Tree of Savior Forum

Plans for Combat System Changes

News and Announcements
#42

Overall very good changes and I’m excited to try them out, definitely a step in the right direction!

Reading through this, one thing at the end caught my eye immediately:

4-3. Monster Skills & Elite Monsters

With our planned update in effect, regular monsters that spawn in large numbers will no longer use “advanced skills” in combat. By “advanced skills”, we mean skills that affect your character’s movement (stun, knockdown, freeze, etc.) or those with a long duration that inflict poison, burn, slow and others.

They will also stop running away for no apparent reason (we know that was a pet peeve for many…). Simple attack skills and buffs remain the same for these types of monsters.

@STAFF_Ethan
Please, please, PLEASE… Consider increasing the range that monsters follow you, considerably.

Having the monsters run away for no reason was annoying, yes, but even more frustrating to me is that you cannot actually form a big mob by running across the map.

That’s one of the most fun aspects of grinding for me:
Run around the map, aggro monsters, bring them together in a big mob and then finish them off in one big blow… so satisfying…

8 Likes
#43

My guess crit chance from items will be buff so much. Rogue will rise as top crit freak now.

1 Like
#44

rogue already like 100% crit chance easy! rogue will always have most easy time to crit

#45

stat changes will make Dex only viable for AA based classes like qs3 or any other 0cd skill spammer like sc3( Fletcher3 mostly dont prioritise 0 cd skills bcz their primary importance is Magic arrow and then after that comes the 0 cd spamming), most others won’t bother with it.
And full dex wont be mattering much in PvP bcz full str will have accuracy to counter full dex evasion. That makes evasion completely useless in PvP scenario. Now for this change if applied as it is then in str vs dex will simply mean go str unless qs3 or 0cd skill spammer. So i think Dex should be reconsidered a bit more. Pretty sure skill changes will mean Running shot will undergo huge changes which can even put qs3 under difficult position to choose between str or dex.

I do applaud on your event to hand out resets daily to mix and match and test stuff out until satisfied, but don’t you think its much more pointless in iToS bcz kToS data is always available to us. So that event might not matter much to most of players.

And, bcz of the current info you released, it might mean something drastic in transcendence reset you will be handing out. Suppose bcz of this a player tries to abuse it. For example, he will take a low lvl gear right now and use only 1 blessed gem on it to try his RNG to get it high lvl trans without consuming much of blessed gems. According to you, you will compensate everyone for it. So they might try to “get more blessed gems” than invested. So keep such abuse and any other possible in mind. Although I don’t know how exactly you planned for compensating but just a warning from me avoid any exploits.

i’ll be waiting for more info.

3 Likes
#47

Dex should be reconsidered. With the removal of critical chance you are just forcing people to go full str. I dont think that’s a very good solution. It’s exchanging one thing to the same thing.

#48

With Critical Attack stat being saved, critical rate / resist removed from basic stats, how would critical rate be calculated? Only by headgears enchants and appropirate gems?

Well, if there will be no critical resist on mobs, smth around 150-200 critical rate would be enough to almost always crit…

Need clarification here, please.

2 Likes
#49

IMC should remove that additional accuracy as you level, literally killing evasion build on the ground.

#50

And SPR still seems to be largely useless. Maybe even more than before considering all changes. And that worries me alot as i like to play summoner classes. I still hope the day will come and my zombies will become useful in actual gameplay instead of being ‘negative dps’ they are now.

Well? I still hope summons will receive atk/def scaling from equipment (not holding my breath tho). Because currently you simply cant go ‘full summoner’ and by investing into SPR you are basically gimping any other classes you have.

9 Likes
#51

The crit chance from rogue probably will change, its on 2.2 Section.

#52

Here are some of my initial thoughts. I’m very excited and it seems IMC knows what they’re doing, and have been listening to feedback.

#1. Log Scale Down Formula

I’d need my old high school math teacher to look this one over, but it’s simplified and makes perfect sense. It stops highly geared players from having an overwhelming power difference, while still giving them the advantage they deserve. It fixes the scaling problem in instances without removing characters ability to feel as if they progressed by just scaling everything within the instance. It clearly solves the Defence extremes, and also provides a needed buff to HP.

#2. Skill Attack & Stat Calculation

2-1. Skill Attack Calculation

I think we’ll need more details, but depending on how the skills are calculated this a VERY welcome change. We only have a little bit of information on it, but it seems promising.

2-2. Stat Changes

The removal of stat allocation bonus is godsent. The change of class hidden modifiers to having stats give bonuses to them is good. It should allow for more variety in picking builds as there won’t be a guaranteed path you are sent down regardless of your goals.

The stat changes themselves seem overall good, but SPR still has me concerned, it may depend on how skills work to see if it’s balanced for non-summoners, which it may be as in the case of Cleric skills.

The Critical rework is very interesting, having it rely less on the stat itself and instead on equipment (which is what I assume it will focus on) allows for people to build for it without having to go all in, while still rewarding those that do.

CON and by extension HP actually receives a buff by the DEF formula rework which is nice, and with hybrid builds becoming more viable we don’t have to worry about Block being overly powerful.

2-3. Attribute Reset & Point Exchange

Perfect, absolutely perfect. Not only is an attribute exchange necessary, but IMC did it correctly. If they just refunded silver we’d have potentially billions of silver flooding into economy, that would be utterly devastating, Under this system you lose nothing, and are still able to rebuild.

2-4. Reset Event Plans

Perfect again, just get hyped on this one.

#3. Item Stats & Enhancement/Transcendence System

3-1. Equipment Production & Maintenance Costs + 3-2. Item Enhancement

The details on the skill formula is very useful in us determining how the balance will be done, right now it looks good. I’m glad to see needed rebalance to items other than from Transcendence, as well as it fixing the 1H/2H problem.

