Tree of Savior Forum

Since Ranger3 is wack. Whats the iToS version "OP PVE AOE DPS" archer build?

I see, so how you did your tests?

The problem with high base physical attack is the min max dmg diference, so I did that cuz I want to see the pure value of the skill damage, without crt attack, phy attack, etc.

I just looked at the pure value from the skill damage. Not overall dps increase.

I did the math for one hit only from the barrage, not the overall dps of the skill, just one by one barrage hit.

So you did the tests with this info?

Can you share? I also edited.

There, I edited my reply earlier. I hope that convinces you already and would teach you how to properly judge if leveling a skill is worth it or not.

I see, edited My post above too.

PS: @Dream

As far as I know the damage formula is this:

[[(ATK+ATKSKILL+AMP)ƗT0āˆ’ ((DEF-DEFDEBUFF)ƗLVPENALTY+RESELEM)]ƗCRIT+CRITATK+ATKELEM+ATKTYPE]ƗT1ƗT2ƗT3ƗENHANCE+BONUS

Where ATKSKILL is the base skill damage. It gets multpl. later, so it scales better than you are trying to show.

So, can you do this test, or explain in the damage formula how you get yours 18% increase?

Ok, Im doing that, with the damage formula, as above.

hugs.

Thanks both of you :slight_smile:

Iā€™d recommend getting 157 into DEX and pumping the rest into STR and CON. Ratios are hard to deal with because it changes with how good your gear gets.

ā€¦

@Reilet or @Lyralei can you help me explain to FLoki how these things actually work and why Lv5 Barrage and Lv15 Barrage has barely any difference on end-game.

I donā€™t know, I thought my explanation was already so simple here but it seems it wasnā€™t enough.

Iā€™m starting to have a headache thinking on how to simplify it further.

Strong Pve Aoe Archer

A2- Sapper2 - Wu2 Cannon full str

A3- Wu 3 - Cannon full str

A2- sapper 2 - fletcher dex

you wonā€™t benefit much from going A2 if you go full str

This is a fallacy and it needs to stop.

You can potentially get to 300+ crit rate from gear and gems alone, so 25% from swift step will grant you around +75 crit rate.

Considering people are paying 7 mill+ for sissel bracelets just for an increase of 37 crit rate, 75 crit rate is considered a significant amount of stats from such a cheap buff in terms of rank investment.

@Dream I am not sure how to ELI5 any more than you already did.

The following table is for everyoneā€™s perusal:

At low pATK values, each point in Barrage grants a substantial DPS increase to the skill. The value derived from further investment into it rapidly decreases as you approach higher pATK values.

It will not be uncommon to hit at least 1000 pATK with a standard archer making each point investment into Barrage a mere 2.9% increase in damage to the skill at that pATK. Consider that a per refine on a 7 star weapon (best we can get right now) past +5 grants +18 attack, 30 pATK gain from Barrage is quite inconsequential in the grand scheme of things.

For what its worth, the efficiency of investing points into Barrage suffers from harsh diminishing returns as your pATK grows (which it will continue to do).

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Thank you! I hope that further explanation will help.

I literally LOLā€™d at that tab name. Iā€™m really starting to like you! You remind me of Rosutosefi (Dragon Nest SEA forums).

Oh and sorry for tagging you here! Gomen!

Naw all good. Only took a few minutes to whip up. The tab name was for fun :smiley:

And if anyone is interested in what 29.3 pATK is worth to them, take that pATK and divide it by the sum of your Barrageā€™s Skill Attack + Your Base pATK. That will be how much of a damage % increase you will be gaining from 1 additional point into the skill.

40-50 percent crit with sissle + a2 crit not including gems

i agree with that you said , alot of people on forums spend more time here doing math or theory crafting then playing so they just repeat what they hear ^^

Hereā€™s my calculations for final damage with BiS gear, lvl6 green gems, optimized stat allocation, and blessing+sacrament buffs (very easy to obtain)

Youā€™re looking at a 6.6k total damage difference total between each Barrage burst for each spec. Since barrage has a 17 cd and takes a few seconds to cast, letā€™s say that you can more or less cast 3 barrages every 20 seconds. What that translates into is an overall ~330 dps increase, with maybe a 5% margin of error.

Conclusion: Investing 2 ranks and 10 skill points into a skill to get roughly a 300 dps increase is not good, especially considering your magic arrow alone is generating about 12320 Damage per second with the same gear/stats, it is completely dwarfed in comparison.

I still donā€™t understand why Barrage 15 is even brought up as a talking point, the damage increase from Barrage 5 to Barrage 15 is less than 1% of your total damage in your dps rotation. You probably get more damage by buying a single attribute level in Magic Arrow.

PS: Do note Iā€™m just using a test dummy with 0 crit resist 0 defense as simply a reference point, the defensive values of an enemy just lowers the floor of all the values, and no monster in this game getā€™s past 457 defense or 100 crit resist anyways.

Itā€™s because FLoki is still arguing that Lv15 Barrage is worth it when it isnā€™t. He believes what his tests shows even though he has no full idea how the formula actually works.

He believes testing in-game gets more credibility than those doing the math, which he thinks are just theorycrafting when weā€™re actually throwing out facts.

Iā€™m at the point whereā€™ Iā€™ve already done so many calculations for every possible different archer spec, buff combination, skill level comparisons, weapon comparisons etc. that Iā€™m pretty sure I can develop a DPS simulator addon at this point (Something where you hover over a skill and it shows you the estimated DPS based on your current equip and stats)

Honestly maybe I should just jump into the addon dev scene, put my computer science degree to use.

@FLoki
I do apologize for losing my temper. I just take it personally when someone accuses me of not knowing how to play my class.

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(sorry my english)

I really enjoyed your conversation about why donā€™t take Ranger 3 and I really believe you, of what I read you have Archer 2 Ranger 1 Scout 1 but what you take for rank 5-6-7? fletcher3? and I suppose you took str:con 2:1 or not? (because crit rate from sissel and hats and gems)

thanks in advance
greetings from Chile :slight_smile:

I think 70 CON is a pretty safe number, you level up CON once every 4 levels and it scales with you well until 280.

so 70 CON, then you can decide whether you want to go full STR or some dex some STR (like 157 DEX or something, rest into str)

I have never played archer, and I read a lot and found a lot of guides, your thoughts ond this build? http://www.tosbase.com/tools/skill-simulator/build/mhs9g2v4h6/