Tree of Savior Forum

Make Attribute/Skill/Class more appeal and balance it

str needs dex to shine imo

dex is way too good both offensively and defensively

youll still need it as a melee attacker since armor and other forms of passive mitigation suck
which is really needed against the kind of mobs you fight later in the game at around 170ish
the best option is to stack hp and dodge or block

yeah i know STR already appeal, but DEX offer survivabilty and crit, im pretty sure u can solo anything full dex, while STR only offer damage, and as we know DEX Barb is the only great result from DEX synergy with 2H sword crit damage attribute.

i’m hoping many great build come out, coz even with many combinations of class right now, only some works or synergy too well, while other failed. if they make higher lvl skill more appeal with some decent bonus or even scale well rather than just fixed bonus each level, i’m positive we see many build with its own benefit.

its juz so sad see all that class lying there coz its not worth compare to other, this is the result of unbalanced

well the thing is, only main stat in this case for swordsman STR DEX shine, CON also Help a little
so theres only variation of those 3, i feel this is so lacks of variation and strategy

imagine all other stat also offer small benefits that shine in their own, it will make other stat beside Those 3 appeal.

if majority pick same attribute/class/skill, theres something wrong with it.

Solo full DEX? You haven’t been to mage tower 3F, or shaton farm, or greene manor? I put a DEX build up to level 120 or something, then switched to STR, because the DEX build just die around that level. You deal peanut damage to mob, to the point that it take so long that mob kill you even if they hit 1/3 of the times only.

ok im talking about full dex barbarian here, i dont play it, but read it with full attribute of dex, so i assume he can solo mostly everyhing. sry if im not clear. only this guy synergy too well. and majority will take him.

and what i expected from this topic was attribute balance, not talking about which stat supperior to the other.

i think dex evade need to be nerfed, if targeted by let say 2 monster/people, it will reduce evasion or something, perhaps 1.3 of total accuracy from those 2. its just example here, they need to think how to balance it.

we need more variations of class/attribute/skills people willing to take so the game will be more interesting, because each of them was balanced and good to play.

you need diffrent items for dex to work offensively

things like golden falchion, velniup, trinity sword and gladiator bands sell high because they offer alot of crit damage which you can effectively interchange for str

dex by itself is a bad stat if you want to deal damage but if your gearing properly then you should be rolling with a lot of dex (most non barb/highlander people i know float at 200-250) then mix in str when you reach 300 crit chance, and wear leather armor for more evasion

and yes ive been to those places and more, having played 2 classes to 200 and another to 190, i can safely say that melee attackers are mostly dex based and gear towards crit damage on items so they can get the full benefits of crit and get the oh so important evasion stat which is needed to tackle physical based mobs at the higher levels.

magic damage has no counter atm, cloth armor and bracers do little to mitigate it

int and str need to give armor and magic res respectively
spr should give something like spell dodge or spell block
con should give block chance

the problem is, dex is both good offensively and defensively, simply gearing for a crit build makes you tankier which is odd, since a crit build should be on the squishy side.

yeah as long people consider what to take that means its balanced, rather than limited by Main attribute.

for dex they should make some restriction like i say before

some other might have briliant insight how to balance the game, but im expecting a lot from their game mechanics/architect to make it balance, use scaling not just fixed value. make higher attribute/circle/skill more appealing and balanced entirely, usually cap max bonus or only several bonus can be activate, example only 2 class bonus attribute can be activated.

Thing is with a couple of green gems (level 6 if you can reach it) you have all the crit chance you need. A level 5 green gem give you 27 crit chance, equivalent to 27 stat points. If you put that 27 into STR you would get a lot more than 27 STR.

At that point DEX serve as much as just evasion increment. Now if you face mobs with high accuracy, or just simply magic, a STR/CON build is much better.

It all boils down to min-maxing. If you can survive mobs attack without evasion, then no point putting all DEX since you kill 2-3 times faster with STR build, you don’t even take that much damage. Even more so if you can just get into a party with healer.

