Its not an argument about bossing in this game and transcendence. It was about a comparison of transcendence from other MMORPG. Where the efforts are the same. You traded it with equal value. Is that hard to understand? That there is no sacrifice?
There are truths in both sides. What delca said reflects the situation now, with many characters directly (within own team) or indirectly (via market/trade etc) supporting another character with blessed shards. And those characters in turn will either,
- Wait for their turn to get to the top of the food chain (be at the receiving end for blessed shards) or;
- Just stop there, continue to farm blessed shards as they canât progress without them (since higher content needs some transcended equipment)
There isnât many (or any) alternatives in which IMC gave so that characters can still progress without any transcendence. It is by far the only feasible route to get to high damage in order to actually clear/survive the end R8 content maps (the other of course is high enchancement which isnât really feasible with the limited nature of practonium).
Trading of shards and equipments is always happening, the difference is with equipment traded away, there are other alternative equipments to replace it so the character can still progress. This isnât the case for transcendence, the only thing that matches transcendence in terms of power level is itself.
Which is why players are saying trading away blessed shards is like trading your chance of progression of the character away, since IMC made pegged transcended equipment as a factor to the current R8 contentâs difficulty. IMC do realise this and has started rebalancing the content so the reliance of transcendence is much lesser now.
Did I not just mention this before?
I am a generic Warrior in MMO whatever the â â â â .
I get a piece of Archer Gear.
I am not an archer so I sell the gear. I havenât sacrificed anything unless I have inclination to play an archer
You are a Wizard and get Warrior gear and sell it.
I buy it.
We have redistributed our drops for our advancement and profit.
I am a generic raider in MMO somethingandorother.
I get a piece of end-game gear.
It is not tradeable.
I am a generic Archer in MMO ofsomesorts
I got an upgrade material from the boss.
I sell you the material although I may want it.
The generation of this upgrade material makes it so that I may see it again. Perhaps not in 2 months or 3 but it will appear. Now someone who has already used theirs for themself may have an excess and thus sell their upgrade material to me when I want it. Thatâs well and goood.
These are all radically removed from the 2830 shards you need for a flipping stage 10 Trans Weapon at a generation rate of 6 per character assuming token and 600,000 silver spent each of those days.
The equivalence would be an MMO where the drop rate of rare armor is that on average one drops every year and a half per character. A couple characters get that armor and sell it or characters sell their very drop rate of this item so that players can get it faster (and once it drops your drop rate resets).
There is no Mmo that works like this for end-game gearing.
We do have MMOâs, many, many MMOâs that have huge long-term grinds for other things in the game, such as costumes, skins, achievements, titles, and more. Some of these will be sped up through the marketplace, because not all players want to chase or care about these goals. These things donât matter objectively so they are simple achievements, recognition, of hardwork or determination for players who strive for them. One of my favorite online games Guild Wars 1 had some of these grinds. FFXIV also has them as do many other games. In contrast to Transcendence with is a long-term grind that directly affects the power scale within the game. That affects the value of specific stats which are rarely alterable. Very few games are going to have a designed long-term year and half grind for gearing 1 equipment slot
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How can we be so sure that TOS community will not cry again in the future. Change this, the other party will cry, change that the other factions will do so. Thats what changing transcendence is. Continuous cycle of whining. Look what happened to world boss, because it was viewed by the community before as high paying industry. People want to nerf so bad, and it became dead.
Transcendence is not a must to progress in the game. At least not in the higher solmiki room as DPS. Because for the record i farmed in Rank 8 maps when it was released using transcendence 1 only. There is uneven balanced of classes, because others cant even if i can do? Thats totallly different argument, not belonging to transcedence but Class balance.
I can say with absolute certainty that the new upcoming changes will not stop people from whining. Why? Because casuals are vocal and dedicated players are vocals too? You cant expect balance between the too sides. Either casuals will rage or dedicated players will rage.
