Bro who the f cares about lower level maps? The bot thing is a non-problem.
They need a lot of time to level up, play bad as ■■■■ and a single ban lags them behind by a whole ■■■■■■■ lot.
If anything they may farm stuff no one actually sane wants to farm, every single game has bots.
Actually you are lucky that since TOS is not that profitable the bots are not that developed and have meme pathing and broken coding.
The “bots” excuse is literally the same thing as waking up, not doing anything, and crying that there’s rich people in the world.
You are not playing the game so don’t dare talking to me about it.
Grinding games are grinding games, you set a goal, you reach it, you go to the next goal. IMC trolled us long time for the first year by not letting us do that, i get it, that’s not the case anymore.
You have also a distorted vision of what ragnarok was, probably because you played on a private server.
Many people have fun just levelling characters, we did 12 hours exp sessions back in the day just to do a couple of level ups, and even if we had other characters, every level up felt so rewarding after all that grinding.
Nowadays you have people crying just because they can’t be the best by playing 30 minutes a day. No ■■■■ sherlock.
PS: When i played euRO 8 hours a day some years ago, i could make the same money you could get by buying 200 euros of RMT every single day, and i werent the best at doing this stuff, many people made twice or thrice that.
It’s not about the pure physical effort, it’s about multiplying your efforts with good decisions.
You just can’t make money by pure farming like a bot, it would be like pretending to become rich by working as a waiter in a restaurant.
ADD: 
This is by farming 2 hours, market flipping items and selling random gear i got by levelling up. on Fedimian.
(I Had 0 after spending 80m the 30th of december).
I mean really, play the effing game.
And i’m in +11 T4. If you have to spend real money or farm 50 hours to get the same silvers you are just playing badly, it’s not the game’s fault.
EDIT 2: It just feels like most of the comments on the forum are made by people incredibly bad at playing or not playing the game at all to be honest.
I farmed my first sissel the other day, every single item (except the mithril and opals, I already had a bunch of those).
It was actually fairly rewarding. I wasn’t the happiest person ever running around killing galok’s for hours, but the payoff was pretty big.
Plus, that’s what netflix is for right?
I’ve got an oracle in the works for farming the manahas set. Hopefully I’m able to commit to getting the whole thing.
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Yeah i mean, pick your poison. If you have no money at all farming a sissel is fine, there’s a lot of choice (to me) in what i can do to get stronger or happier, or get some equips on my alts. Some can be worse than others (i would never directly farm a manahas right now), pvp still sucks big time, and now after the holidays i’ll have too little time for all the little things i can do to improve my characters, but i never really felt IMC’ed in the past months.
Well, maybe i got IMC’ed a bit when they went forward giving those solmiki weapons for halloween, but 90% of them got trashed by reckless players in a matter of weeks.
I think most of the rage comes from people gambling what they cannot lose constantly or throwing their hard earned silver away for meme gear (intasurta gloves), i mean just play with a grain of wisdom.
Mining and Farming is still grind. Look’n at you, BDO (a heavily boring game)
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What the hell are you talking about, the way you talked is so ignorant and cocky actually, yes some player are rich, they enjoy doing the same thing over and over again but the one who cheat to get rich?? no no maybe you don’t give a f because you just too rich to care about
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How am i cocky and ignorant?
If i can make 50m in 3 days, , starting from 0 silver after spending all i had, anyone can pretty much do it.
I don’t do the same thing over and over.
All i see is toxic people crying everytime they see a legit +21 weapon or good equip thinking everyone is cheating.
Play.
The.
Damn.
Game.
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On the other hand while you farming without sleep. Crying toxic people are leaving the game.
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I can understand the doomposting, but doomposting about people leaving the game when the chart is in positive after 5 months of negative makes you look retarded on a whole other level.
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look closer at the numbers. the return players are less than those who left months ago. combat patch in may had more than double the players currently. overall the game is still on downhill as rank 9 update has failed to recover the same amount of players.
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No one is doomposting here. It is better to be aware of what is going to kill you rather than sorry later. The sh1t game youre consuming now is the product of complaints from doomknights before, if we gonna use your term. We all dont want this game to die at least. Thats why it is better if IMC is aware to all the problems that annoy their playerbase. The hate is just collateral damage as long as this game gets better?
