Tree of Savior Forum

kTOS General Thread v2.0

why did this turn out to be about AoE damage, AAR and such?

i’ll just leave my piece here and hope people would agree to it

We usually compute damage by how much damage we do on a single target enemy. But since AoE skills will hit a lot of targets, it will be harder to compute. So basically what i see people doing is computing AoE damage for single target because we are assuming, if it fully hit the other mobs as well, it would do roughly the same damage.

So adding the damage done on the other mob would not state the damage done on a single target but on multiple targets. If an AOE skill will hit 100 but can hit 5 targets, it obviously can deal 500 damage divided to 5 targets but simply saying it does 500 damage (which i think is the argument here) will confuse a lot of people

Lets stick to computing damage done on single targets even if its an AoE skill. We can simply state that the skill is AoE and inform the readers it will hit other targets for this amount of damage instead. Lets not confuse people.

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See now this is interesting because it’s basically a problem of the game being garbage in its design in many areas, which leads certain skills to just be the strongest because they’re optimal for most ingame situations.

Low AoE high damage skills are mostly bad because they only shine against bosses, and world bossing has become all but pointless.

High AoE low/medium damage skills are mostly bad because there are so few high level maps where you encounter large numbers of enemies, it’s mostly just a few big enemies.

So the optimal situation is always to have a medium/high damage skill that can hit several enemies. But this isn’t because these skills are imbalanced, it’s because the game design fell apart after R6.

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Same Player Doppel

Zornhau hits over 550 000

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it hits exactly the damage cap, 149457+117996+110247+177855 = 555555

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Quick question. Anyone knows the new ktest Stat formulas? Like, how much physical attack you get per STR or how much critical damage you get per DEX?

I couldn’t find it. Thank you!

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Thanks a lot! :slight_smile: I’ll check it out!

That’s nice, Swell Left Arm give +974 atk/matk, Right Arm give +614 atk/matk or +559 def/mdef.
However, Swell Brain scale with level still same, +45 at level 5.
I saw that +160 thing, what is that? And is it give 30% Matk as well?

Btw, what’s that costume? looks good

The people struggling with basic math are in the nicest way possible, troubling. Particularly with tangents to other factors (which are still rooted in math) that have been addressed.

It’s been said so many times already that in practice HA has numerous practical problems only for…Troubled posters to return this same understanding as a way to pretend two *2 is not 4.
The strawmans are almost as troubling but if you’re struggling with understanding multiplication it’s not too far-fetched that you leap to odd conclusions.

There was no statement that increasing the number of enemies hit makes a skill unbalanced so why pretend adding AOE ratio to multishot must have that conclusion. Adding AOE ratio to hit more targets increases the damage output of multishot by the additional enemies hit. Output is very basic.
Regardless of enemy defense you have put out X skill factor into the game when you press whatever skill. The defense of an enemy is variable but you know the constant of your SF when you press the skill and how many times that SF is being applied. E.G once because you hit one enemy. Twice because you hit one enemy twice or two enemies once. Four times because you have hit two enemies twice.

For those lost on how such a very, very basic thing went on this long. There was an explanation on how with the split arrow change. It Outputs X% if you spent all 5 charges per CD and this output is greater than the output of Bounce Shot on 6 enemies + TBA on 6.
Sly and others counteres with the loss off skill spam as a style which is very fair while others struggle with math for unknown reasons and go to unnecessary tangents such as 100 health enemies and a 1 damage aoe that hits them all or one 100 date hit. The poster not understanding that they just gave the point of which the ST and Aoe are in line with each other. 100 hits each to kill the group. If you reduce the number of enemies to 99 the single target would kill in 99 hits while the aoe still takes 100 hits and is less efficient. If you put it to 101 enemies then the aoe hitting them all is more efficient while the single target requires 101 hits.

Ideally this addresses as much troubles allies as possible given I am on my phone and you can not only put your mind at rest, but carry on so that basic break-downs of a skill are quickly understood so we can make quicker rebuttal or agreements than the underlying grade school math.

There was one person you gave them an apple. You gave one apple. There are two people and you gave them each an apple, you gave two apples collectively. How full anyone gets is irrelevant to the specific discussion of you giving out two apples.

For why even mention this instead of the ST numbers with the implicit understanding of something being AoE. Split arrow(as well as Oblique) put out different SF on different enemies and as such their SF output had to be collected because the total output is the first shots SF plus the bounce(s)

I never dreamed dropping something so basic would lead on to this much talk.

Lunar FYI. We all know how aoe ratio works with aoe Def and can as such figure out how many enemies will be hit by X aoe ratio into a group with Y amount of aoe Defense. 21 enemies hit is from 21 small enemies (as small enemies have 1 aoe defense) which was also said earlier, had you noticed , to be an impracticality as we don’t get that type of mob layout justifying the charge, CD and SF for everyday uses.

Moving on with my life and anyone who is struggling at this point to understand I am sorry but explaining things I’m this level is tiring, derailing the thread, and mildly annoying. I did not pursue teaching as a career path and I don’t believe I have the patience to hone that ability or the current skill to do so concisely.

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Okay but what if you gave 100 oranges to Blut would he die instantly? Smart guy. Bam, math defeated.

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Blut is clearly a Watermelon kind of demon.

I’m hoping Ktos gets R9 before this balance update hits Itos.
So we can reset with R9 in mind.

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So how’s ktest been so far?

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A rollercoaster of emotions given how many changes they have made.
Armor break doesn’t seem to cause enemy def to lower, at least not by an appreciable level.
Sadhus armor reduction on the other hand was significantly increasing physical damage on Sat, probably still is.

Whew. If I may be blunt that is some serious lesser delusions of grandeur. I’d feel sorry for your students if that’s how you talk to people.

Summary

Who am I kidding, he’s probably just some neet

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You are free to feel that way.

I hope they make armor break percent based then.

I hope these changes don’t imbalance the game breaking it even more and inevitably causing more people to quit. So then the 1000 people left can just call them cry babies helping contributing to the problem. That would a real shame if it happened.

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It might just be bugged tbh or they’ve repurposed it.
Something expected to have a notable effect isn’t, something expected to have a minor effect is having a large one. Things on the same level as that presumed minor effect are having…Minor effects if any at all.

How about Attaque Coquille? I’d love if C1 Fencer would finally work as a filler for my Corsair3 at R8. Need that pistol+rapier.

Heres a video showing the Sadhu thing I’m talking about


Maybe they made the reduction multiplied by attribute level or w/e this time around. Not sure why it’s causing that much more damage.

@SlyGoat

As far as I can see, Attaque Coquille, and Skull Swing’s defense ignoring don’t really do anything or atleast anything easily identifiable. Pommel Beat tested just because why not, and it also doesn’t seem to really amount increase anything.
Level 5 Pommel Beat, Skull Swing, level 1 Thrust, level 1 Attaque Coquille.
Coursing and Monstrance are in the same boat, their reductions don’t really do anything that I can pick up just eyeballing them. I don’t think they’re working.

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