Policy Update Regarding RMT

[Seiran]

RMT is a win to the game for the most part. Believe it or not.

It’s really not. It might fall into “depends”.

Example: Some really expensive item gets sold for real money because people can’t afford it with silver.

-> In theory the item should get cheaper because the offer increases as time passes without the item being sold.

-> In practice whales buys the items and keep the price high even if no one can afford.

EDIT:

I agree that such transactions should be made discreetly and under table.

Not sure if you misunderstood but I said the “at least not as public” in a sense that I can’t affirm that people doesn’t RMT like that but there’s little to no evidences - not like things should or should not happen in any way.

[Aoi_Kanashi]

i think they meant botting in general though

it doesn’t have to be a yes or no answer that formulates the absence of one leads to to the other

as i mentioned earlier, it is more on whittling both giraffe HP until you can slay both at the same time regardless of the factors that affect one to the other

if you punish buyers, then it would discourage peeps from buying silver, and that’s it.

kind of like an additional rule to catch related criminals.

rather than a singular cause and effect relationship. think of the whole scenario as a spiderweb that has separate frame threads from a common point weaved together by the auxiliary spiral threads

[Veldt]

-> In theory the item should get cheaper because the offer increases as time passes without the item being sold.

That is happening on Telsiai, though. +16 item prices are dropping, sharply.

-> In practice whales buys the items and keep the price high even if no one can afford.

Not sure who are the whales in this case. No one needs that many. I see a few +21 and above items traded for silly prices, but that isn’t the norm. You can’t really take -those- into consideration. Even anvil success statistics show them as an outlier. They will be overpriced regardless.

Most of the f2p folks I know on Telsiai have at least one +16, and solm gear from the runs they did themselves. Besides diamond anvils, nothing really needs to be stockpiled, and diamond anvils are the exception, not norm.

Edit: I feel part of the problem is the re-roll costs of the cubes. It hits the pure f2p players harder than us whales. We can’t really control -that-.

[Kur0ir0_Rai]

IMC, you should make RMT legal by Exchanging TP point to silver with a responsible point.

[Seiran]

That is happening on Telsiai, though. +16 item prices are dropping, sharply.

Yeah but there’s always cases where whales buys.

Another example: Giltine Wings in Silute being sold for IRL cash instead of price going down. Being a cosmetic item originated from “whales” doesn’t exclude this as example.

Edit: I feel part of the problem is the re-roll costs of the cubes . It hits the pure f2p players harder than us whales. We can’t really control -that-.

That’s true. Although it can be worse if the Time spent by F2P gets too little value.

[Veldt]

That’s not our fault, though. 0.1% drop rate or somesuch. Even whales won’t want to shortchange themselves on THAT.

Edit: Giltine’s Wings is one of those things like a 10 run worldwide limited edition watch. No one’s buying, but the price isn’t going to go down because of its rarity.

[Rxlxk]

It takes two hands to clap. There must always be a willing buyer and a willing seller. All of which will be based on silver prices on websites provided by bots. I believe all of your concerns eventually goes down to silver : $ ratios.
On this i will like to make an argument that even bots existing in our current state might be beneficial to a certain extent. Our community is small.They are the ones generating majority of the silvers, which is crucial as there are now many silver sinks such as velco cube rerolling and ichors etc.
If silver prices are sky high 10m : $50 , and i take an average of $50 to get a DA via TP boxes. Then 10m will be the price of the DA . As a TP buyer i will be reluctant to get DAs for trade since $50 gets me 10m which cant even reroll a velco cube

I will probably get flamed for saying this lol

@Aoi_Kanashi
No i said many times. They can just store silver and do it through miki items for example to sneak through this current policy. Killing the buyers dont even affect anything.

[Seiran]

That’s not our fault, though. 0.1% drop rate or somesuch. Even whales won’t want to shortchange themselves on THAT.

That’s my f’ing entire point.

You’re limiting access to items from average players just because you’re a whale, and that’s bad.

[Aoi_Kanashi]

are you saying it doesn’t discourage buyers from buying silver?

[Veldt]

Giltine’s Wings is one of those things like a 10 run worldwide limited edition watch. No one’s buying, but the price isn’t going to go down because of its rarity.

Its already limited access. EVEN TO WHALES! (There ARE whales on Telsiai who’ve been trying to buy them, and no one’s selling).

Its an exception case. Not for ordinary consideration or included in normal economic charts.

