Tree of Savior Forum

Cubes from Dungeons: Problematic System

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#1

Edit: With a little more time on hand I can structure it a bit better:

Two Problems:

  1. If you keep rolling on every cube right now the AH will hold too much of your money.

On hunting days I roll for 2-3 mil per day, in the rare case I get something the AH gobbles up millions that come two full days after selling.

I can only do this because of the pardoner class. Talking to non-crafters they struggle hard to even roll at all.

Bottom line is that it is actually a silver loss to roll on any cube over waiting and buying it from the market.

You can do the math for it, but the bottom line will stand.

  1. Trying to loot a specific item doesn’t work in dungeons. Closing in on 20 runs on the 190 dungeon with full rolling. Still didn’t get the item I wanted and it halted my progression. I want an item for my team to pass it around and I already abandoned the item I wanted out of the 175 dungeon for progressions sake.

I don’t have anything against a grinder, but on smaller markets like femidian it becomes problematic. It is typical for people to go 5+ days without any form of loot while rolling and that makes dungeons simply boring as ■■■■.

Equipment is an important pillar for your sense of progression. When you breached level 200 days ago and still run around in the same gear for roughly 100 levels… you get the point.

For non-token players or newer players without silver it will be even worse.

I am closing in on 20 runs with complete rolling so I am making 3 runs out of 1. That means playing without rolling after 60 days I would still have dipshit.

Edit: Since this will pop up anyway:
How to roll 2-3 mil per day
190 dungeon = 12x 60k (2 boss cubes at 60k per reroll) = 720k
Later worldbosses = 100k per reroll. Kill a couple of those and reroll and silver going for rolling hits the fan quickly.

Updated Statistics so I can provide you guys an outlet:

I have run the 190 dungeon for 41 or 44 times now. I rolled everytime so I simulated doing the dungeon straight for 41*3 days or in other words: 120ish days everyday 3 times.

The item I seek was still not there - if that alone doesn’t convince you that this is a poor game design even for a grinder, then I don’t know what to say. Remember that things 240 and upwards CANNOT be traded. So saying buy XYZ might be okay for lower stuff, but for higher stuff you will run into exactly this problem on every char.

3 Likes
Final Verdict: IMC most of your design decisions are so bad that you can only laugh
#2

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

#3

TL;DR:

“I’m gambling inna casino and I lost, therefore the casino needs to compensate.”

You should probably just save all that Silver and wait for a decent sale on Auction for w.e item you want. If you still want to grind/work for it then get ready to keep running into walls.

3 Likes
#4

I have gone 10-20 days into a dungeon and have no item to show for it. I am around level 200 and cannot afford to roll for 2-3mil per day on a whim.

I do not think the price per roll should be reduced.

It is as high as it is as a money sink, and if you can actually afford it - then we need more money sinks.

1 Like
#5

Only reason I can afford it is pardoner.

So I made e.g. a mil a day as pardoner to roll one day in 190 dungeon.

That means 1 mil silver (more actually) is already destroyed via pardoner tax, then you have 12x 60k destroyed, then finally you are losing 10-30% on the final product.

#6

Nah but when I am in a hurry I don’t have time to condense so you can say because I was in a hurry it grew larger :smiley:

1 Like
#7

3 runs = 3 cubes.

token users can get additional roll on cube = 3 total rolls including 2 paid per cube.

so we have 9 rolls of which only 6 are paid.

6 < 12

.#Math.

#8

190 = 2 boss cubes. .#rekt.

#9

and whatever you need drops only from one of them
.#rekt

You have a choice to spend silver for an additional chance, you have chosen to do so and yet you complain thats its too pricey.

#10

Well, re-rolling cubes would make sense if the game had good loot tables and you could re-roll a nice, but sub-optimal drop into something your character needs more. Spending 60k to see a Talt reroll into yet another Talt 99 times out of 100 is NOT fun.

#11

It is difficult calling that “choosing”.

If I don’t roll I need 3 times the amount of runs, which even with rolling could already be in the 100s.

So yeah I am sorry that I roll instead of doing the 190 for a year straight, clearly this is on me and not a bad design choice that could be improved right?

Now let us be clear: You got humiliated and are now arguing for the sake of it.

#12

in what way? I like to think about myself as open minded person and i will admit that i’m wrong if proven so. You havent.

You could save silver to buy recipe you want if/when it appears on market instead of gambling. Or you could spend invest those silvers for something lasting like attributes.

#13

There is no defending the current drop system because they reduced the amount of dungeon runs from 5 to 2. I don’t even know what the normal limit to cubes use either is, but the chance are that you yourself find anything worthwhile from a dungeon is 0.

If you put the effort into doing a dungeon, you should be rewarded. At the moment, if there’s something you need, its better to just buy it than to work the dungeon and get it yourself.

Don’t you think that’s completely backwards?

#14

Yah. It good EXP. Loot is a side effect.[quote=“Xenobius_2, post:10, topic:201853, full:true”]
Well, re-rolling cubes would make sense if the game had good loot tables and you could re-roll a nice, but sub-optimal drop into something your character needs more. Spending 60k to see a Talt reroll into yet another Talt 99 times out of 100 is NOT fun.
[/quote]

This is the real problem. Cube needs more loot thats between Talt and Meme Dagger.

#15

Lol reroll for junks

#16

I cant buy it on the market - not every server is as big as Klaipeda. Venom wasn’t on the market everytime I checked or I would have bought it.

Karacha isn’t even dropping there, but all this doesn’t matter. Rolling should be a NETGAIN not a NETLOSS. You can only do dungeons 2-3 times per day - it should be something to look forward to.

There are things you cant even trade that drop there, am I supposed to buy these from the market too?

There is nothing wrong with me going longer into the dungeon, but everything should have a limit. I am not saying there should be items spewing out of it, but as it stands.

What are you saying to the guy that goes into the 190 that cannot afford to roll nor afford to buy the item and comes out empty after 2 months? Go grind money and buy it?

So Mr. Open minded take this to heart: Not all items that drop are tradeable, not everyone would be able to afford items from the market and there are 2 cubes that drop there so 6 < 12 is wrong.

#17

I get 10% per dungeon run. Good xp right there.

#18

Except its not. EXP should the side effect. You don’t get much after the first few runs. What you want is the gear. Its fine to have one or two rare exclusive pieces, but there needs to be more common rewards whether they be even just blues, that are more common and useful.

On the whole, talt is useless for 99% of players. They try to find use for talt by using it as a form of tradable currency, but the current trade system shouldn’t even be in place anyway, problems stacked upon problems.

#19

Eh fine. That’s not the cube system’s problem though. Its just the drops are poo.

#20

How are the drops poo? They are good, if you get them. Sure you don’t need everything yourself but except talt/card you can use everything. Even if it is just trading your recipe against another one.