As I’ve said months ago and 1 years ago: this game is a Korean game and we’re not Korean players.
A game should be open to everyone from who have no life and who have a life.
The true is: there are some people who don’t have a life and for them the game is ok.
But honestly, is not ok.
I’m not a random player. I was an hardcore player: grinding all day without rest. But now I’m not anymore because I have a life. And, since I have a life, I don’t have a lot times like before.
I love Tos, but I can’t enjoy everything of this game. And when I can’t enjoy something I quit.
I left Tos 3 months ago because I couldn’t do anything, only grinding all day.
Ok, I can grind all day for have a good weapon, but when the potential is 0 and the weapon is +5… Well, you can immagine why people quit the game.
Other games have better upgrade system.
Other games have daily rewards.
Now I’m back, but dunno if I will stay or quit again.
When I see people with 21+ weapon with no potential loss through upgrade I think is abusing/cheating and etc.
And when you see this in all equipment, is the confirm that is cheating.
Come one, people can’t be lucky for 9 times…
What the game needs to improve?
- Remove Potential through equipment.
- Put a MAX refine, for example +21 and make easy to reach +11.
Everyone will have good weapons? There are a lot of games that people have everything and still playing the game.
Tree of Savior got PVP, so if everyone have good equip a lot of player will join PVP.
Personally my equip is really bad and I will never join PVP, this is the reason.
Meanwhile who has good equip wins all the time. Isn’t funny.
Oh, and I’m still farming for 2 people: me and my boyfriend, and I’ve played a lot grinding games, so I know that grinding means.
And don’t compare Tos to “old games”, compare Tos to 2016 games!
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This is what ToS devs have forgotten. This is what games in this style are supposed to be about. Instead now all items can only be gotten from either RNG-rolled equipment drops or daily dungeons. I got a Terrallion over Max Peta back in the day just because I could farm it myself as opposed to hoping for a .5% drop chance from a daily dungeon or buying it off someone. Same with my Phadas, although those I prefer for the AoE attack anyway. In fact now the only thing you actively farm for is silver for enhancements.
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But IT IS easy to reach +11, if you are unlucky you have golden anvils to fix the bad luck.
Outside of holidays i’m out for around 10 hours everyday and i can still manage to have an ok equip and have fun.
When the potential is 0 and the weapon is +5 you risked all your potential and lost it voluntarily, you could’ve stopt at +9, you could’ve calculated the chances you had to reach your desired upgrade to see if it was improbable, but you still went on and attacked the anvil until 0 potential.
PS: I’m not defending IMC, but it’s obvious that they have used all this year to reshape the game and create a better environment for everyone, yeah the game is still underplayed for the potential, but i SERIOUSLY cannot see how making it a CHARACTER SIMULATOR with FREE UPGRADES TO +11 and NO GEAR TO FARM would make it popular.
I mean, just google “Dress-Up Games” and have fun with those.
PS2: In real life most of the people is working 8 hours a day, but the PAY is different based on WHAT you do in those 8 hours. You cannot really cry about BEING UNABLE TO ENJOY THE GAME if you get misinfoed into farming 8 hours at Demon Prison or waste 8 hours walking in klaipeda, or after farming 5000 hours you destroy your solmiki by hammering it down to -1 potential.
IMC is not responsible for your actions or how good/bad you play. And they are not responsible for you breaking your OWN gear for the sake of getting +70 attack damage when you couldn’t afford to lose it.
Editino a little add:
You know what’s a real problem for the game? The new user experience, the game is too complicated and throws too many ■■■■ at you without telling you anything, this in 20xx is unacceptable.
Are you aware you’re reading that data in a wrong way?
You’re basically looking at a marketplace seeing 5 people during lunch break and saying that only 5 people buys there during the entire month.
Me want free upgrades and compensationz XD everyn is an hackr if they have btr gear than me… You need t10 to clear challenge modez…
I’m not a calculator.
