I have a templeshooter and all that on me. I’ll test it in HG340 tomorrow and report back.
One flaw I know of immediately is that you can’t decay or decay [corrupt] bosses. All of them are immune to every type and effect of decay.
@ridleyco yeah it’s a shame that you can’t decay bosses. but yeah if you have the decay attribute for shoggoth, then temple shooter should do double damage to decayed enemies - it always has. but the new patch lets shoggoth decay flying enemies which it couldn’t before, which is a boon. i’ve always wondered why more builds don’t try to incorporate necro c1 just for the archer support. some archer builds do ridiculous dps when you get them doing double damage. with 100% up-time.
You’re correct about Linker. Linker is very powerful in combination with Sorc2 and some summons, but even if you don’t ride, it’s very, very useful. I am only Linker2 with my main Sorc and even with my Spirit Shock being useless, it’s an absolutely amazing class.
Thaum skills don’t affect summons by themselves, but they have attributes which do (10% Attack to summons with Swell Left Arm, 10% Defense with Swell Right Arm). However, you will find yourself not needing the 10% defense. The 10% Attack are nice, but there is 0 reason to take Thaum1 over Sorc2 since five more levels in Summon also give 10% to attack.
Thaum3 is something for people who want to not 100% focus on Sorc or Necro-summons. For example, Thaum3-Linker1-Sorc1-Shadowmancer2 is very, very good because Shadowmancer can deal really good damage through the Thaum-buffs. But if you want to focus on Sorc, Thaum1 is the max you should pick.
Also really surprised to see no Cryo in your set. Cryo1 alone is, in my eyes, vastly superior to Thaum1. Ice Pike will keep you alive if you don’t ride. I have a Cryo1-Linker2-Sorc2-Necro3 and a Cryo3-Sorc2-Linker3 character and both rely very much on Ice Pike for survival. My Shadowmancer, who doesn’t have any Cryo skills, is far, far more in need of pots. Actually, from what I know, Cryo3-Sorc2-Necro3 is still considered the meta build for pure summoners.
Oh yeah, Linker1 is pretty rubbish. Wish I would have given my Shadowmancer Cryo1 instead. Linker2 is where Linker starts to really shine.
The attribute of Quicken works with summons, but nothing else. Chrono does close to nothing to your summons because of that. It’s an excellent support class for parties, but if you want to help your summons/solo a lot/pick all classes to match Sorc, don’t go Chrono.
Also what’s your weird obsession with Wiz2? None of your builds are in need of Surespell, Magic Missile will deal close to none damage if you’re pure SPR and the real good Sleep attribute which helps summons like Marnox got changed to Wiz3, so Wiz2 is, in my eyes, pretty much a waste of rank with the builds you’re considering. 
Unless you do stuff like Thaum3-Shadowmancer2 (or FF), since then Magic Missile will deal damage thanks to Thaum. Still, you’re not Sorc2-centric then anymore.
Basically, my Necro never needs any pots, thanks to the huge amounts of summons she has around her. When only Sorc-centric and with Salamion and your main summon, you do want Crowd Control even more since killing things will be slower or - if you ride - you will at least get hit more. Thaum offers no CC, keep that in mind.
Last tip: Not all summons are perfect for the Linker/Sorc2 combo. If you go Linker2/3 and also Sorc2, even if you don’t ride otherwise, it is extremely convenient to have a summon with a slow(!)-casting AoE skill. You use riding, activate the AoE-skill of the summon, jump down immediately again and use Joint Penalty while the summon is casting. If you get it in in time, you have just wiped the screen of enemies. 
Not all summons have good AoE-skills, though, and some just cast way too fast to get Joint Penalty in in time. My Necro never rides outside of these casts, but when she uses them, she clears the screen together with her summon (she uses Helgasercle). My Cryo3-Sorc3-Linker3 can’t do it that well, Froster Lord casts waaaay too fast to guarantee me getting the JP in.
Sleep attribute can buff the damage of Magic type summons and Lethargy attribute can buff tile skills (not from summons)
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Oh riiiight, I forgot about that. I never level Sleep and Lethargy because I hate them, so I totally forgot about that stuff. Just remembered the Strike specialty thing existing. I still think the rank is better used for something else (unless Thaum3), but I suppose with me hating the stuff Wiz2 offers, I’m a bit biased. 
I’ve tested it, and it is indeed working as you describe. This puts Templeshooter firmly back in action, at least for blowing HG340 to smithereens. He was easily outdamaging Marnox, at least with autoattacks. I’m not Sorc2 yet so I can’t comment on how they compare while riding. And decay definitely works on players…
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I was actually just looking at Cryo, and found the idea of Freezing attractive considering most of my other classes has little to no CC in it. (I also hate the idea of sleep and lethargy :D).
