Tree of Savior Forum

[Poll] Transcendence System

General Discussion
#22

That problem exist because tons of people wanted to nerf magic classes. IMC complied. For me thats totally different matter instead of transcendence problem. Support classes obviously would have a hard time to clear it. STR suck balls thats why lots of people cant progress anymore.

Str rebalancing alongside of transcedence is possible. I think IMC is the culprit for that i dont deny that. Str should had been reworked before R8 were released. If they do that. STR people wont nitpick transcendence.

TLDR: Power creep is good in R8. IMC sin is they didnt reworked STR before R8. Magic class nerf was suggested by the community. Removing transcendence will only open another can of worms.

#23

I forgot to mention a thing about the mob rebalance, they did it wrong tho, instead of 50% reduction, it should be around 30% or 25% less, to keep the difference more fluid, the old HP values are for Lv 400-449 or 450+.

Same for defenses and offensive.

The devs are just throwing random values, they aren’t testing, in fact, the QC are us, but in the end, they still ignore most of our complains and suggestions.

#24

Locked Blessed Shards completely ruin the game for new players. Not only would they have to wait for a Practonium, but they would then have to wait months for Transcendence. The problem isn’t the players with high Transcendence, that’s only an issue in PVP, the issue is not enough players having high enough Transcendence to be viable. Under the current system, locking Blessed Shards only stalls player development for no reason.

The underlying issue is Transcendence itself, but allowing Blessed Shards to be tradable made it accessible to everyone else. Really though, right now, we’re trying to fix a fundamentally flawed design, and that will prove to be impossible.

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#25

Yeah I agree, I think they did the easy way out by nerfing the content when focusing on stat/class balance would have been a better solution.

Either way I’m just happy they did something to the problem. :grimacing:

#26

I’ve thought about quitting many times since early access started for one reason or another, but the transcendence system is the main reason why I don’t play tos now and probably won’t return in the foreseeable future.

Don’t get me wrong, I have quite a few level 317 characters capable of farming shards with and eventually rolling even more practonium. In short, queue said it best: fundamentally flawed design. I no longer see the point.

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#27

Yeah, much is needed to be done to undo what is done with the implementation transcendence. It is a good thing they realised what implications transcendence has done to the game, and how it isn’t the wonder drug they thought it would be to address the mismatched equipment vs core stats vs skill damage ratio.

Just hope that they will do what they said they would, revise the battle formulas, overhaul the items stats, characters stats and skill damages. It will be a really long and tedious journey for both them and players…

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#28

i think a lot of the games equipment is kinda rubbish, but this also makes a lot of upgrade options useless/pointless. how long until gems are redundant too. like the class system, equipment just lack variables and it all becomes pointless the further you go. they should just add a general 10% bonus too all stats per rank.

#29

They really need to do something about transcendance, it only allows RMT players to advance more than casual players. Imbalance economy. And everytime I see those who have level 10 Transcend I really feel theres no point of playing. Good side is the community or other players who enjoy this game as theres nothing wrong.

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#30

Thankfully IMC has ruled nothing out in regards to rebalancing, that’s one of the areas I draw hope from TOS. I think we need concrete ideas to send to IMC though, and I’m talking exact or almost exact numbers.

#31

make trascend increase final damage , lvl1 10% - lvl 10 100% , because it is not fair for one handed class

#32

Just give lots of suggestions on how to change the system so IMC wont implement half ass solution. The solution should cover all the angles not just selected point of view. If you know the system suck so bad it also means you know how to fix it. Saying it is bad without offering solution wont bring us to your desired or preferred fix. This always happen, killing most of the fun out of TOS because of bad suggestion(only 1 point of view).

#33

Transcendence is a good system in theory, just not at this time, game is not even finished yet and transcendence should be an end game objective.

Right now, i feel the easiest (laziest) solution, and possibly the less rage-inducing one, would be to just make shards like, really, really easy to obtain, this way they can continue with the power creep and not have to rebalance everything, cause right now it feels really shi**y to finally come close to “end game” just to find out you NEED to have transcended gear to even quest.

I would personally like transcendence to just go all together, but because of obvious reasons, that wont happen.

Anyways, i think theres not a good solution without making everyone who got high lvl transcendence feel cheated for all the time they invested on that /:

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#34

The way transcendence was implemented is just lazy, uninventive game design disguised as new content to pave the way for more “new, harder content”.

Instead of giving players the flexibility when it comes to gearing as we progress throughout the game, we’re stuck with aiming for BIS before succumbing to the transcendence cancer.

Then they decide it’s not enough and made the system accessible for RMT/whaling practice as well.

Now that it’s fully rooted into the game, removing it will only cause more harm than good what with IMC’s history of making working stuff break. As a lot of you has said in this thread, a lot of players have already invested a lot of time (and/or ehem money) into this flawed scaling system.

You cut the roots, the tree dies.

The only possible solution is a rework - something that makes it welcoming for new and casual players while still rewarding veteran/hardcore players. The post below can be a good start for IMC’s consideration.

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#35

What option would you think will be good? would like to know your input in transcendence system.

#36

Just reduce shard costs by a lot such that players can gear themselves in human time. High level Transcend makes most classes playable it’s just not affordable, reduce the huge amount of investment and problem fixed.
Guess that’s too easy.

#37

sounds like shards are available now in tp, and a few hardwork coupons for those who farm it

#38

They have already stated that can’t remove transcendence since there were people that put the effort (re: irl money or guild collaberation when shards were tradable) to get stage 8-10 items.

I think that re-working transcendence to boost stats only would be a good option, however this will take a complete re-working of STR/DEX and INT to make sense.

Honestly STR and DEX should just be combined with tweaking to make sure that crit rates scale in a similar way that it did when stacking DEX (since you get more STR per rank). This would remove the common complaint that physical classes have it worse than casters. Remove crit attack completely.

For INT, make magic able to crit and have points invested boost crit rate. aaand we are done here.

To add some spice, make SPR have crit resistance tied to it. Full support builds would then have a reason to go SPR instead of just flat CON.

Honestly all this is kinda moot unless the entire stat system is re-worked to not revolve around flat values and instead scale with %s…but at least this will stop the insane power creep that transcendence provides.

EDIT: Another option would be to flat out remove SPR and replace with AGI. considering the above change to STR/DEX, remove the ties with evasion and move them to AGI, and make AGI provide crit resistance as well. This would make AGI a pure defensive stat similar to CON. Perhaps add an attack speed element to it, but you would have to be really careful with its scaling.

#40

Sorry for double post:

Changing Transcendence to stats could look like this:

Weapons: Boost STR or INT, depending on weapon
Shield: Boost CON & AGI
Top/Bottom: Boost CON & AGI
Gloves: Boost STR or INT, depending on gloves
Boots: Boost CON & AGI

Just a thought.

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#41

Rofl i quit before reforging happened. I feel bad for you guys though, like really cuz mabinogi was my favorite game before G8 happened.

#42

As said already on this thread there are others satisfy options.
There are so many who already invested money, time and put a lot of effort to it.
How “nerf” this feature and compensate this people…
Well on my view there is simple no way to fix this now without loss.

But one simple way to deal with it and add some competitive play,is to reduce it ONLY in pvp like the lv on everyone in tbl is equal

give by inicial class to everyone same status, for mages more int for archers more str and dex for swordsman more str and con for clerigs str,int and some con.
Or a cap in magic/phisical/critical l/atk/def and hp(this all is just an example).
This would solve most class balance problems. And add some tatics to it.

And on pve, duels 1x1 and gbl the power would remain making the efort to get transcendence valid

That in my opinion would be a good way to it without many one side efect

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