Edit: Also out of control for us whales, really. That drop rate is silly.

[Seiran]

Giltine’s Wings is one of those things like a 10 run worldwide limited edition watch. No one’s buying, but the price isn’t going to go down because of its rarity.

Its already limited access. EVEN TO WHALES! (There ARE whales on Telsiai who’ve been trying to buy them, and no one’s selling).

Its an exception case. Not for ordinary consideration or included in normal economic charts.

And I never said you’re excluding average players of the usual transactions and that’s it.

Focus of my comments is that you’re excluding average players from the market of high-end/rare items just because you have cash, and that’s bad. This is what I meant with the “800m” example.

It’s bad to isolate rare/high-end zone into whale-only VIP rooms.

[Aoi_Kanashi]

i think you missed the point of my other comment regarding taking small steps rather than an absolute direct cause and effect.

you keep on thinking of what comes next
but the present is required in order to distinguish the future from it

[Veldt]

Focus of my comments is that you’re excluding average players from the market of high-end/rare items just because you have cash, and that’s bad. This is what I meant with the “800m” example.

Well, thats the thing, though. The really high-end stuff that goes for 800m? Those’re as rare, or even RARER, than Giltine’s Wings. Those are the exceptions. I don’t know what prices that kind of stuff go for on Klap or the other servers, but on Telsiai, regular ‘high end’ +16 prices have dropped into the much more easily achievable range (Sub 100m - stat dependant).

[Seiran]

I believe all of your concerns eventually goes down to silver : $ ratios.

No, it’s not.

My concerns is that converting TP to silver, if done in a bad way, can cause unnatural flow of the economy such as making it close to impossible for non-RMT players to dispute.

Well, thats the thing, though. The really high-end stuff that goes for 800m? Those’re as rare, or even RARER, than Giltine’s Wings. Those are the exceptions.

So are you implying that all whales should have exclusive access to the exceptions and normal players should never have access to those?

[Jyabami]

Summary of this thread:

“Please make this game more p2w or else we buy silver from gold seller and if you ban us, you lost your player base.”

[Veldt]

So are you implying that all whales should have exclusive access to the exceptions and normal players should never have access to those?

No, even whales do not have exclusive access to the exceptions. Those are exceptions to -all- players. Just like my example of a 10-run worldwide handmade watch. The maker isn’t going to discount them.

It will be high priced even if you completely, and utterly, remove all traces of RMT and whaling from TOS.

[TheAlleyCats]

@Seiran is totally right: heavy P2W, along with RMT, not only drives away f2p, but potential customers too.
And f2p do not like to be treated like “content” or punching bags (in pvp oriented games).

Why do you think I did not invest in this game? It started as a bug/botfest and I decided to wait a bit, bots weren’t banned, abusers weren’t banned, then it became a gacha galore, then diamond anvils came.

I usually support games (i spent thousand for mounts/costumes on tera - for myself - until it became fully p2w and left), I still have 500€ worth of unused “tokens” in archeage, but I’m not that dumb to fall into the traps forever.

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

And from my experience, many of the so called “whales” aren’t rich guys, but people that spend their whole wage.

[Seiran]

The maker isn’t going to discount them.

So in practice you go and have exclusive access by RMT’ing it. Easy right? Not for average players, which is my point of how bad RMT (legal or not) is.

[Veldt]

So in practice you go and have exclusive access by RMT’ing it. Easy right? Not for average players, which is my point of how bad RMT (legal or not) is.

It will be high priced even if you completely, and utterly, remove all traces of RMT and whaling from TOS.

In which case it’ll be the utter no-lifers who spend 24 hours multi-camping rare monsters for the drops who’ll be able to afford those.

Those items will NEVER be available to ‘average’ players. And also a bad example to use.

Edit: Prior experience speaking for the above, here. Spanking rare items will never be ‘general population accessible’.

[Seiran]

In which case it’ll be the utter no-lifers who spend 24 hours multi-camping rare monsters for the drops who’ll be able to afford those.

So it’s from things in-game instead RMT which is fine. You put effort on it.

But let’s say these players doesn’t go and buy the item and the seller wants to sell, it will go down little by little. Not everyone wants to use them, you know, Giltine Wings are actually ugly when walking. lol

Edit:

Spanking rare items will never be ‘general population accessible’.

So why should it be easily accessible to P2WIN/RMT players? Just because you got a credit card with high limit?