Decided that my ideal summon would definitely be Froster Lord. (I also saw a video of riding, cast AoE and dropping off, and liked the idea too).
Now I’m looking at:
Wiz - Cryo3 - Sorc2 - Thaum3
Wiz - Cryo - Link3 - Sorc2 - Thaum2
Wiz - Cryo3 - Sorc2 - Link3 (More freeze + Strong Single target?)
Thaum because I’m gonna be mostly playing Duo with a friend.
I like the idea of Link3 for that awesome single target Spirit Shock (I heard is crazy good).
If Cryo1’s Ice Pike is really that good, I might just roll with Cryo-1.
Its either Cryo1-Thaum2 or Cryo2-Thaum1 for my 2nd option.
Have not actually started playing yet cause Exam week LOL. I can play starting tmr night.
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Froster Lord is the best summon for riding. Please keep that in mind. Froster Lord’s auto attack is definitely mediocre at best; his selling points are his multi-hit riding skills and their short cooldowns. If you end up not liking riding, consider switching to another summon. Lots of people consider Marnox to be the best, but also name Netherbovine or Gorkas. I personally will always favor Helgasercle over all of those, but this alone should show you that you have lots of other options. 
I don’t really play duo, so I can’t really tell you much there, just be aware that Thaum will do not much for you if you solo. Parties will love you, though.
Thaum2 is kinda a bad spot, in my opinion. Either Thaum1 or Thaum3. I don’t feel like Thaum2 alone offers enough to be viable. May I suggest Rune Caster instead of Thaum2? If you cast Rune of Destruction with its attribute and then Spirit Shock, you will murder whatever the Spirit Shock hits as RoD lowers magic defense even further.
This is what I am currently doing, but I’m not at R9 yet, so I don’t have Spirit Shock’s attribute yet. What I can tell you:
- Frost Pillar is really nice if you don’t ride too much. It’s what tides you over while Ice Pike is on cooldown.
- I personally am not a fan of Snow Rolling, but I’m pretty sure others find more use for it.
- Subzero Shield is nice, but not as superior as I thought it would be. Still, it helps.
- My most used skill is still Ice Pike.
- None of your ice skills will deal huge damage, you just want everything that can freeze for the crowd control.
Basically, I wanted to make an ice-themed character, which is why I went Cryo3. Overall, between Ice Pike and Linker3, it’s a bit of a rank waste in my eyes, but I wanted to stick to my theme and it’s definitely not a bad choice at all. I suppose me not liking Snow Rolling is one of the main problems. Then again, I spent my time riding Froster Lord anyway, so it’s not like I run around much, especially when I solo-level. Im currently level 303 or so with that character and just left Kalejimas and up until now, everything was pretty trivial with riding Froster Lord and the riding attribute at 70.
But yeah, overall, I would say Cryo1 is enough, at least once you hit Sorc2. For leveling until Sorc2, Cryo3 is godly as you’re stuck with low magic attack. Frost Pillar really, really helps you survive and level reasonably quickly, especially in Demon Prison.
And yeah, Ice Pike is the greatest skill. Ice Bolt is just for when Ice Pike is on cooldown, Subzero Shield and Frost Pillar are also just little extras (FP’s cooldown is huge and Subzero shield doesn’t make that much of a difference since you will have the enemies frozen with Ice Pike most of the time anyway). Everything else is kinda rubbish (unless you like Snow Rolling, then apparently that’s great).
Cryo2 is like Thaum2 - pretty bad place to stop. Level 5 Subzero Shield just doesn’t have enough uptime. Just like with Thaum: Either stay at Cryo1 or go to Cryo3.
I would suggest you pick Cryo1 and see how Ice Pike treats you. If you feel like you have enough CC with it, stay at Cryo1; if you want more or you find the cooldown too long, go Cryo3.
Okie! I’ll also take RC into consideration then.
Now that I got an idea of what I want from each class, its now down to preference when I actually start playing! Thanks a bunch!
Another question, If I go for RC, what other skills do I take other than Rune of Destruction?
Protection + Giant?
Protection + Justice?
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Keep in mind that RC runes have casttime, though - that’s the one thing where Surespell would be nice.
If you go Cryo3, Rune of Ice might be a good choice (if there will ever be a rank10, I will give my Cryo3-Sorc RC). Otherwise, I would say Protection and Justice, but a lot of people like Giant. I personally don’t, but then again, you won’t exactly do much damage with Justice. Basically Destruction and Protection are the ones you want for sure, the other points are kinda filler.
