I think Karacha comes out on top but a Superior Kracked Shooter will also provide you almost the exact same increase in dps, you just won’t get that fancy +1 movement speed
Rogue 3 or Rogue1?
well, I think for Rogue3 class you should be using Karacha Set because of backstab skill x3? then if you also have Karacha Xbow + Mana-mana you like to switch when not casting backstab, its ok.
and I think Rogue should be mainly high STR right?
@pozinho_baracat Yes, and those STR are flat added stats which basically it adds +24 phy attack compared to +31 Patk from catacombs and high base attack. well of course it becomes superior vs. large type monsters.
@sudonim7 haven’t really compared using SK Shooter, but damage wise should be better. I also see many archers using SKs in KTos.
Can also be a reduction if the enemy has lightning resists. Lol.
This is incorrect. It loses to SKC at all target defense and critical rate levels and this disparity increases as SKC is refined because it is 1 star higher than Karacha.
Karacha is actually a horrible crossbow because even a Catacombs Shooter will beat it at 60% critical chance. It deals 30.6 average damage more than a Catacombs Shooter if you can maintain 90% critical chance.
The only time a Karacha will beat a Superior Kracked Shooter is when both are unrefined (+0) and you have 100% Critical Chance, point at which the Karacha deals 4.5 more damage.
Consider also that, for the price of 1 Karacha Crossbow, you can get multiple Superior Kracked Shooters and briquette them for +10% Min/Max Attack.
If you’d like proof:
You take Karacha Crossbow only if you are a Rogue and want to make use of the set bonus. For any other archer and in any other scenario, it is actually a damage loss.
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Nice, I always thought sks was better because of its higher star rating base attack, also much cheaper.
Thanks for providing proof!
I trust your excel work since I’m lazy to verify it. haha lol
I also noticed that it is being used by kTOS players.
Just one question, have you tried this personally?
@Dream well i guess we have our answer
Uhhh, yes. I’m one of the first to suggest Superior Kracked Shooter as well on this thread remember? Because I take everything into consideration, not just look at the rarity.
Just that the difference on my build is so minimal that I’m thinking twice whether to get it for that small increase. Another reason to stick with Karacha is because with Sneak Hit, I am able to hit 100% crit chance although not 100% of the time due to positioning its still a deciding factor.
It being a budget weapon actually tips the choice in its favour as well since you can pick up multiple copies to briquette for +10% attack damage. For the price of 1 Karacha on Telsiai, you could Briquette and +10 a Superior Kracked Shooter come to think of it.
Karacha is also worse for Split Arrow because the bounce modifier is t0.
It is actually all things considered, pretty lackluster for your build, especially as refine rate goes up because the base damage increase is going to matter for the Split Arrow setup you’re going to do.
I totally forgot about this, I guess too much factors spinning in my head can be bad at times.
I even considered focusing on just 2H-Bow before because of it’s very high base which is favored by Split Arrow.
But I also cannot disregard the damage output coming from Double Flare which does tons of ticks favoring one-hand + off-hand setups.
P.S. My Karacha was already there even before I planned my Scout C3. My +5 Karacha is a weapon by my Rogue C3, I just passed it via team storage.
Btw, I saw +7/8?GC 2/9 potential that was sold at 5M yesterday with Running Shot Gem [TELS]
At first the seller asked me for 3M, but I didn’t take it (since I want it in Gloves 
) and after a while someone offers a Petamion so he immediately trade it.
I wish I took it but I forgot how hard it is to hunt one, and considering Diddel is RNG based also.
Do you think its worth it? hahaha lol
@Dream I have updated the data to include damage gain for Split Arrow for your perusal. They are single bounce instances. I am confident you will be able to use this to get the values you need for other scenarios (Double Fireball Linked, etc).
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Thanks for this!
Just judging from the raw damage advantage, the winner is already obvious and this chart further proved it.
I was wondering if you can add one more comparison? Lolopanther Bow versus Lolopanther Crossbow. I just want to see the damage difference to see if Lolopanther Xbow + Mana-mana is worth it. The stats of Lolopanther Crossbow is really bad so it seems Lolopanther is the better choice overall.
Negative values favour the crossbow. (Damage difference is Bow - Crossbow+Pistol). Values highlighted in red indicate that the Bow is superior at that critical chance under said circumstances.
If anyone has further enquiries, you can reach me ingame @ Lyralei.
This is considering that all the comparison happened in a single hit with 100% modifier right? It also does not consider the crit rate added by Lolopanther Bow.
It’s hard to judge if it’s just 1 hit with 100% modifier.
Critical Rate is a non-factor because Manamana has 64 Critical Rate (Level 5 Gem in Sub-weapon, more if you sacrifice 1 Critical Attack for level 6).
Lolopanther Bow only has 2 sockets, same as the Crossbow.
If you would like to get the t0 modifier calculations for split arrow, use Damage Average and calculate from there. The Bow’s non-criticals will do 202 more damage than the Crossbow alone. Its Criticals will do 303 damage on Split Arrow bounces.
Easy to see that unless you have quite a high Critical Chance value, the bow will not outperform the +278 damage from Manamana (248 if you consider the Earth Damage disparity) unless of course, you are fighting Earth targets.
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Wait what?! IMC being IMC.
Okay, thanks for all the info.
Yeah, I also noticed that Lolopanther bow lacking of 1 slot, dunno if they will change it or what. Crossbow also sucks because of its attribute, well damage wise its stronger.
But I am totally losing hope for that lolopanther stuffs weapon since I learned that the item that drops it will be after 20F, and kTOS players were stucked at 13F.
So, I am forgetting about it for now. hahaha
Perhaps. Perhaps not. Some weapons like Maledoom have 2 sockets as well even though other staves within its tier have 3.
I may add bows to the spreadsheet tomorrow.
@Dream Do you have a compiled list of relevant Archer abilities and their damage modifiers per instance or were they via your own tests? I am more than happy to give you non-100% single hit modifiers.
Me and EternalDream made our own list before but it actually ended up just quite the same. The game should have the title “Linearity, the game” because almost every skill has 100% modifier per hit/tick that I only had to memorize skills like Flare Shot for not having 100% modifier instead just 90%.
I haven’t done re-tests yet here on OBT though. I’m also curious on your non-100% modifier list.
Bleh, I mistyped that. Apologies as its pretty late.
I meant to say I’m happy to give you tables for your non-100% modifier skills if you can give me a list of archer skills you want a comparison of.
Also I have finished adding relevant end game bows and added a section for crossbows + manamana with 100% single hit instances. I will post it tomorrow after I go through it for errors.