Tree of Savior Forum

Why Flying Monster work differentely?

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#1

I would like to know the reasoning behind Flying Monster working differently then Ground Monster in this game?

As a Cleric myself it is a HUGE pain to fight flying monster as over 3/4 of my skills can’t hit them for no apparent reason other then the fact they are Flying Monsters?

Is there really a need for such restrictions on skills?

It bring nothing to the game as I see it other then making certain skills even less useful.

I would really love to hear from the developer about the reason why they implemented something like this?

To me it make zero sense.

Every time a quest ask me to kill a Flying Monster, I’m reminded of how stupid it feels that my spells won’t work on them :frowning:

#2

Because it deepens the gamemechanics. Archers are strong against flying monsters, and any class that uses something ground based is weak against them.

#3

And due to this it makes different zones favorable for different classes when ti comes to grinding. The trick is finding the zone appropriate for your class. Clerics are usually dungeons like tenet and carlyles etc. Because you can find a spawn area with a low to 0 flying spawn count and everything is weak to holy.

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#4

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#5

I’m wugushi myself and it’s wonderful to fight against flying monsters in dungeons. Although the c2 skill has problems, Wugong gu does an awesome job, as the poison itself gets doubled too.

It’s pretty much what people said, a mechanic that brings some diversity. Let’s remember most high density maps (usually open dungeons) are composed of ground monsters, like tenet chapel, family residence, demon prison, etc. Archers complain about this, so… I think it’s overall a fair situation.

#6

Seriously, dude, how the hell do you expect for a creature in the middle of the air to voluntarily STEP on one of your magic squares? What would be its reasoning?

“Oh, look, a giant glowing yellowish square with a glyph above it, that sounds like a great place to la–OH GOD OH JESUS OH WHY * Explodes *”

The only reason Zaibas hits is because Zaibas is a magical circle that summons judgment bolts and lightning from the SKY (AKA it hits flying stuff because the attack comes from above, not below like all the rest) whenever anything crosses its borders.

Those were the roleplaying reasons. Mechanic reasons are what the rest of the guys said. :grin:

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#7

I see…

So basically, no valid reason was given.

I wasn’t expecting anything relevant to be mentioned on this subject anyway.

Elementist kill flyers the same way they kill ground enemy.
Archer kill flyer the same way they kill ground enemy.
Swordsman kill flyers the same way they kill ground enemy.

Cleric don’t kill flyer the same way they kill ground enemy.
Pyromancer don’t kill flyer the same way they kill ground enemy.

Explain to me what it would change if cure/heal would hit flying enemy?

Less diversity you say? Where? How?

Anyway…I see you guys feel it add some form of depth to some illusion.

I’m still interested to see what the developper have to say on this.

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#8

You don’t know anything about the game mechanics. If you had any knowledge, you would know that 2-handed bow users can get up to double damage against flying enemies.
With your logic, we might aswell remove resistances too. Or classes altogether.

#9

Um elementalist have lots of skills that don’t work on flying.

Archer can swap 2 handed bow to be better vs flying and crossbow would be better on ground in most situations.

I have to agree with this.

#10

Except two-handed bow user can hit ground enemy too. so explain to me why some skill can’t?

If your bow couldn’t hit ground enemy it would make sense, but it does.

#11

In return, my bow can’t heal.

#12

The thing you peoples seem to forget is that there seems to be no reason aside from making some skill useless against flyers.

There is VERY few skills that don’t hit flying enemy and they don’t do DOUBLE damage against ground enemy nor are stronger then other ground based skills, just they don’t hit flying enemy for whatever reason.

#13

No they just get the highest AOE ratios in the game in exchange. The mage ones anyway.

#14

Look, i make it easy for you. Healing is extremely helpful, no surprises there. But, pure healers have a boring / slow solo life. So, IMC decided to give them the ability to attack with heal. Now we have an attack that heals and/or attacks whenever you want! No other class has that. So, it is to powerful. That’s why it is nerfed by not being able to hit ground targets. El voila, class balance!

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#15

I understand this @NoElement but seeing how weak Heal hit already even Cure, since most of the time monster won’t stay inside Cure except Boss.

I don’t think it’s a matter of balance more then the engine being poorly programmed and it not being able to handle ground effects on flying enemy.

#16

You should play more classes and compare heal damage with other classes skills. Also, there is luring.

And you really think that this is the cause of “poor programming”? Really?

#17

I play with a group of 4 friend that play all different class.

And trust me heal does almost zero damage.

#18

what people states here is totally what the developper have been thinking of.

1/ If your Heal and cure do no damage it should be because you have no int and no enhance. Both heal and cure can deal great damage with int.

2/ You say that it’s unfair that you can’t hit flying monster? you should also find it unfair that you are the only class that can heal himself or make himself invinsible and that at rank 1.

3/ Archer are stronger on flying type because of the class attribute that double his damage on flying type.

If you build to go full support don’t expect to deal damage it’s like basic knowledge on any RPG. Go int hybrid or battle cleric otherwise

#19

I totally understand all this @supercedre, it’s not like it’s the first MMO I play or anything.

I don’t expect to do same damage as other class, far from this.

Also, I’m currently FULL INT. So the int part doesn’t apply here when it come to damage.

In ALL the MMO I have played and I have played nearly a hundred of them I have never seen skills that don’t hit flying monsters, never. (of course the white knight army will surely find some hidden games that have such mechanics.)

That’s the main reason why I wanted to know what was the logic/reasoning behind this in this game.

That a skill does less or more damage against flying monsters is one thing. That a skill cannot do ANY damage against a flying enemy is a problem.

I’m not sure why you guys are so keen on defending something that basically make so sense at all. All my friends agree that it’s stupid and make zero sense. We are all on the same page on this. But here you guys try to give me example without ever coming with a logical explanation.

For instance. You speak of healing and such as being a reason for Heal not doing ANY damage to flying enemies? But then why can it even hit anything?

Same logic apply to Cure.

I would just like to know the basis/logic on which a skill is allowed to hit Flying enemies and why some skills are not allowed to hit them.

There is even ways to make enemies Fly to help Archer. Is there a way to make enemy on the Ground to help ground skills?

All in all I don’t see any valid reason for this to even exist in a game.

Last game I played where Magic could not hit ground enemy was Final Fantasy and Earthquake spells.

Logically speaking a ground effect shouldn’t hit a Flying enemy.

Piratically speaking it just put needless limitation on skills. And even make some skills WAY less appealing if they add more of these restrictions.

Cleric doing good damage even as Full INT is a joke.

The main issue here is the way the game is made sometime when you solo quest that ask you to kill flying enemy and as a C2 Cleric C3 Kirvis you have Zaibas then wait 20 sec to cast Zaiba again then wait.

It become a waiting game because ALL your others skills can’t hit flying monsters. It’s not a matter of balance or anything here.

What I find funny is I see everyone wanting Cleric in their team, yet Cleric is the most hated class to level if you ask anyone that’s leveled one past 100+.

The reason is not low damage, it’s Flying Monsters.

See Flying Monsters at entrance of a new area.

Switch character to others class or be ready for a tedious map. Quest is going to be a huge boredom in that area and you know it the moment you enter the zone.

See ground monsters = FINALLY something normal that can be hit.

You see any logic in this? I certainly don’t.

#20

Ragnarok Online for example.
-You cant hit Ghost Monsters with neutral attacks.
-You cant hit lv 2 Wind Type monsters using Earth Attacks.
-Shadow and Holy monsters will laugh at your magic.

Is called balance, lucky in ToS Healing skills dont heal no undead monsters.

You’re a healer after all If you could deal more damage everyone would choose clerics.