Tree of Savior Forum

The card game (and why it isn't fun)

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#1

tl;dr, one word: Random

Right now there isn’t really a “game” element to this. It’s like calling a coin flip a game. There is no real strategy or choice here. For win conditions you randomly get high/low of a random stat… there isn’t really a way to make a decision here. Some people said it tends to be higher = better but I’m not sure anyone has played enough to really know.

There are several solutions to this without completely remaking the whole thing. I have a few but the one with the most interesting ramifications with the least effort to implement was this one:

At the beginning of a game each player picks 3-5 cards out of their collection
Then the game randomly selects the conditions
Each person picks one and moves it into the selection area which does not reveal it to their opponent.
Each player finalizes their choice with a “confirm” button locking it in and tallying up the result.

For more complexity you could use any or all of the following:

This can be one off or played in a few rounds, with used cards possibly being discarded.
It could also be that multiple cards/variables compared rather than just 1.
You could be required to make a “deck” of 10-15 cards and the “hand” could be randomly drawn from this.

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There you have it, a simple card game with a lot of depth to the choices you can make. There should still be no “best card” still with this method, you can reuse most of the code/card info already implemented for the card game. The only wrinkle is I don’t know all the cards that exist and their values so there might be combinations that are “perfect” this could be tweaked as I’m pretty sure “weight” etc are just made up values, unlike “leg count”. Also you could take card levels into account or some other feature. Using the “deck” with randomly drawn “hands” would also reduce this. Further if you required decks to be made up of no more than 1 or 2 copies of a single card.

Other than remaking the entire system from the ground up (which honestly I’m sure more people would enjoy) this is a possible solution. I have a few ideas for that as well but let’s hold that for now since any of those would probably be months of work.

The other thing I’d like to see is changing the win/loss from the loser giving the winner the card to both cards getting exp, maybe a bonus for winning but then people might game the system. If it’s flat people might just spam whatever without care though, just to level up cards. But at least some people would play just for the enjoyment… The problem is right now certain classes NEED cards for their skills so possibly losing them is like gambling away equipment on a mini game with unreliable rewards. I mean sure your opponent could give you a max level boss card but he could also give you the first boss with 0 exp. One is too good of a reward, the other is too awful of a reward. There could also be a ranking system like PVP has on the korean servers. The combination of exp rewards and ranks might give people enough that they will want to play but wont want to just lose over and over for card exp.

7 Likes
History repeats itself. Especially if you don't learn from the past
Make The Card Game Skill Base Not RNG! (Remake It!)
#2

Wow thanks! I don’t have any chance to try it yet.
I’d love too if they change from lose card to gain exp for card instead.
It’s very hard right now to get more card or upgrade card. With no time track + low chance to drop card from field boss. And from quest boss that usually drop us card but we can’t repeat to fight it for loot again.

#3

It’d also be cool if you could change cards around after the roll has happened.

Sort of like bluffing, it’ll make your opponent thing why you switched cards.

Eventually after a few turns they may even be able to determine based on what you moved before.

#4

Yeah, game cards are pure gambling like the wheel of fortune… needs improvements and maybe add a casino?

#5

Except wheel of fortune you have to know a bunch of terms, words, and letter frequencies. it also has a lot of choices “do you want to do X or Y”. you can solve, buy vowels, or spin. there is a ton of variation in your choices and applicable skill that has nothing to do with the wheel at all. That just adds in a random element to make turns more exciting and reduce someones ability to COMPLETELY dominate the other contestants, which is also uninteresting to watch. this is how the “win condition” wheel functions in our game. the problem is in our game the spin is after you’ve selected a card so your just making a blind random choice. if cards were picked after it would be TOO easy to win cause if you have enough cards you could just pick the best card for each category. There needs to be some element that you have to plan around but can’t just have access to all your cards or theres no real choice. Picking the highest number isnt a choice.

However picking 2 or 3 cards with a good mix of high and low numbers beforehand then rolling to see what requirements you need to beat makes the 2-3 cards you pick a complex decision. Maybe this one has a lot of legs and your second one is large with a lot of legs, and your third one is small with a high weight and few legs. Sure that sounds balanced as a hand to take on everything right? but you didn’t account for the length of their name or how many stars they have. the idea would be that you would never be able to have the HIGHEST value for all values. youd need to pick some that have medium-high in 2-3 values and others to cover the missing parts but hopefully even then there will be some that just have one value WAY higher/lower than ANY other card and they can throw off the “balanced” strategy.

#6

I don’t know never saw the game, but gamecards remind me that. Yes is a very simple game and random, the best part is the bug that you can throw your oponent to the space :joy:

#7

They should just let us gamble… Teach these kids the hard pain of life =|

#8

I think the way the card game is now(as in, winner takes the card) is to help necromancer/sorcerer get cards, since those are untradeable lol.

#9

Tree of savior card game is actually really famous in Brazil. It is called trunfo here

Its basically the same thing and you can customize it with any theme( cars, houses , trucks , bikes, monsters) . So I would guess this game is also famous in Korea.

1 Like
#10

I don’t like it, maybe for kids is fine. But is like:

-Say a random number,
-3!
-2!
-Win for the highest number.
-oh you win!
-and you lose!

That only will work with real money (neuropsychological reasons)… or something valuable on the game.

#11

A point is that this feature will be exploited instead to trade cards between players. Huh. It’s been weird from the very beginning why cards are untradeable whilst the boss who drops it (the main quest bosses) cannot respawn.

#12

do you pick your cards before seeing which to compare? also can you have as many cards as you want? no other rules?

#13

nah, Its all very random. You pick a card , opponent pick another and something randomly chooses what attribute to compare. To increase your chances you need more “OP” cards. Cards that can beat others in more then one attribute and are all-round into others ( you can pick the same card on and on if you think the opponent doesnt have a better one).

#14

but there is no better or worse attributes in this, like i said it can say “lowest weight wins” but it could also say “highest weight wins” either way i think that is probably the type of game that is popular for kids cause they dont realize how there is no way to actually try and win…

#15

Oh I didnt know that. hmm, well truth be told that game is really famous among children indeed.