P2W Model Prevents People From Playing & Enjoying The Game

[NasiBubur]

Western audiences are impossible to please. They want everything for free. Profits from asian markets will have to subsidize the Western MMORPG business.

Wuff, even with their big salary and money exchange ???
Many asian countries are 3rd country and few 2nd country.
Western ways better in term of wealthy.

[marrun]

being wealthy means nothing when they want all free
sheesh

[CookyKim]

I prefer community not full of complaining kinders. Can I browse it here instead of current?

I’m sorry but I don’t know what this means.

[9thNight]

Seriously this not gonna happen. Deal with it!
Make ur own game if want f2p without cash shop. Just try make ro private server (most simple game u can make ur own) and see if u can survive longer by urself.

[Biscuit]

Top line salaries mean nothing.
Asian countries have a more people who have disposable to spend on f2p MMOs.
Also the “wealthy” western people mostly don’t have time to play.

I think you underestimate how expensive to live in western countries. I moved to Asia 5 years ago and I have 3x the disposal income than when I was in the US, and that’s excluding bonuses. Asian companies cover the majority of your expenses and the taxes are low. Thus asian gamers have a ton of money to spend, with many being able to well afford $2000-3000 USD a month no problem.

Nexon is one of the few f2p gaming company that is publicly traded. Just read their annual report and see how much more profitable Asia is compared to the NA market.

[svalinn85]

Yeah well… no one is really arguing with the tax reduction or the exp increase and such… but if the stat booster are usable in PvP then the game automatically become P2W and it’s completely fcked… that’s the main point of it.

[ventlus]

just saying your misinterpreting peoples views, to further your own views. People are fine with a cash shop they don’t want P2win elements in it. Stated items you can’t get without the cash shop, gambling elements stuff like that. And from what i understand ICM was talking about creating a headpiece item that can be tripple stated, so that sounds pretty OP to me. If it’s a slight upgrade, then i don’t care. And this argument is for the sake of balancing pvp. If one team can have way better stats just because they pay for money, kind of ruins the point of pvp. So all these moba’s are popular with cash shops because they are purely cosmetic, and your skill is what impacts the actual game.

costumes i don’t care about (unless they are stated then that would be lame), i don’t care about tokens either. The magic scrolls, would be an issue if the drop rate is so ridiculous low that it forces people to go to cash shop.

[kekipai]

In my honest opinion, I think most people here are failing to see the bigger picture. The REAL P2W thing about this token system/cash shop is how you can sell the items to other people. If it is true what people are saying, these things cost up to 2m on the Korean servers, someone who just freshly started the game can just use a token themselves and stack up on some more to sell to other people. BAM, instant character progression because guess what? In-game currency is used to advance your character’s attributes. It’s like legal RMT. Injecting real world currency into a virtual one is just so wrong, we don’t need that.

+3 movement speed is absolutely nothing when you look at the bigger problem here. The magic scrolls are another problem and they should completely purge that. Either go P2P or B2P with membership/cosmetic cash shop, F2P is going to doom this game if they keep at it.

[CookyKim]

Players running around with perfect stats in hats would be extremely rare if not impossible, thats pretty acceptable.

Acceptable to you, perhaps. But it doesn’t reduce the fact the stats on the headgear were Cash shop exclusive. Stats on cash shop exclusives is generally perceived as P2W.

If they changed that, we might find ourselves into more disgusting features.

The threat of a worse P2W feature should not be a justification for a lesser P2W feature. If anything the worse P2W should raise a greater protest than the lesser P2W.

---

@Addiktion

Because you kids don’t know what real P2W is. A hat that takes an absurd amount of money to get good stats that isn’t even completely gamebreaking and 10% movement speed that doesn’t apply in PvP Arenas. Honest fking joke that you clueless idiots are complaining about.

Also, in a very large scale PvP, a single person having 10% more movement speed isn’t going to make a big impact on the fight

(actually this is wrong because not just “a single person” has that 10%, its the Paying vs the non paying.)

And my point is that these stats are insignificant in-game. Hence why these people are crybabies, crying about something so small, hence why I said you guys don’t know what real P2W is.

You’re talking out of your ass now, no evidence, can’t even call this a theory. You people are overreacting and crying over small insignificant buffs.

You have made multiple claims that because these “buffs” (the correct term is P2W stats) are insignificant, we shouldn’t be bothered.

Then please explain to me:

• If they are so insignificant why were they included as a feature of the item in the first place? Why not just sell plain cosmetics without stats?
• If it is so insignificant it must be a poor performer in the cash shop because no one is interested in it. So why not just remove the poor performer in the cash shop?
• If it is truly so insignificant, why do you even bother if it is there or not. If you don’t bother if it is there or not, then why do you care if it is removed?

The argument that it is insignificant is not internally consistent. Obviously it is significant that’s why it is included in the cash shop to entice the players to pay for it. Players buy it because they know they will have a leg up versus players that do not pay. If it is insignificant, then there is far more reason to remove it than to keep it there.

The argument that these P2W items are insignificant do not hold true.

---

@nasibubur12

Developer spend YEARS to make this game, and you want all FREE?

You’re missing the point of this thread. We’re talking about P2W not F2P.

is there any super power item that make you OP

magic scroll ( you can get in game too ) that give additional stats

You’re contradicting yourself here.

Like others said above, it’s to save TIME.