Like I said above the only class that can carry high DEX build is barbarian due to their high innate attack. And I also question their viability in PvP as well

well, if you constantly fighting mobs with 30-40k hp that hit for up to 2k damage, then evading them is probably a better solution than getting rammed by attacks

some classes can be safe if they have enough damage, doppels for example, but for something like a tank (pelt or rod) gearing up for dodge or block or going very heavy into con is necessary to fight packs of elite mobs toe to toe
also classes like monks like to go heavy into dex since they have a lower hp pool, dodging is way better to mitigate damage

This is the third time i quote myself, and, i do believe that the lack of Agi and Luck is what is hurting the balance.

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i myself prefer archer damage from str, because archer pull those string back ahead haha :laughing:

while dex stick for crit and evade so other class can use this the same, the thing is other stat not appeal enough to take and evade got no penalty when mob many monster.

while everyone get same defense from their armor without any attribute required to wear it.

The string of a bow does not require too much strenght to be pulled, or even overdrawn, thus, strenght is not as useful as a stat like DEX should be, but, right now, in the simplistic way that IMC decided to handle those numbers, every non magic using class will opt for strenght in the early game, and after a certain point they just reset it to go full DEX, thats because there is no luck nor agi, making DEX the most wanted stat ingame, for offense and defense with no real drawbacks.

Just to make it clear, agi, short of agility, regulates atack speed and dodge, and luck, slightly regulates your finesse and directly didctates your critical rate.
And right now, DEX does what AGI and LUCK does combined.

i stop argue about str bow =D

back to topic, yeah Dex right now kinda imbalance, thats why they need to make other attribute more appealing for us to choose.

to be honest i’m expecting some attribute to raise our attack speed, our casting time, just make sure not only Dex gain all benefit.

I hope they use formula such as using 1.3 of average mob’s accuracy they tank. or even better with scale monster quantity to tank ( 0.8+( 0.2 x monster_quantity ) ) x average_accuracy_monster so if theres only 1 monster the result was 1 x monster_accuracy, if got 2 monster then 1.2 x average_accuracy_monster, if 3 monster then 1.4 x average_accuracy_monster

Honestly people who harp dex is full of it.

dex builds require very specific equipment, and requirements. Otherwise you fail hard.

In the world of stat reset scrolls and skill reset scrolls, it’s great, since you can just change when you feel like changing, but on release, once you hit a wall, you hit that wall hard.

evade and crit is good when you’re above or near the level of the monster, but once you’re under it, you’re just going to get shredded, and hit an impossible wall. Double that if you have magic/debuff/archer monsters. Nothing like getting eaten without even a chance to drink a potion or run.

Since it seems higher level focuses on PT play, having balance stats or hybrids is a lot more promising then pure dex. You’re not going to dodge much, and when you can dodge it, it’s not worth the dodge, compared to when you can’t dodge it, and can’t even react for the healer to heal.

Barb’s are fairy feasible, since they can rely on natural abilities but I don’t see other classes even attempt full dex. But even then, full dex is pretty underwhelming on higher levels, especially when you consider a hybrid barb can probably do just as well, and not need super specific gear (some gems and natural skills don’t need massive crit rate, nor evades)

Unless you got a priest with you, really, dex people just go splatt…really splatt, unless they’re vasely over leveled, and just there for an ez run.

I feel that cbt people are really spoiled by the rampant icoins and lack of long term thinking.

it’s like RO crit-sins where they just go completely worthless hitting a wall once the content catches up. There’s just no fixing things like hybrids.

And honestly you don’t need that much dex to hit stuff…oh wait, those vubbe gloves…why are you still using it >.>

I agree with your post , i think they could be more creative with the game skill atributes , status points and skills , and the relation between them.
i totally agree with @onimage20 too , Agi/Luck would fit well in this game.
And i personaly think that an Attack speed feature based on Agi would fit this game well too, since between your skills delay you will be using your auto attack to inflict damage. (if different weapons would have different ASPD. it would be nice too)

it would be nice to have features like:

Dex(or SPR) that scales reducing a bit of some skills casting time.

A skill that has less cooldown the more you have Agi (Or DEX)

Holpite skill “Stabbing” - increase the number of hits based on the character base AGI.