If I was +9 with few potential loss and then I’ve lost everything to try to go back +9 it means that I had bad luck between +6 and +9.
They have done combat changes, now everything is on weapons, so if you don’t have +11 weaps it means is better for you to unistall the game right now.
Remember: you never lose potential voluntarily, only cheater and abusers can do it.
I played the Closed beta and the Open beta of Tos, I know the emprovement. I’m aware.
In Closed beta even the chat was completely bugged. I loved the game with all bugs. I still love it.
That’s why I think I’m one of the few who should talk.
In closed beta I was grinding at Tenet Garden lv30 and reach lv40 was truly a hell.
I’m not talking about have everything free.
I’m talking about to put a cap at Refine and put a safe limit, now is infinite Refine and +5 safe. It’s a little ridiculous.
I don’t know if you have blind eyes or you are playing with ham on the eyes, but there are people with potential “untoched” and high refine.
Since IMC have done a lot of improvements, that’s why I’m suggesting things and don’t cry like others.
And since IMC listen us, the game got a lot of improvement.
Oh, and I don’t know in which country working is 8hrs, but in mine, if you’re lucky you have a job and then you have to work for 12hrs.
And the free time people can spend in what they want and sometimes there are days that they can’t play.
That’s why I’m farming for 2 people: me and my boyfriend. I’m aware about grinding and farm money.
Farming like hell games are dead, we’re not in Ragnarok years anymore.
You have understand that there are a lot of games and the most “friendly” game wins.
Tree of Savior is becoming more friendly since release, but they need more improvement.
And yes, remove DPK and put RNG is a friendly improvement but isn’t enough, there are a lot improvement to do, Refine is one of this.
Oh, and +6 and +11 weaps get a lot of improvement, just saying… Read here, maybe you missed something…
Just forgot: did you ever joined pvp and be killed instantly without understand why are you dead?
That’s why we need Refine improvement. PVP will not be gear unbalanced but class unbalanced and then IMC can fix.
And new user experience? What do you mean? 
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It is your choice to try your luck with a blindfold.
You’ve chosen to risk your potential. You are in control of your actions.
With our current system, basically all items are granted at least a +8, going under +8 means you took the risk for a +9 when you had too low potential hoping luck would save you. Same goes for higher upgrades.
So you have to choose, you either upgrade something you can get more copies of, you keep your golden anvils to roll at least a +11 on the equip, OR you stop at +8/9 and lose 200 attack damage.
Also when you get that 0.X% item that can’t go past 6 or 7, well, that’s literally why it is possible to have a +16 or +21 with full potential, but reversed (in fact i had a +16 with 0 potential loss).
There may be “private” hacks, but crashing channels to upgrade is not one of them, not anymore.
People is still playing POE and Diablo.
Totally, that’s why i talked about the user experience, new players are simply thrown inside the game without any obvious line or guide to follow, and with many pitfalls and traps, the design of things is uncertain and you make bad choices based on the limited knowledge you have.
??? In the case of primus one handed you get 400 physical attack going from +6 to +11, just that.
You are right, pvp is atrocious. Not for the refinement system tho.
Kept this for last, just like upgrades, as you have internet, you are free to study, build up skills, and make money either on the internet or in real life. Pay depends on what you bring. (You literally have the choice)
Implying you come that far.
This is just one example of “bad luck”… The shield had a 88% chance from +3 to +4 and 78% chance for +5. Same for me when upgrading beyond +5 - odds sure are in my favor… FAILED! and then all potential is gone for +7… You farm for days/weeks/months and then your hard work gets shattered in a few minutes - sure is rewarding.
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You CHOOSE to RISK shattering your own work on a weapon that costed you months of play. The game is not forcing you to do so.
So you are telling me it is possible to never reach +8 using all the potential available when the chance of it happening is over 90%, but an high refine weapon with 0 or 1 potential missing is “impossible”?
Also, before you comment again, the person in that thread you posted literally trashed his shield to 2 potential by trying his luck, then SOCKETED it, and then he TRIED AGAIN.
This means that if he stopped 5-6 potential priot to that he would’ve probably had a +8 or +9 shield. He simply lost to his own greed.
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