Enhancement cost reduction is good, a bigger reliance on RNG with the potential system isn’t. If there was no potential then just risking silver would be fine, but we’re risking irreversible damage to our equipment with RNG, still though, this is a major improvement.

3-3. Main Armor Stats & Accessories

I’m very glad to see the DEF stats both made primary. It makes a lot of sense, and allows you to actually build to be PATK or MATK resistant. The buff to Leather was desperately needed, and it looks like a viable alternative now.

The Blunt weapon change is fantastic, and seems to encourage PATK/MATK Clerics instead of just focusing on one.

Agny needed a nerf, and it got one, it’s encouraging to see IMC addressing the problem, and confirming that the new ones will follow the same balance.

That last line is so reassuring to hear, they’re not balancing skills around specific items, I’m glad to see a reversal in that idea and correcting their mistakes.

#3-4. Transcendence

I’m still against the Transcendence system as I would prefer more items be added to progress through opposed to getting the best one quickly and investing in it. This however, is the best alternative and one that I have agreed with for a long time as being practical enough to work. It’s not brokenly OP, and while invested players have an advantage, it won’t be overwhelming.

The unification of Blessed Gems is nice, as well as the rebalanced amount required is a good move, especially for 1H players. The extraction process is much better and actually encourages players to invest in new equipment (it also highlights the irrelevance of the potential system).

Compensation for Transcendence is perfectly reasonable, especially with the new refunding system, highly invested players will still have an advantage for a very long, well deserved time.

#4. Field Balance Changes

Recognition of IMC’s mistakes is exactly what’s needed. They have been aware of the problems, and are fixing them.

4-1. Regular Field Difficulty

Good changes, but my only concern is making content too easy. I hope they balance it correctly, the new DEF formula should help with that too.

4-2. Hunting Grounds & New Equipment

Hunting Grounds improvement is nice, and makes it more social which should always be encouraged. New Hunting Grounds for 280 and 330 looks promising, and alternatives for gear variety is desperately needed.

4-3. Monster Skills & Elite Monsters

The Advanced skills system, was honestly just abysmal. I swear I’ve almost gotten aneurysms from all the CC you have to deal with, the Elite Monster addition looks fun, and is great for adding variety in the field. I still encourage IMC to implement an actual CC system but this update is more than enough to keep me satisfied for now.

Overall, these changes are amazing. They fix the fundamental issues TOS has had since creation, and it shows IMC as a company is willing to rework the very basics which is incredibly encouraging. The timeline is understandable but concerning given the population, but I am very optimistic of the future. I hope IMC continues to listen to feedback, and has no fear in changing game concepts like they’ve shown us today. Don’t let us down IMC, I know you have the potential!

15 Likes
#53

Only hidden modifiers i think. Eg. Bonus evasion and crit chance if you invest dex for archers. Skills maybe adjusted though.

#54

Pretty much. I don’t think almost all melee classes will be relying on crit for damage now.

#56

OH! OH! what about sadhu fix? pls I beg you fix poor sadhu out of body skill at least ;_;

6 Likes
#57

high/full spr sadhu will probably increase zombie damage at decent value.

#58

Do you know when can we expect more information about the stats and skills ?

Specifically I’d like to know more about:

  • SPR for Clerics: with no CC/debuff resistance and no MDEF, what should we expect ?
    So far the main reason to have SPR was for buffs, and then the defense and resistance were a nice bonus. Without this bonus and knowing only a handful of skills scale off SPR, will we have an actual need to level it ?

  • SPR for wizards: since Summoners drains % of mana for their summoned creature and SPR increases both the total of mana and the summons’ attack/defense, how does this work ? The summon’s DPS will increase with SPR, but at the same time the Summoner’s mana will be used faster and faster ? It’s pretty contradictory (maybe forgivable if SPR increases the summon’s DPS a lot).
    My point is: I’m afraid at this stage SPR is becoming a useless stat for everybody.

  • STR: it feels lackluster. Knowing there are other means to add PATK and Accuracy (gear, being higher level, gems) it feels like we won’t really need to add STR since DEX offers more (evasion, critical attack, block penetration, attack speed). But then what’s the point of STR ?
    And what about classes that depend heavily on STR and PATK (like DOTs) ?

Will skills’ stats scaling change as well since the stats are being changed ?
I see that the buffs will change, which is really amazing, but what about other skills ?
Will there be more cleric tree’s skills that will require SPR ? Or is SPR doomed to be a pretty useless stat just here to make you save mana pots ?

I think overall we all need more explanations on how all those stats-related changes will work.
For the rest it seems all promising, needed and welcomed.

9 Likes
#59

100% crit rate should defenitely be a possibility.
With lot’s of investements, good enchants, gem, anything, but natural critical builds should be a thing. They are just too fun to ignore.

1 Like
#62

Ill mostly likely delete all of my chars and make video of it if compensation is garbage.

2 Likes
#63

-Con will give a bonus to hp based on your class. <- they are nerfing stupid full CON Wizz/Cleric compared to Swordie.
-We won’t have the crazy Full STR/INT as 800<- stats won’t get the incremental bonus.
-Dex will become useful for everyone.

Really loving these changes, wishing the best of luck on implementation.

2 Likes
#64

We know this much:[(stat + item) x skill factor] which isn’t a lot but it can give us an idea. If the stat is just the number of stats you have ie 1 STR = 1 PATK, then we’re in trouble. If that number though even is just 2, then STR will become much more viable. Think about investing just 200 STR, that would be 400 + Item then it would be multiplied which would really amplify the effects of STR. DEX offers a somewhat balanced approach, but it looks like you’ll have to build for it gear wise.

1 Like
#65

The amount of people complaining things that are already explained or justified in the original post makes me really sad for this community.

5 Likes