No class resets.
Drastically raise mob EXP instead.
That keeps things fair. It allows you to screw up your characters and late game it’ll still be insanely hard to level, but it a) allows you to grind, b) stops the game becoming tedious when you play alts due to having to replay every quest and re-get 100% map completion, and c) lets you try out different classes without screwing up your class being so awful that you’ll ragequit the game.
I wouldn’t really worry about that kind of class change function being implemented here.
Most class change functions of MMORPG’s don’t let you change base classes at all, only changes from the advanced classes from the base are allowed. Having to change from one base class to the next would most likely ruin a lot of stuff and cause bugs/exploits due to equipment restrictions, base class attributes, etc.
You forget that in this game, when you start over, you almost really start over. No way to transfer silver from your dead character, some items might be class restricted, you don’t get to keep hidden quests that you have completed, and a bunch of untradeable stuff like monster gems or cards and certain equipment like Ledas shield will stay rotting in that character forever.
You may think it’s not tedious to go through each map and 100% them over and over, doing all side quests along the way, but it really is.
And again, your character is just there. Staring at you, providing no use for you except just be a candidate for deletion. And you then remember all the fun you had with it like quests and meeting people and other aesthetic feats, and all because of a few mistakes you’ve made that lead your class to either be bad or useless in the late game, you’re just forced to abandon it for a class that would fit more for your style or would be decent at late game.
You also then remember one important thing you’ve spent on that character - your precious time and effort over the weeks just working on him/her. Imagine if you could’ve instead used that time you have invested in that character doing more productive things like watching a couple of movies, practicing a sport, learning a new hobby, going on social activities, spending some overtime work for more money, or even just doing in-game things like farming for materials or boss hunting. All that time and effort just goes to waste because you’ve made a silly mistake or that “you haven’t researched enough” as if this game was some science experiment or something.
We shouldn’t forget that this is a game, not a lifestyle or career. Doing mistakes in life and learning from them should only really be a part of real life events and scenarios, not in games where the goal is to have fun.
A controlled circle reset system avoids letting all the time and effort you’ve invested in the character you have raised go to waste, while making sure certain builds cannot be completely abandoned or replaced by trending builds. Simply enough, they can do things like a singular circle reset at a time, or limited single reset per character, or just extremely high costs so that even those who have been able to create a strong build would feel rewarded that they didn’t have to go through the painstaking process of circle resetting, which will depend on how IMC would want to implement it. Nothing is unfair from a reset because it’s what it is; a reset. They are not adding anything to that reset, it just fixes a mistake for your convenience.
If I were to complain of something P2W, I would look more at things that simply give a very big advantage versus players who don’t spend money, like Enchant Scrolls. I mean, giving up to three additional property attacks from a cash item seems pretty broken to me, but I guess the stats from those do fall off late game.
Could people please stop talking about “needing” a class reset because they “screwed up” their build and start telling it like it is ? They’ve become bored with the class they play and want an easy way to try out another class without actually investing more time into the game.
On other games you have to live with your choices and this game is no different. Especially since it takes like 2 weeks to reach max level and even less time to reach a level where you can figure out if you want to keep playing your class or not.
2 weeks to reach max level
I suppose we’re not playing the same game?
And is that like, 24/7 playing? The first level 280 characters in the game just appeared only around a week ago, and it’s been around a month since launch. Now what if people have jobs or other responsibilities, and they can only play a couple of hours a day? They would take months to get to max level.
And no, since base class resets will not happen (no MMORPG’s with reset systems allow you to change base classes, because base classes have multiple restrictions and playstyles that are different between the others), there wouldn’t be any need to worry about people doing like, say, playing a Cleric class for easy leveling, then going Swordsman at max level. The only thing you would see are just people changing circles within their class tree to something that they would appreciate more.
on other games you have to live with your choices
I need an example on that one. I assume you’ll say RO but you know what happened, they added skill and stat resets on that game eventually. And at least on that game it didn’t take too long to level. And no, old RO is not modern MMORPG, stop trying to think that’s the basis for what MMORPG’s would be. Old RO was what it was - being one of the earlier MMORPG’s available, there were nothing else to compare it to at that time. But if it did not exist before and something like that game would be released in our time, it would be dead in no time.
It’s not an easy way out, you would have to do something or pay something to be able to change circles. While richer people might think it’s an easy way out, ordinary people are given at least a second chance to make it right for their character, and would have to spend hard earned money for it, or do something to attain it. Even then, with a controlled circle reset system, they will still have to deal with certain consequences that may come along with it. It’s a much better tradeoff than starting off from scratch, especially in a game where you can’t transfer almost everything from each of your characters.