Make the goal of the game easier to complete who will be left? Of course casual players.
Iâll remind you something here:
This videogame is tailored to a market segment, not to an individual.
What was the nerf to world bosses? The 8 hour debuff thingy? or the fact that world bosses in their majority donât drop anything worth while?
For those world bosses that do exist, how many drop something useful?
Also, worldbosses are just big skinned popolions, only interesting one is rexipher.
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I thought youre gone already? Go away please. At least learn to comprehend the argument before i would reply to you. For the record i didnt bother to read your reply.
What Casual Players.
The majority of people who play this game LEAVE. The game is failing to retain players. Month after month, after, month, after month. We lose more players. We gain new players but not at the rate at which we lose.
Youâre trying to compare
472 days worth of daily repetition r to end-game armor in games which never take that long to acquire and are very, very, very often in modern MMOâs untradable. If Trans wasnât tradable nobody would have stage 10 right now, because thatâs how LARGE the time commitment is.
However can you list all the rare items we have or in other games which would take this long to acquire? Doubtful. Trading isnât merely a solution because Transcendence is out of proportion. It requires a sacrifice of someone elses progression in order to âcompleteâ it in a realistic timeframe.
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Funny, childish behaviour.
I find funny you say so to me, when it was clear you did not understand the argument.
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Maybe they left for different purpose not because of transcendence. You cant use people leaving the game because of transcendence. Or maybe youre that desperate to use it disregarding other factors of why they left.
Iâm not trying to say theyâre leaving because of trans.
Iâm seriously questioning how you think a radically inaccessible system is retaining minority players when it is disproportionate to any other system in this game, and is disproportionate to systems of progressions in other games despite you wanting to use them as an example.
Again Stage 10 trans requires over a year of investment solo. Which is why you have to have other characters give up their pursuit otherwise itâs not logistically feasible.
How many tradeable end-game drops in MMOâs do you know of that require the equivalent time-frame. No not to fully gear, but just for 1 weapon.
We have the white boater for instance, a very rare item, it requires a lot of player commitment to acquire and some people have farmed for months and not gotten one.
It is tradable, but it requires far less time commitment than Trans.
Orange mat farming, maxing out an attribute. Itâs all faster than trans. Reality is if trans released exactly this time last year. If it wasnât made tradeable it still wouldnât allow stage 10 trans weapons because that is how long a time commitment we are talking about, and you want to compare this to trading some drop you might struggle to find for 2 or 3 monthsâŚ
Where is your sense of proportion?
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No im not using transcendence for players to retain in here. Its you using it as argument of why people leave. I didnt initiate the talk about people leaving it was you all along.
You just said that nerfing trans means players will leave leaving us only with casual players.
That weâre making the game too easy by saying this mechanic is flawed.
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I said rage. Or protest. Not leaving. The difference is so evident my grade 2 niece will face palm.
But anyway if indeed hardcore players leave. Thats precisely the casualifacation, not because of bugs.
You said that. Even though there are people leaving because of bugs.
Or you want me to collect every post from those dedicated people who farmed the shards here that they would leave.
jj[quote=âjynxie08, post:110, topic:352371, full:trueâ]
You want it to be casualized everything so all players are the same whether theyre casual or dedicated players.
[/quote]
Here you state Iâm casualizing the game by attacking transcendance.
[quote]
Do you understand that casuals and hardcores are at each other throats? Because you dont know that if you casualized everything, dedicated will get bored and leave the game. [/quote]
Followed again by you directly saying this very act of casualizing causes players to leave.
Itâs very apparent to me what youâve been stating. Itâs apparent to anyone who reads your post.
You think the game is being casualized if we nerf trans for being a poor system.
You believe doing so causes a negative effect where players leave. You also believe (correctly) that new players are coming in.
I have said that people are leaving the game (fact). I havenât said itâs Trans that makes people want to quit.