And yeah, a lot of options are viable and it’s all down to preference and what skills someone likes to use. Sorc is a class that goes really well with a lot of things and, with riding, just as itself is almost a complete build.
So I’ve finally gone Sorc2. Very flashy. Is there a way to manually aim riding skills? Templeshooter’s machinegun and Marnox’s energy wave are both spectacular room clearers but they’re a pain in the ass to line up.
U need to position yourself very good to aim this skills at the point u want. but there is some tips.
If you are surrounded by mobs, while riding and u attack or use skills, the summon will aim to the closest mob doesnt matter the direction u face, he will turn to him at the moment of the attack.
So, you need to back away to a corner or area with no mobs, then use the skills at the direction they are as they comming in. With no mobs in range, u can aim at any point you face.
If you have sorc2, Giant can be a good option since u can become big while riding, providing more HP and defense. Wiz2 has sleep attribute to futher buff the damage of Rune of Destruction, dont forget to buy it.
I got legend rexipher card 3 days ago.
test it today and find that it not worth for sorcerer because it has same stat compare to normal card.
thx for Sheba’s data
[complain time]
OK, time to admit that sorcerer need to rework.
i think legend card will be the new hope or new era for sorcerer player…and yeah it’s not.
i’m main sorc, from normal player who love summoner class and want more people in TTOS to play sorcerer.
i plan to encourage player to play sorcerer so i will show them what sorcerer can do.
many DPS build from wi1 cryo3 sor2 necro2 >> wi1 cryo3 sor2 wl1 sm2 >> wi3 ele3 sor1 wl2
many gear from event catacomb staff to +19 tran 10 primus raffye staff and solmiki set
only man that use sorcerer as ‘reliable DPS’ in old and new WB in top WB party.
i’m happy that many people play more sorcerer now but i don’t know what sorcerer stand for.
- outdps by many dps class, disadvantage because spr stat compare to full int.
- summon hard to control in hard content, die easily.
- classified as fun class but not necessary class
pls do sth imc…
sorry for bad english.
These builds seem seriously odd to me when it comes to you claiming Sorc needs improvement. Necro not at Necro3 for the amazing attributes? Wl and Ele also imply an Int build, which is completely different from a summon build that makes Sorc shine. And Wl1 in the second build just seems odd and not really fitting - and Sm2 is, without Thaum3, also not easy to play on a Spr-build when it comes to damage. Honestly, I kinda feel like you are out-dps’ed mainly because your builds seem really strange when you say they are supposed to be Sorc-centric/complain about Sorc Dps.
My Necro kills everything way faster than any other character of mine, including my Ele3/WL3. And my Cryo3/Sorc2/Linker3 who is doing nothing but riding on Froster Lord, basically, levels way, way faster than many other characters of mine as well. My Necro is the only wizard of mine who never needs pots because all the summons tank for her. She dies way less than anyone else.
Heck, you have a lot of gear I definitely don’t have - I have no trans items and definitely no Solmiki stuff - but I feel like your builds could be adjusted a bit to make that equipment count a lot more. That is, when it comes to summons. Not saying that your builds are bad; they’re likely totally viable and good, but they do not show off Sorc at its best but focus on other classes as well. I see that with my own Sm2 - her main damage also comes from her Shadowmancer skills and not from Marnox, despite being full Spr. But that’s simply because the build was intended to have Sorc as a damage support and not as main damage source. Reliable damage =/= Main damage.
Honestly I feel like Sorc1 and Sorc2 are in a really, really good place now, skill-wise. The legendary card mess/morph bug is bad (and yeah, it’s been two weeks now since I sent that ticket and still no reply…). Sorc3 is also crap. But I don’t want Sorc1 and Sorc2 to change at all. I think they’re pretty spot on and Sorc is my favourite class and - for me - the class I deal the most damage with, kill the fastest and die the least (as a wizard; with a Cleric, I die even less, obviously, but also deal way, way less damage).
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ty for answer, this is my timeline when i play sorc and reason of the build.