Stats are not there primarily to “save time” (it will, but it’s not the main purpose), it is there to have a leg up on non-paying players.

All token bonus will save your time to build your characters.Especially market tax, it’ll save many your times for silvers / items farms.

No one is arguing about exp / tax reduction here.

So with spend money you can keep the game stay alive.

No one is arguing about whether we should pay or not pay IMC to keep the game well funded.

You’re really long post in the end is just: missing the main point of this thread.

P2W my ASS

You’ve not make a single supporting argument towards that claim. Congratulations.

---

@9thNight

Seriously this not gonna happen. Deal with it!

And so we are.

---

@kekipai

he REAL P2W thing about this token system/cash shop is how you can sell the items to other people.

It’s actually a legit way to RMT for IMC. It’s actually a good thing in my opinion, but I won’t get into details here.

+3 movement speed is absolutely nothing when you look at the bigger problem here. The magic scrolls are another problem and they should completely purge that.

They are both problems. Big or small they should ideally be resolved.

[kaixermax]

Developer spend YEARS to make this game, and you want all FREE?

Who said that?

Tell me more brotha

[lans1234567890]

Ok if you dont want all for free what are you willing to pay for and what tou are not?

[CookyKim]

Cosmetics (headgear, costume, hair color, hair design), Token without stats, cute mounts.

Won’t pay for any stats from cash shop, OP cash potion.

For me P2W is a game breaker and I will personally boycott the cash shop if P2W is implemented. (Which means no EA / Token subscription)

Other people may have better ideas that I missed here. Of-course I’ll pay for them if it doesn’t affect game balance, and makes the game fun for everyone.

[jynxie10]

Acceptable to you, perhaps. But it doesn’t reduce the fact the stats on the headgear were Cash shop exclusive. Stats on cash shop exclusives is generally perceived as P2W.

The threat of a worse P2W feature should not be a justification for a lesser P2W feature. If anything the worse P2W should raise a greater protest than the lesser P2W.

If you yourself is agreeing to the fact that the current magic scroll is indeed lesser to those worst P2W games, then what you claiming of we are heading for worst dont stand if anything, it maybe a sign IMC dont like the worst P2W features. Changing them into something you like may give more harm than good. Unless of course you have an alternative on your mind to make paying customer to spend their money onto this game if you dont like the current style.

[lans1234567890]

So whybany one getva token thatvgives him nothing?
Cosmetic items in a game like this will not sell so good.
YOU CAN GET THE TOKEN FROM THE AH. P2w is when you can only get it fron cash shop.
Pvp in this game is end game . at this time you will have the silver to buy a token from the AH. What the problem?

[c2gaming]

So what do I win when I buy all these “p2w” items (without actually paying real money cuz I can get them from the AH)?

[CookyKim]

So whybany one getva token thatvgives him nothing?

It still gives you EXP boost, tax reduction, item transfer between character, 5 listing slot, 1:1 trade, double attribute learning, premium gesture, increased instance dungeon entry.

YOU CAN GET THE TOKEN FROM THE AH.

(sigh 3rd time)[quote=“CookyKim, post:104, topic:153090”]
this argument again. Just because you can get it using silver doesn’t reduce it’s Cash shop exclusive status. Someone had to pay $$$ to make it into existence.
[/quote]

Edit: didn’t see this the first time round lol.

Pvp in this game is end game

More reason not to implement P2W please. [quote=“lans1234567890, post:195, topic:153090”]
at this time you will have the silver to buy a token from the AH
[/quote]
Uh, talking about move speed on the token here. Nothing wrong with the Token subscription system. Just the P2W move speed stat.

---

@jynxie10

If you yourself is agreeing to the fact that the current magic scroll is indeed lesser to those worst P2W games, then what you claiming of we are heading for worst dont stand if anything, it maybe a sign IMC dont like the worst P2W features.

I hope IMC don’t like P2W features too.

Changing them into something you like may give more harm than good.

I don’t think this is likely by just raising our opinion against P2W.

Unless of course you have an alternative on your mind to make paying customer to spend their money onto this game if you dont like the current style.

Yes, emulate what successful online games are doing now. They generally do not run P2W cash shops. Although, they are mostly MOBAs, so their strategy may or may not apply here (I think it still does).

[lans1234567890]

You win what ever this item give.
People stop makingva non problem into one. If you want all for free for all ho open a ro privet server and see how good it work like this and how much money you will lose.

People the +3 speed is what you think is p2w but not more trading? Really?

So all of you say there game doing the f2p and have nothing thatcany one can think is p2w in them. Then plz show me one gsme like this that not a moba (lol,dota,smite). Dont give me diablo as its not an mmorpg. Dont give me gw2 it selling gold in its shope and keys.

[CookyKim]

People stop makingva non problem into one.

The problem is on the title of this thread.

P2W Model (will) Prevent People From Playing & Enjoying The Game

The supporting arguments for this is in the thread discussion.

[c2gaming]

See, p2w assumes I “win” something for buying said p2w item. For example, cash shop exclusive (so non transferable/reproducible via in game) that say grants 50% more damage (x1.5 damage) let’s me “win” at pvp. What do the current cash shop items allow me to instantly win?

PS, if it wasn’t obvious, I’m one of the people who don’t think ToS is p2w (yet <- devil’s advocate eh? eh?)

[darkdie21]