Tree of Savior Forum

I Love Tree of Savior; I Am Leaving Tree of Savior

It surely was not a “generic corporative answer” try reading it again.

He did explain about some of the big issues that a lot of players where complaining about, and that where poorly explained.

He did explain:
Why the servers are so unstable and why they didn’t fix it yet.
Why there is no TP available to purchase.
And why the community manager that a lot of users liked is gone.

my post was just to show that those are explanations worth of getting more attention.

No one said anything about “white knights” and bs alike.
I would suggest you to stop making assumptions without knowing what you are talking about.

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As always with the amazing replys Mister Kim. Keep up the good work , I know its hard and ToS is facing some problems and these DDoS bulshit are things we have to deal here in the west. At least I believe IMC is growing as a company.

Unfortunately, this is a fact. The majority of your issues with the community stem from lack of detailed and problem-oriented responses and reports.
You also fail to consider the socio-psychological consequences - the resulting customer behavior - of your actions. Meaning, firstly, for example, if you do not much more explicitly state that market and shout restrictions

a) are meant to force gold-sellers to pay real money if they wish to deliver and advertise their services,

b) are supposed to attract players to either purchase token or make them play constantly to remain able to pay for those with silvers - thus also increasing the chance of turning them into paying customers -, and

c) are part of the mechanics of the game economy with the intention to prompt players to acquire resources through gameplay rather than mass trading,

then people will come up with their own cynical guesses and rumors.

Secondly, you cannot employ restriction without consideration of the affected incentives to enjoy the game. For instance, megaphones are a good idea, but asking for valuable TP points reduces the use of the shout channel to a zone for traders, party seekers and botting accounts slowly accumulating megaphones.
That, with the addition of a broken party finder, creation mechanics and similarly horrible chat UI, and a lagging client is turning a lot of people into solo players who only pair up during the occasional dungeon runs.

There are many more examples, like the misunderstanding of the beginner and veteran packs you just addressed, the unexplained differences and the unknown synchronization cycles between the Korean and international edition, the lack of pure TP DLCs considering so many have been asking for them and you could push everything else into the in-game store, and so on.
If your approach is to create new characters instead of resetting stats, classes or skills - as in Path of Exile or EVE Online - you need to properly emphasize, explain and eventually discuss such a major decision. Otherwise players will keep getting frustrated about the lack of in-game information and tools to plan out one’s path beforehand.

Make no mistake, others business, small and big, also often fail at customer communication. However, they instead can deliver a working product or otherwise cut off the momentum of rising negative feedback. Following that, they are able to sweep such sometimes costly troubles under the table.

IMC doesn’t have that luxury anymore. Not to mention you don’t need to hire more, just be more transparent and honest about the state of development and timely explain the situation to the community.

For instance, the forum has been filling up with redundant, ill-conceived and erroneous feedback in particular because many people have already submitted most of the bugs, missing features and functions that have to be dealt with first many month ago, especially during the surveys.
Yet, either there has been no reply from IMC what reports or suggestions - even if just partially - have been noted and accepted onto the short-term, mid-term, long-term to-do lists, or you have simply released some non-committal replies and overlooked a lot of the vital feedback.
So people don’t know whether they’re heard, and if, what exactly is being perceived.
To do this you don’t even need to answer every forum topic but regularly post a summary of your conclusions and reasonings everyone could refer to in the future.

Deploying changes without announcements in due time has similarly added onto the train wreck, and finally, you simply have to start to deliver.

For example, you and your colleagues have promised to improve the graphic optimization of the client starting with 1. kCBT for about a year already. Yet, the only solution that in the near term is going to be implemented is extended options to disable various components. In other words, the game still can’t be handled even by high-end machines.
If you aren’t able to deliver but you wish to reduce the increasingly negative community rating both of the game and the staff you will need to come up with alternatives which you also will have to reveal.

Ah, yes, I haven’t even covered the lack of foresight and prepared schedule regarding security, bots, manipulation, client performance, server traffic, etc.

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Nope. Not fixed at all, both my characters are still stuck in different maps.

Thank you for your reply, that means allot

I bet this post took more hours to write than a IMC staff worker actually works on the game for a whole week.

