Tree of Savior Forum

Here's what you could contribute to stop this stupid system

Nor I want to. Like I said, this is what I do:

I simply post facts with source against certain claims.

I’ve been playing this game since iCBT2, korean servers, iOBT up to now. It grants me a good view on all the issues that happened since I never actually stopped playing but took some breaks here and there.

So, with experience and source I simply ask you:
-> Our claims are conflicting. I have first-hand experience on what happened and sources that serves as proof for what I saw.

-> You have nothing to reaffirm your claims, yet, you try to discard mine as if me, everyone else who was there and the fact as something wrong, that only your opinion is right against all of that.

So, if the user isn’t actually trolling when this classical type of case happens, valuing his opinion of something over an entire fact and all the witness and trying to press his negative opinion unto others as if it was the truth.

What is he doing?

tbh all these discussions can be just summarized into

people complaining tend to link their complaints to doomsaying, which isn’t really helping if they want the game to flourish.

it is a given that such statements will attract people who would say otherwise.

there’s always a constructive way to criticize stuff.

and childish extremism followed with non first hand quasi-legit evidence isn’t one of them.

i seem to notice that a lot of people here think that low tier critiques is doing more help than damage

cultural difference should also be taken into consideration. while a lot of people share the same opinion on how they perceive lunarrabbit’s responses.

i think it’s just that people are reading it in a western mindset since the requirement to use the english language suggests that everyone can comprehend western contexts, which is not.

thus making him look like he’s antagonizing people. of course, one misunderstood offense leads to another

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Clearly there is something wrong with the game if so many people on the forums and Reddit are dissatisfied with IMC’s handling of the international servers. I participated in enough MMO communities to know where this is going. You listing “facts and statistics” on the population, no matter how true or untrue isn’t going to change the way the majority of vocal player base feels about the game. People are unhappy. People don’t trust IMC. If players continue to feel like this we won’t have any players left at all.

The fact is when people login, the game feels like a wasteland. Unless you play during peak hours, you aren’t going to find a dungeon or Saalus party. Most people you find in game are AFK or are shops. No matter how many players we actually have, a majority of them aren’t playing the game for very long or at all. At one point I only logged in for the attendance rewards, now I don’t bother at all. How valuable are players that only log in to do a few dailies and logout versus players who actively participate in a game’s meaningful content? iTOS mostly has the former which is why many players feel like the game is dead.

No matter how accurate or inaccurate steam charts correlate to the actual population of the game, you can at least acknowledge that from this chart players are declining as the months go on. Eventually those players who only log in for dailies won’t bother logging it at all. That’s the point we reached here in iTOS.

You can defend IMC all you want but the fact is that they are constantly putting up walls behind players through restrictions whether it be through content or the simple luxury of buying TP items without having to participate in a stupid gambling system. Normally when people complain this much I think it’s silly, but everything IMC is doing warrants all posts and negative opinions. All these factors contribute to why people aren’t staying logged in or aren’t logging in at all.

Every time someone has the tiniest negative opinion on the game or IMC you come hopping along trying to argue that they shouldn’t feel a certain way with a bunch of useless meaningless facts that no one cares about. You’re trying to rationalize and coach people to feel a certain way based on paper facts and call them a troll when they don’t give a rats ass about what you have to say. You can scream how alive the game is all you want, when a player logs into the game, they aren’t getting the MMO experience that TOS offered years ago. The game is in decline, and you’re in denial.

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Inb4 40k players, back and forth the same crap, thread locked.

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uhm… you’re trying to sound intelligent by using technical jargon and cultural technicalities, but instead it makes you look ignorant because you clearly have no idea what you’re talking about… try again.

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I’ll just post a chart since your last paragraph shows it’s a doompost:

We’re still near 40k unique players in last 2 weeks with 3 days drop but no definitive drop yet to ~35k. Let’s wait until the next weekend for more information.

As for the other things about your post, I’m not going to answer each thing because when confronted with information you know you’re wrong you discard what we said just like here:

And here:

It’s not worth my time to talk to a wall, there’s enough posts on the thread already if you want to know why we still have a good amount of players and how ToS nature affects CCU.

Talking about that, seems you only know how to read CCU values, if you need help to understand the Players in Last 2 weeks I can draw or something, just let me know if you need.

I don’t think Lunar has ever said or tried to tell people how they should feel.

Also when people exaggarate on negative aspects it does have an effect or it might be a lie and I see nothing wrong with correcting that.

I might not agree with the extent Lunar pushes the statistics for population but I see nothing inherently wrong and it really does tell a lot more than what CCU does for those who haven’t heard of it before.

Lunar also has never denied ToS having a lot of problems and isn’t defending IMC on everything or even being delusional.

It’s just mainly angry people venting getting more angry at someone correcting them for something they said wrong.

Also the same could be said to a lot of critiques. Who gives a crap about people bashing and swearing and not being able to form a constructive argument? No one. Exaggerations make people also look stupid or overly dramatic.

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Also, @Expiredmilk, I noticed you have a common thing with other trolls: You try to hide your in-game name with decent effort.

I dunno why is that but from what server are you playing from? Seems you’re playing from one of the known least populated server to never find queues?

Because I play in Klaipeda and actually doesn’t have some problems you’re talking about. lol

speeking of ignoruns, i aktually typ leik dis. ees jas dat i wus warned abuwt eet dat iyam nao rekwired tu typ leik nermulle

which often ends up sounding artificial, if not robotic.

it will also help if you can point out where and how are my statements are wrong

instead of simply saying that i do not know what i’m saying and suggest that i try the same manner without corrections.

that is how people describe as insanity

am nut tryna be intelijunt, but due tu peeps kennat understande dis typ of typing, ees harde fer mi tu talk inna moar naturalle wei

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Proving my point. When people disagree with you, you automatically get defensive and start calling them doom posters and trolls. Don’t pop a vein over this.