Could people please stop talking about “needing” a class reset because they “screwed up” their build and start telling it like it is ?
Oh, you will be surprised. I’m assuming you’re not beyond level 240 yet so you’re assuming people don’t need a reset. You will later learn that some builds shine while a whole lot of other builds will just flop later on. When that happens, it’s usually too late to even consider rerolling unless you’re willing to put a month of your invested time to waste.
There should be the option to change class when there are huge revamps made / new classes added.
Circle reset vote +1
Cash item pls!
Minus the stat reset I agree with you, I should probably have worded it clearer. I want the EXP rates to rise so you DON’T have to redo map completion… I’d rather get great exp from grinding mobs than doing every map over and over on each character.
IMO it would be better if map completion gave you EXP cards but maybe something else, like components for crafting one of multiple available items (like, say, precursors in GW2… once you have the Gift of Exploration it’s up to you what you use it for). That way if you want to craft more than one you can always complete the maps on another character, but it never becomes something NECESSARY, and that way it stops a lot of the tedium of raising new characters.
I really can’t imagine re-questing on my alts, given all of the nights I’ve spent mindlessly progressing whilst listening to music from another window.
I would honestly just have it so that you gain automatic 100% map completion when you have completed it on another character before, while making sure to give the Wings of Vibora reward so long as you enter the map the first time. To prevent people from abusing going to high level maps and getting exp cards there at a very early level, I suppose they can add a restriction so that entering only previously completed maps at your level would only give rewards.
Quests can just be redone if needed. Honestly, running around the map trying to get every edge wastes a lot more time than most people think. And after a while you can forget certain map structures and you might mistakenly go on a long route and have to go back the other way again due to a missed quest or etc. I’m running an alt character right now and I’ve forgotten some of the maps in the game already.
I can’t recommend a circle reset.
They do… I assume you haven’t gotten to a higher level yet. Most clerics who did not take C2 Cleric get screwed over most of the time, as they will not be able to keep up with healing allies at higher levels due to extremely high HP pools. I’m not sure about other classes, but I assume people have the tendency to do things like experiment what might have looked good on paper initially but after testing it out, it did not result in something favorable or what they expected.
It still is a choice. Note that, when it’s late game, you are NOT given a choice to stick through with unorthodox builds without being discriminated or just be generally useless late game. If the game was designed to cater to all classes for endgame content, then a circle reset may not be warranted, but it’s not, certain roles are absolutely mandatory in endgame content like Earth Tower… That’s why circle reset is needed, albeit controlled at a point where it cannot be abused.
It will depend on how it would be implemented; it could be something to work for or something really expensive, or something with limits or multiple restrictions. Also there is no such thing as completely redoing a whole character because there is no stat reset available (well, at least after Founder’s Pack ends anyways).
What’s so hard about it? You buy some sort of item, use it, and the advancement interface pops up and you can re-select the circle you’ve taken from a previous rank and change it to something else - the interface and UI is already there and all they have to do is to modify it a little to fit the circle re-selection process. Not reimbursing the skill attributes you’ve invested can also be a nice consequence for having to use a reset. And what developer would not want to do this when it can be a source of profit for them? It may not be enjoyable for us, but it will be for them when they start raking in the money.
Most of these ppl doesn’t even reached lv 200, you can’t take then seriously.
They need get gud.
Circles reset will happen, you can be sure of it. It’s just a matter of when it’ll happen, the game is not even released and once they nerf one of the “popular” builds everyone will cry for it.
And those who are against it arguing they researched for hours before creating a build will be the first ones to beg for it once their “godly” build gets nerfed.
Not having resets is fine on a polished game that hardly makes any change to classes, not on a game that has not been released which is gonna change stuff often and add more ranks/classes in a “short” period of time.
I can see both sides of the argument really.
Your skill build is what makes your character your character. It’s done the way you chose, and your choices have meaning because they are permanent.
While some people say that rerolling(new char) is not fun and will make people quit, you should just be able to change… this is like saying in another MMO, say, blade and soul, that you made a lvl 55 blade dancer, and then find out you prefer a wizard. So you juts magically ‘‘change your class’’ to wizard. That makes no sense, and should not be allowed. In this game, the class system is slightly difference, but the same thought for me still applies: being able to change all your skill circles would be like changing the entire character without putting any work in, and I don’t like it.