Linker skill “Joint Penalty” - increase the AoE of the skill target based on skill level while increasing the skill casting time.

Psychokino “Psychic Pressure” - Increase the skill range based on skill level. and the Max duration of the skill would be based on the character INT ( Or SPR )

Dievdirby “Statue of Goddess Laima” Increase the AoE and cooldown reduction of the statue by some % and a bonus based on caster DEX

Thaumaturge “Swell Left Arm” it also increases Physical damage AoE ratio every ‘X’ skill lvl.

Rogue “Backstab” If the damage dealt with this skill is a critical damage it deals X% more damage.

Ranger “Critical Shot” it would have a higher critical rate based on character DEX.

These are just some raw ideas of how skills could relate with character status and some different skill scaling (rather than only boosting the damage per skill level).

And i hope that they drop the flat atk damage formula , since it would be harder to balance and create cool skills mechanics and stat distribuition with it.

well you right, but the thing is right not only DEX gain offensive and defensive attribute compare to others

and evade in my opinion should be calculated on monster quantity you fight, i prefer game mechanics where more monster you fighting, the greater each monster accuracy against you, this at least make evade more make sense and balance, then people will start considering to fill other attribute.
This also will make solo much harder challenge so people will Start to Party more, im hoping player will start depend on each other this will make MMORPG not just casual RPG where you can solo everything.

I remember in RO(i know this is TOS not RO) Boss was so hard, u need to rely to each other, boss movement speed/damage/mob summon/area skill was so Great where you hardly solo one and start play as a Party, i loves when party because i’m not alone having comrades with same goal.

i hope people will agree more and IMC will start considering this
Their game not balance enough, lack of various class build they provide that will synergy, lack of various stat distribution because other stat not appeal.

True, if some stat will gain Attack Speed/ faster Cast Time, this will make the game strategy better choosing between damage or speed. And also various attribute people loves to choose, because right now all i see was majority Dex build, its like Dex Of Saviors :expressionless: where the game was based on some stat that gain more benefits compare others. in open beta i believe majority will pick Dex build. because they already seen how great it was, and the game will lost dependency to other player.

they should make some skill only works for party more. push people to play as party instead solo, make party more appeal than solo such giving some spot faster spawn because theres party on top of it.
or make higher drop rate, but i prefer faster spawn on their area.

i loves your idea about skills too, rich feature make player considering each of them, trully they need scaling each skill level bonus, not just simple fixed number, it makes higher skill not appeal so much.
even with so many benefit even small, they can cap it too make it balance if it feels not balance enough.

higher skill should gain more benefits compare to lower one(gain faster cooldown, more aoe ratio, more damage, more status etc)
and dont juz make some attribute Fixed number by only pick at level 1, make them scale too for higher level, such that 2H Mastery in circle 1 only 15% crit damage, if you pick highlander circle 2 then you gain more 31% crit damage + aoe ratio 1, if you pick circle 3 then you gain 50% crit damage + aoe ratio 3.

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Or…maybe they’re just sly, and when all those OBT people with dex builds hit a wall at high levels, they spend real money buying reset scrolls, because they’re stuck in a rut.

Dex is not almighty, and really falls off hard after their golden era.

Dex is basically good when everything else is also good, dex is horrible, when everything else is kinda bad.

What I do think is add more relivant resist to other stats.

Con for instance should lower chance of stun/knockback/knock down a little. Str should raise block, and Int should lower interruption(or a stat call magic evade/resist).

if thats the thing, they already ruin themself since beginning. Because when player realize this game dont offer so much such various build / teamplay / strategy, they will start leaving the game for sure.

i’m not saying Dex Almighty, it just right now Only Dex that gain benefits in offensive(critical damage) and defensive(evade) while other stat got less benefit that’s not appeal so much like Dex.

as i said many times before, other stat need more benefits so people will get various build.
if majority still thinks dex great, and all solo, what for they create MMORPG instead of just RPG

i just hoping they realize this sooner, when people prefer solo rather than party because they can, this will make party less appeal, evade need nerf cut player evade based on mob quantity for sure.