:haha:

How does anyone “hide” their IGN on these forums when it’s not visibly present anywhere. That’s like me walking up to a stranger on the street and telling them they’re hiding their ID because it was inside their pocket instead of taped on their forehead. Is there supposed to be a place I input my IGN on these forums? Should I sign off my IGN after every post? Do you really want to know that badly? I don’t know anyone’s IGN on these forums and quite frankly I don’t care. You’re so paranoid :joy:

You think it’s dumb that people exaggerate on these forums, but I for one find it funny. Do you get triggered every time someone in real life says a hyperbole? That’s a little ridiculous don’t you think? I think it’s stupider when people get offended that not everyone on these forums want to bend over and get on their knees for IMC like LunarRabbit does.

Usually people are joking and people like LunarRabbit and nojustnotos take it up the butt and get extremely offended over a joke about IMC. Look, he’s still butt hurt and offended over the last thread that he dug it up to post here. so sad.

:distinguished:

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So, you actually didn’t say your server over that.

Let’s move on to the 2nd step of my arguing:
If you have X problem on your server but Y server doesn’t. You complain about your server, not about all servers.

As someone in a semi-break on Klaipeda I’ve been logging in at pretty random morning, night, noon. All times I could do Saalus and dg300 when I queued.

What level of dungeons do you actually have problems to find queues? What server are you playing that you actually have problems to do Saalus runs if there’s party invites on shout thru all the day plus the queue runs?

I’m not sure why you’re hiding your server but I could assume you’re not even playing the game and just complaining on forums.

Why is it so hard for you to give details about what you’re complaining about?

Is that fear of being caught lying? Is this why you’re going to ignore my question of details about your complaint again?

well, i can’t blame them for being paranoid about doomposting

just look at how people would respond on my comment in a rant thread

i was like, whoa there, i know where this is going O__o

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Is this some kind of interrogation? A crime drama? What if he tells you he plays on Klai too? You are just going to say he’s lying.

But no, LunarRabbit never forces people to conform. LunarRabbit is always right, he merely “corrects” overly-angry people who are angry for nothing at all. He merely tries to dispel lies*

* lies are things which aren’t considered true by LunarRabbit

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Person: Claims X and complains about it.

Me -> Wait, calm down, X isn’t actually like that o.o can you explain what exactly do you mean and why are you complaining?

Person: Avoids question.

If you know what you’re talking about it isn’t hard to explain what you mean, right?

i am not trying to get involved in this thread. but i saw your post and you were trying way too hard to sound smarter than you actually are by using irrelevant terms so i called you out on it. so now you’re trying to play the stupid dumb funny guy because you were caught with your nonsensical post. i literally just started using the forums and already from today I can tell you literally contribute nothing in threads other than trying too hard to be funny or sound smart and when people reply to you because of that, you get all shy about it. if you stop trying so hard maybe people wouldn’t have to call you out on your posts.

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Oh my god, I just can’t believe what I’m seeing.
Lunar… I think that thread needs you

Please Lunar, go call the Impetus GM a troll and a doomposter. Also, he’s wrong about the 20k number, it’s akshully 40k.

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Done c: Happy? Now can we focus in this thread?

Or are you going to keep avoiding all my posts? :v


On a side note: Why are new forum uses popping out of nowhere and liking other troll posts? Are banned people actually making alts now?

That would explain some things…

You are not just discussing stuff. You are getting worked up over even slightly negative things about the game and IMC.

If somebody says “It’s getting a bit lonely here. The queues are hard to find” you might say something like “Weird, I’m on Klai and the queues are fine. What server are you on?” and then whatever happens happens and you leave it at it. Even if the guy doesn’t reply or even if he says he’s also playing on Klai, it would still be fine.

But you can’t just stop at that. You’ll have to call him out. If he doesn’t reply then he’s hiding his identity because he has something to hide and therefore he’s a liar. If he says he’s on Klai too then you’ll call him a liar because you are on Klai too and you don’t think queues are an issue.

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I mean I don’t mind all of it. And the issue is that not all of it are hyperboles a lot of people tend to state their exaggerations as facts. If they were making it clear to not take them seriously I wouldn’t care really.
I don’t mind those who actually make jokes especially if they are actually funny. I’m also not offended or triggered by anything really just some stuff is really cringy sometimes. I mean I don’t condone everything Lunar does either but the both sides of it are pretty much the same for a lot of people. I think Lunar knows that and does it intentionally to some point just to aggravate the other poster.

A good example is the jokes made on Lunar which are based under the assumption that he is defending IMC on everything etc. Which simply just is not true. But I don’t really care about that either if people want to make jokes based on false assumptions then so be it. (It was a good example to mention tho.)

Also I really wish it was usually just people joking but that’s also just not true. I admit that Lunar might miss some jokes but that’s probably due to language barrier.

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Sorry but I’m not getting worked up. I’m just asking you this:

Person: Claims X and complains about it.

Me -> Wait, calm down, X isn’t actually like that o.o can you explain what exactly do you mean and why are you complaining?

Person: Avoids question.


If you know what you’re talking about (or isn’t lying) it isn’t hard to explain what you mean, right? Why do you need to avoid being questioned about your argument? Are you taking it personally? Are you getting offended by people asking you to elaborate what you said a little more?

Sorry but if you’re not going to elaborate your argument then you just don’t claim something. If you claim something that’s missing important info, it’s only natural people are going to ask about it.