HOWEVER, I do feel that when a large patch shows up containing new circles, in some cases, it is unfair for players that had their build alligned for a previous patch, and can no longer work in the new circles properly and would have to start over. Especialy since new, future classes are not yet known, certainly not in detail, so it would be impossible to prepare for them.
That being said, my suggestion would be to present every player with a 1-time opportunity to change some, or all of their circles, upon the arrival of new classes / new circles. I would probably still not want a full reset in this case, but maybe 2 or 3 ‘‘circle resetters’’ so you can swap in or out a few of your choices for new ones to adjust to the new patch. Rather than 100% changing your ENTIRE class.
Similarly, a system where you buy a token, to start a long and hard questline to reset ONE of your circles, I would be fine with (without any big patch appearing). It would have to take a signifant amount of time, but not quite as long as remaking a character. But don’t make it something trivial. Choices are choices for a reason, they should have a lasting effect, so if you want to change them, you’d have to put in work & money. Would strongly suggest it is done PER CIRCLE as well, rather than a full skill reset which comes with (already mentioend in plenty of posts) problems.
my 2c
There’s a good way to do this easily, have an item that resets you to level 1 and resets your quests but keeps all your gear. Then give a large amount of team exp based on your class level. You get a class reset, leveling gets a little easier, but you still have put in the work to reach your goal.
This would also incidently increase the life of the game and allow for more exp tomes to be sold.
Circles are basically your “advanced” classes from your base class. Changing from base class to another base class is not done in most MMORPG’s, you are typically only given the option to change the advanced class/es you took. Nobody is really complaining about not being able to change to another class, but rather that a circle they have chosen might have likely screwed up their build and the lack of the circle they should have taken instead just hinders the appeal of their character altogether.
If you look at it some way, base classes still provide the core element of a character in-game, while circles simply give them unique kits that further improve the base class. For example, Clerics are usually sought after as general healers and buffers, Cleric staple is still Heal and buffing is his/her specialty; the devs made sure to make it so by giving his/her early ranking classes have buffs to provide, and even additional healing for some.
IMO circles are just add-ons for the base character to shape up your role, but you still have your core role that you will provide in a given team.
If anything, full circle reset is probably too much, so they can make it that you can only reset one or two circles per character. And again, changing base class is highly unlikely to happen and it’s not what everyone is suggesting here.
That’s a really bad idea, and you’re complicating things with that kind of system. You might as well reroll then. The largest investment you can provide in a character is time anyway, and quests and leveling take up most of that time.
They could simply just sell an item from the TP shop or something, especially since most people requiring circle resets are those who might have taken a wrong turn along the road and wish to change one or two circles into another; if people want to change just those few circles, it shouldn’t be so punishing to the player that you would have to make them redo everything again. It’s what almost every F2P MMORPG does; sell a reset/class change item in the shop, simple as that. But if you guys feel it is too “unfair” then add a bit of restrictions to it.
A rebirth system should be more relevant to current game mechanics than have it be a requirement for the sake of convenience.
I never suggest that they should or will allow the resetting of base classes… if so you misread/misunderstood what I was saying. I also disagree with your statement that ‘‘the rest is just addons’’… In fact, in this game, every circle is equal; your first choice only matters in that it determines what other circles become available to you as you level up.
The fact that 1 or 2 skills of your first circle might still be used at higher level is a given, as I said, they are equal in many ways, or supportive of one another. Point still is is that the other 6 circles (apart from your main) are far FAR more than just some ‘specialisation’ of your main class. They change your playstyle, equipment and even stat requirements completely.
Regardless of that, I think we both came to the same conclusion. If anything, only a few circles should be allowed to change, and I would add to that that it shouldn’t be simply buy + click, but should involve a questline of sorts as well.
This type of mechanic has worked very well for DDO, so I’ve seen it in action and keep it mind it takes quite a bit longer to reach end game there then it does here. It’s not even ftp yet and there’s plenty of R7’s. You underestimate how much people will go through to get an advantage, especially if team level ever ends up being more then just an xp bonus.
This mechanic would give players the ability to change classes while giving IMC some additional revenue to improve the game, and it does this without allowing for players to switch to the FOTM class at a moments notice.
On the 1 hand, I’m not against circle resets primarily because of the lack of information available to actually do research. On the other it is in direct conflict with the lodge xp system they already have.
If 1 lodge lv = 1% more xp gained and lodges lv can reach 50, I assume you can get 49% more xp on alts making it less difficult to reroll. I’ve already rerolled because I’ve reached the goal of making a merchant and it wasn’t actually that hard/annoying to do.
Give us tools as in depth as RateMyServer was for RO and we can do without resets.