- 1st build w1 cryo3 sor2 necro2 in rank8
just start to play sor+necro no item, no attribute.
i’m admit it’s bad build sor2 just want to ride lol.
rerank to 2nd build because even full spr skeleton will die easily in castle dungeon lv.300. (I’m shock)
- 2nd build wi1 cryo3 sor2 wl1 sm2
i have thauma in party so don’t need thau in my build.
have cc have dmg but shadow thorn in sm is hard to aim and not work in some flying boss
wl1 is bad decision tho (i think summon will produce evil spirit T_T)
—> don’t really focus on wb becuase it was dominated by murnobi build
- 3rd build wi3 ele3 sor1 wl2 >> focus on rank 1-3 in new WB
(this build inspired from little samson but changed a bit)
my gear is ready and element has some buffed in intense balance so i decide to play this build.
start is wi3 ele3 is well build that never outmeta.
wi3 - with lethargy: strike my marnox hit like a truck (marnox aa is strike)
ele - aoe dps
wl2 - many choice maybe sm2/sage2/wl2
i think wl2 is great because it easy to play in new WB. just land dot skill (POE + mastema) and jump out
nice damage and fast then you call pass from chrono.
compare with sm2 you need to 5OH Shadow thorn with a little bit delay between OH
sage 2 is great too but i don’t like dimension compression (can’t QC)
i love sor but why sor1? --> i think sor1 is enough for WB
10% atk/def of summoning = sor 1 rank
if you changed it to other dps class, you got more DPS than 10% dmg from summon
(sure summon die easily, Summon AI is bad so you need to command it)
marnox card is best for sor1 and with lethargy: strike have ‘additional 50% dmg’
50% from attribute is enough to play sor 1 rank
(riding is bad when AI aim in opposite target and summon can’t recieve pass T_T)
PS. Why summon can’t received pass. WHY IMC!!!
I don’t know how to quote lol.
“But that’s simply because the build was intended to have Sorc as a damage support and not as main damage source. Reliable damage =/= Main damage.”
I ever believed that sorcerer is reliable damage too
but time change, i change my mind
okay maybe World Boss is not designed to sorcerer player.
but in Vellcoffer raid i don’t think it will be reliable dmg anymore.
in WB, I resummon my marnox every time because it die easily.
even 1000 SPR not help my marnox stand for WB.
sor2 and sor3 got more 10% and 20% def respectively, which not help much
little samson not summon his marnox in this raid
and i think next content will be harder…
after i think sor is not reliable damage in hard content. (maybe i should give up?)
then what sor stand for?
for support build i have
- wi2 link3 thau3 sor1
- wi2 link3 chrono3 sor1
in hard content summon die easily and rc shine from rune of protection, free purple card slot.
rune of ice buff hail and water shikigami
for agro & tank
Tanking
WB can’t, Velcoffer can’t, ET can tank
in ET, summon can aggro all monster in 22F, 27F, 32F, 37F.
then IMC nerfed it.
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i think problem is in how you see the class role.
Sorc is a summoner build with probably the most tankiest summon that exists in ToS (okay except owls maybe)
but first it’s a relatively low rank class and second it is not damage class (which you can see from class icon too)
to be fair, sorc summon can tank all the content which is designed for solo play, also okay-ish tank for high CM (at 6-7 need to resummon several times that is).
but when it comes to the content designed specifically for groups of players, you should not expect your summon being a sort of off-tank or, worse, carry for that content. it is designed for whole group to work on going through that content and actually putting effort into it, not by relying on summons which is sort of helping AI in this game (even tho it’s not too intelligent if we’re honest).
TL:DR you wanna be damage dealer - go damage dealer build, you wanna have fun with summons go summoner build. not every build/class is able to beat the hardest content the game has to offer, and this is normal.
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I think that sums up why I don’t get what others get. I only do solo content and the instance dungeons and saalus. I don’t do WB, I don’t do ET, I don’t do raids or anything along these lines; I simply have way, way too much lag to do these things. But I also have little interest in them - I tried CM parties before and besides being likely a huge liability for my party members as I have to turn effects off and don’t see the heal tiles from the healers, I also found exp gain way worse - yes, talking stage 6 sausys CM - than me leveling solo. And all stuff I want can be bought from the market sooner or later. Solmiki gear is pretty crappy for Spr-classes anyway and so is Masinio’s Staff. So I dont even care about that content. I also got my Helgasercle card, so I don’t have any reason to do WBs.
I suppose I should therefore rephrase into: Sorc is perfectly able to be a main damage class for solo content, both as solo-summon-class or with Necro on top. I only had good experiences during all solo content, from my Necro being able to go to Sausys at 325 or so (I forgot when it was viable to get exp there, oops) when my Ele still dies there at 345. And the lower levels for my Froster Lord Sorc were a joke, I could clear Demon Prison District 2 faster than a four-people party could while riding. And given how I then leveled that Sorc in Kalejimas just like my AA Chaplain, I can say that the Sorc was definitely a lot faster there, too - got her to 300 yesterday, my Chaplain (who gets the same leveling time, I switched after each buff period) - is still at 278 or so.
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Do you use Swell Left Arm before or after summoning?
it’s 50% when maxed
Because summons are considered as NPC’s?