I was so happy that this game was released, so I went out of my way and against my policy against Steam and Google and downloaded Steam, created a Steam account and even created a google mail account to comment on this forum.Now I honestly feel that all this was kind of in vain, considering how badly the game is managed.

I played Ragnarok Online when it started in 2000, and it had lots of bugs, nearly no content and so on, but it was still fun.
But nowadays I’m just lost at how poorly companies are prepared to fight against all the problems that happen ingame. Mainly bots,bugs, server stability issues and so on. Yet you guys still chose to bring this game out on Steam where you have even less control about your own game and who gets to play it.

Bots were already present en mass in the iCBT, but nothing done against them was really effective. Even so, you started the Open Beta without a TPshop and let it become overrun by bots. All you did was ± boast about having created and tested a new program that can deduce from reports if a reported player is a bot or not. The program itself didn’t solve a thing, instead, the same bots roamed the same places I went to for several days;

I feel retarded for even investing my time to try to click the bot and report it (honestly it’s hard to do if the bot runs around and if several bots occupy the same cells but whatever). In the end nothing changed. The only thing that improved over the course of the last week was the FPS-rate, but I honestly don’t care about this anymore, because for no reason, it drops to abysmal numbers again now and then.

After not fixing obvious problems with aiming of skills (not allowing them to be cast) I can’t play with a controller and it vexes me that we cant configurate the controller in any way, meaning that if you don’t use the “right” controller, it’s unplayable (can’t aim magic cast area, can’t aim at Monsters properly, especially hard on Bokors Hexing…).
I should’ve just used my time elsewhere instead of trying, since even Dragon Nest hated my controllers but I believed in you…

Next thing is the overpriced TP-bundles. No way, even if “hell becomes frozen over” I will buy these cash grabbing packages. If you guys need money, either make it subscription-based or sell for reasonable prices. I don’t think that you guys should pull the “racism” trigger and think you can sell us the same things for ± twice the amount people outside of NA and EU have to pay. Either make it equal pricing or I won’t charge even a single cent.
There is no freaking way that a rice peasant is playing the game, so why do we in the “western hemisphere” have to be treated like we are rich folks? Economy nowadays drains us, prices for electricity,gas, health insurance and food rose between 20 and 30% in the last few months and still rising. I ain’t spending money that I need for living comfort on your bad service.

Last but not least the most aggravating thing is that you don’t address any issue that doesn’t concern the provision of service. Your maintainance notices are a joke and people are making a laughing stock out of you (calling you and your game names, betting on the mainainance notices, filling your forums with ranting posts e.g.), yet you don’t even care and communication doesn’t exist in the first place.
As soon as the first private servers open you guys won’t have any costomers left /gg (and you won’t have anyones sympathy for running your business against a wall).

As for me, I even went back to play Dragon Nest although I really hate it(Shanda Cashgrabbers with their P2W equip), because I simply can’t watch this anymore.
Tree of Saviour doesn’t have to be some special, OP, super-uberrated game with xyz unique features, all the players want is to have fun the way the game is concepted. I won’t play as long as I don’t read any real issues addressed and fixed[ and I mean fixed in the way that people won’t address this problem anymore on the forums since I can’t trust you IMC staff] in the patch notices.

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Just want to get my 10 cents in on this.

Everything OP said is very valid and it is very difficult to keep being patient when it feels our concerns are being ignored. It’s not about getting issues fixed immediately, but instead addressing the issue ahead of time so that we know that they will be fixed. Setting proper expectations with us will also put a bit of heat on you guys to act which in turns shows some dedication.

I’ve also bought every single pack that has come out with over 450 hours. I work full time and in every hour I get I play Tree of Savior. I love this game and I know that this game can succeed but it’s going to take time. Don’t forget the developer IMC is working in multiple regions and has to go through their vendors Nexon/Steam for stuff as well, there’s probably alot more in the background that we aren’t aware of.

Again thank you for the acknowledgement, I think that’ll help alot more people understand what’s going on and hopefully some will stay and wait patiently.


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Bla! You live!

