -> unfair;
can’t punish buyer for seller actions.

there was an announcement somewhere, sorry for not linking as I don’t know exactly where it is.

edit:

I agree with this, the problem is changing their mind after the announcement.

I’ll see if I can find it.

@yeule Please let your post there it is worth.

1 Like
#105

I saw a TOS reddit that the exploit was a hoax, and the prove they provided was only client side. Meaning you see the Tokens but they don’t actually exist server side and it’s just junk.

#106

Here got it for you @yeule


I liked your post, not worth the effort is deleting it after the time you spent to write.

1 Like
#107

Yes it is. I just gave you an example for myself: Never spent a single TP and still earning extra 396 TP points. How’s that not generating new TP for me?

And yes, it is generating new TP even on the global view of population. There were tons of tokens being generated through DLC exploits (so tokens adquired for free) that will now be converted into more TP.

If this compensation is given out, IMC will witness a sudden drop of sales of all DLC packs. People will have extra TP to use and the necessity to buy more packs will cease to exist.

How’s that not unfair to you? A selected few rich people getting way richer and the poorer staying as they are:

F2P players who bought token through silver in game and used their token won’t get any compensation because they don’t have token in their pocket anymore (so they aren’t getting anything).

You’re just thinking of your own situation alone, but forgetting to see the whole scenario.

#109

You’re right, they are. I must’ve skipped that part when reading the announcement.

But still, it doesn’t invalidate the other arguments I’ve stated.

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#111

just a whim but, won’t it be a lot ezier if they just check those who have “TRADABLE” tokens and compensate them?
screw the tokens currently being in used.

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#112

I only see that some people just win the bet and some lose

Happen all the time in stock market

Suck i know but that how things are

2 Likes
#113

380 TP and a token, at a 198 TP token price, can give you 2 tokens at most, even considering the 5 free TP you can stack upon. (the pack one and an additional one, as you would have 187 TP left after getting one, that can get to 192 with the free ones - still not enough for another token).
With a 99 TP cost per token, instead, they would have got either 4 tokens (1+3 from TP) or 5 if they used their free TP wisely (94 TP cost per each one,and you end up with 4 spare TP left).
You’re right, my calculations were wrong - compared to a 99 TP cost, the supply was even more than halved. Tokens’ cost would have been even lower. Oh well, can’t do much about it.

Either way, no, refunding original spenders makes no sense. They got silvers from those tokens, and that silver value depended on tokens having a 198 TP cost, as that was what determined the supply of tokens. With a 99 TP cost, and a supply that would have been more than doubled, they wouldn’t have got those amounts of silvers to begin with. You’re saying that they should get the silver value of 198 TP and a 99 TP in addition to that, while the ones that bought them end up having paid a silver value of 198 TP for something that costs 99 TP. Obviously, that makes no sense.
What will happen instead is that people who sold tokens and got their 198 TP value in silvers for each of them will see no change, and whoever bought those tokens for the silver equivalent of 198 TP and now have an item valued 99 TP get compensated for the missing 99 TP. As logic would dictate.

3 Likes
#114

This everything and because you sold token that she bought gained silver and still or to gain more tp? Want more nothing not doesn’t type a personage upado until the 280?

#115

You’re basically just stating what OP is implying.

The only “tradeable” tokens are ones directly bought from the TP shop.

1 Like