Since you say nerfing Trans makes people leave. I again have to ask. What casual players when you take the stance that nerfing trans leaves us with only casual players. Weâre losing players every month of every demographic. I donât doubt you can find people who will leave if trans is nerfed, you can find people who will leave for many potential changes. Youâll find people who left because of trans. So what.
In your own words nerfing Trans makes people leave and leaves us with casual players, but as I state and as the game statistics shows, this game population is shrinking every month, period. Youâre not going to be left with casual players anyways because many arenât playing.
Lol screaming about hard work when most of the work is done by someone else and its just sold to you at an affordable price. Trans on all of your equipment is a process that would literally take over 3 years of daily play. Find me a game with end-game drops that take that long. It used to take even longer then that before they nerfed armor and accessories because they knew it was unreasonable.
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For the WB case I personally attribute it to the poor quality drops (that a WB should have). World Bossing do require a substantial amount of hard work (in transcending equipment to get top dps) and the drops just arenât worth the time investment, hence this causes the lack of interest in camping/farming for WB.
As we can see, lots of things go hand in hand. Classes are not balanced, some classes which are more balanced against the R8 content will have a much easier time and lower equipment requirements to clear the content. Other classes arenât so fortunate, they have to work harder on their equipments just to reach the same amount of damage output as compared to the metas. And how do they reach that kind of output? Transcendence.
This is why so many players have a love-hate relationship with transcendence. The implementation serve as a bandaid for a big underlying problem, but in the end create even more problems instead. To many players this is a must because their non-metas canât really progress without them, which in turn leads to them acquiring shards in whichever way possible, by using alts, player trades or buying them in market.
This isnât healthy, a number of the players here expressed that transcendence in theory is a good concept. The only problem is it is released too early, especially during the times where class balances arenât really resolved and there are still 2 more ranks in the making.
There will still be whining. It is such an ingrained culture of the iToS community. Iâll be really surprised and wonder if I surf the wrong forum if there isnât any here lol.
Transcendence do need some changes to it for the better future for ToS. Not discounting hardwork of those who managed to get high transcended equipment of course. Hopefully IMC can keep those who really work hard for their transcended equipment in mind when they make the change.
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Because why would hardcore stay after they got what they wanted already?
Your implication of leave on the other hand is, you think people solely leave because of transcendence or rather you said the population is thining because of it. You didnt specify that only a fraction of those who left because of transcendence. I said only hardcores not TOS population as a whole.
Yes thats fair. However that will not be the same for other people raging again from it again. Which means it will be changed again in the future. What is constant is the minimum shard earner with another way of strangling themselves.
For me trans is balanced because it let lower rank classes to be on par with higher rank classes and be viable at end game. If people like me thinks it is balanced, the same would be said to upcoming changes. Some people would think it is balanced even though majority of whiners are already snowballing again with their agenda to changed the system.
Maybe the core of the problem is our smart community? Not the system.
Itâs called ContentâŚ
Part of the reason why there isnât new content.
Is because IMC is focusing on balancing out pre-existing systems like Trans, like the stat system.
Players come back to play with new content. I put FFXIV down and come back to it all the time every year because it brings new content once Iâve done the previous things. Sometimes I linger longer, but I have other priorities.
I stay on Tree of Savior because I like playing with my class combinations and alts. The dedication required to 1 character however simply is off-putting in a game that marketted and was spoken of by its devs to have numerous classes to try and for players to enjoy them.
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And youâre part of the whining too. Whining not to change transcendence so only a very small group of players can continue to reap enormous benefits and advantages over others. 
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Its fair and square. If you think i had the advantage on the trade or silver and want to refund your shards. Then give me back my royalties too. Oh! ok you dont want my items back, ok sure! because thats fair to you, ill just let it be. 
no problem.
IMC should implement refund features on Auction. For example you listed these shards but someone bought it. There should be an option to refund that sold shards. So it is fair and square.
Doesnât matter how long you farm, youâll never catch up to the RMT.
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