But in any case relevant to @hkkim, we love the game. Otherwise we’d ditch the game without a moment’s notice. But that’s why we want to see the welfare of the game actually be managed.

We want to see if things are possible, how long they may take, or even just discussions of the future entirely. The Transparency helped quell the rage in this thread; Magnify it. Talk about what may happen/what is happening/when kToS updates may be ready to be released after every patch note. We don’t want to be in the dark, especially when you guys have the power to illuminate the world and give a product everyone understands mutually. We know the game’s world is on the brink of destruction, but your company doesn’t need to be either.

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The sad thing is, I know a few PS owners that would probably put in more effort running, fixing, and balancing this game than what’s present here :<

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Just read “blablablas”

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Thank you so much. You gave us the light of Hope in this big dark world.

you have only but scratched the surface of the ice

Thanks for the reply. This game is amazing and we will continue to support you!

So Tru. This man is the hardest working man I’ve noticed in the gaming industry and hard work pays off. Continue to support

I read this whole post over through and through. What amazes me is the fact you still stick to your guns on everything you’ve done that is problematic to people while fixing absolutely nothing. Biggest example is selling TP through DLC packs instead of the ability to just straight up buy it off your website in intervals of 10-100-1000-ect. like other games. I’ve seen the smallest of companies like KRU do it and this one can’t?

Trying to convince me you do not reject communication after ignoring beta testers ontop of the CM leaving or being fired is flat out lies and denies. I have yet to ever see a single GM in game at any point through my months of playing this game do anything. There’s posts of people saying their tickets have never been answered on things like your regional locking for the DLC packs resulting in a complete failure because they are dictated by server played. You’re not fooling anyone coming out and making a statement like this although I do appreciate it.


Actions speak louder than words and this company has put out almost 0 new content that you said would be different from kTOS in the last response since iCBT2. Instead you’ve made these packs and everything that people put blind faith into thinking is going to fix lag or anything. You’re prolly getting DDoS because people are mad if that’s even true, but I almost feel personally it’s a cover up for your bad coding.

I’ll take some time to bring up the history of what happened when Aegis got leaked and found out half the problem was on your end and not Gravity’s servers so much. At this point we are almost heading down the same road with the game’s community going to private servers because of your actions and not some mystery DDoS person or RMT. If you don’t stop being bull headed on all your bad coding and changes people don’t like it’s only going to continue getting worse.

P.S - Nobody is going to like your 8 hour limit on world boss box opening from kTOS, so I hope you’ve got a better solution.

@hkkim

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So true.

I spent more than $100 on the game, full of hope and nostalgia… and because I trusted Staff_Julie to be our advocate.

But whatever they say IMC don’t care, they just want to rape our wallets.

I’m so sad and disappointed :sob:

Please get your PR to give us updates on the state of the game the same way they drafted this, they seem to be able to articulate well. Stop hiding the shortfalls we all already know and be more transparent.

Thanks for the reply, it gives us hope.

Here’s what wrong with the trade system.
You give free players one trade slot on auction house and you give free megaphone to them as well- these are the exact things the gold sellers needs.

What I suggest doing is :

  • Free players (Player without a token) can’t put items on auction house
  • Free players do not have access to megaphone / yell
  • Free players can’t trade gold in 1:1
  • Free players can trade items 1:1 and purchase items on auction house.
    Then you’d have to make sure there are no items worth thousands of golds that can be easily farmed.
    That’s how it works in another MMO I won’t name here, and it works well.
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Great idea. Why don’t we also separate female and male players into their own servers because they are of different genders. Once they change genders IMC should allow them basic human rights.

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I bet he’s filled with bad memories though when even the tiniest mention of “that certain old-school game” is being brought up. If I had known he actually looked around in the forums I’d have not mentioned that game out of respect.

But the fact remains the game we have now has even worse coding. Am I the only who doesn’t like going to town because it’s crowded? Because that’s not normal. In MMO’s people should be happy the place is crowded because you can meet new people, hang out, etc, but right now my mindset is “O deive I need to switch to a lesser channel or else my framerate’s gonna make the game crash” instead of “cool more people” Even people who want to do card battles in town probably can’t because the lesser channels have less people, even lesser who cared about the card games.

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