I see the way u guys think.
But a continue thinking that this restriction will not change the token monopoly and continue hurting the legit players and may hurt too the afk players but will too hurt more legit players who plays and profit by beting in market prices.
I see the problem but i just dont think this is a good solution
over other things like changing the way imc is doing things
Buy with real money? IMC gotta eat too ya know. If you canāt afford 99TP per month you got no business in playing games and IMC shouldnāt bother targeting that segment of players anyway.
It will hurt everyone, I can be wrong on what you are trying to convey here but I will try.
You say that if things change, it will piss off whoever is under restriction since the beginning? If that is the case, me and Lunar are here since iCBT (me from the first and he from second).
Now, the restrictions are hurting everyone, the RMTers and bots donāt give a ā ā ā ā , for them, it only mean will take a little more time to hit where they want to get.
I can be wrong here also, but I think you are fixed on @LunarRabbit idea too much, indeed he gave a suggestion, but we are here too to work on it, as I too did suggest to let us trade tokens via 1:1 trade.
Get everyone who suggested something here, filter what would be bad and gather what would be good and try to form a new suggestion, that is the thing here.
I donāt care if 1 or 10 will be butt hurt because of changes, Iām thinking about the whole thing, our side and IMCās side.
Also, allowing AFK farm shows only that the game donāt have anything to offer except an environment for toxic behavior.
Iām not saying to ban who do, but they can do something to not allow it either, same for botting, I myself gave a suggestion about special mobs with hidden buffs that would send the bots to a different channel and would only get out of there after GM confirmation.
We too, and I donāt excrete money to waste in something that itās not worth tho.
To be fair the restrictions came after there was a time in the betas when we had a free market and trading.
The problem is when you have a closed group of people buying too many Tokens for it. For example, thereās literally no reason for a legit player to buy up to 100 Tokens in the same week. It gets more damaging than good for everyone else and for himself. And it is something that have been happening.
The point isnāt to completely revolutionize the Token Market and the game but to make it fair as something people can buy instead of a savage profit tool only used by the ones who doesnāt need any effort to buy Tokens, which hurts everyone and themselves.
@thebloodyaugust not sure I think he said it more in a way to show how long we have been playing and living under the restrictions. It shows how bad token restrictions are.
But players forcing those restrictions on other takes it to another level.
As @Nirimetus point there are more ways to prevent the current issue.
@CyroDoctor also, if someone is buying Tokens with real money to play the game it is all fine. But when you get to the point youāre spending real money because someone else is forming a monopoly on top of some Premium stuff it is pretty much an unhealthy thing pretty much on the borders of the RMT issue.
I already knew that on Beta we had leeway with things, since we where only testing and everything would be wiped out in the end.
The thing is, the restrictions are too heavy, non-token user can only sell 1 item in the market and wait 24hs to retrieve the money, after trading using 1:1 the item become untradable.
While with token you can put up to 10 items in market, retrieve the money right away, trade 1:1 without losing potential and the item still tradable (except mats, recipes and consumables).
In 24hs time frame an item you want to buy can increase in value, so a non token user have to wait more to be able to buy it.
Forgot to mention, it happened to me when Tokens where 1.2mil last year, I when to buy it after selling some stuff for days, when I looked, the value was 2mil.
Oh yeah, and non token users canāt store they money, if you go with your money to 3+ stars maps you are bound to lose your hard earned money because the game donāt allow you to use Team Storage and donāt have a char storage for silver.
You also have to consider the amount of inflation that is happening in the market and the game itselfā¦
The silver sink is not effective actually just fyi. Esp for those who focus on a single character. With shiet tons of Alt. Itās pretty much peanuts.
Having more farmer diversity of mats also generate more silver some what and circulation is around. soā¦
Edit add in: the silver shiny mobs and gold shiny mobs. On a day average i find at least 1-3 of them. After a day with my pal in farming mats on average the silver gain is more than 12m. Yes 12m.
(considering as a Thau the split off is 50 : 50 for silver gain. So you can imagine how much is made pure silver just from farming 12hours)
Sorry to say this, but i dont like your argumentsā¦
1.- Buying tokens is IMC legit way to combat RMT, doesnt matter where the silver comes from, it will reach to the user that put the token in the marketā¦ later if they find a bot they will kill it, but the user that bought a token will get the silverā¦
2.- Even at 3 per account doesnt matter 1 bitā¦ instead of having 10 accounts, now they will have 1000 acountsā¦ RMT silver is always passed between multiple chars and accounts already so it really doesnt matterā¦
3.- IF i was high end player or hardcore or w/e you may want to call it, i myself would have bought a bunch of 2m tokens and sold them for 2.5 in this event, hence, limiting the tokens bought from market would have hindered it (have done things like this in other games and made a bunch of that game moneyā¦ tis basic economics)
4.- Finally, instead of PUNISHING āAGAINā the players due to RMT or Botters or w/e illegal thingā¦ why not punish them instead?? having more resources towards bot hunting and ACTUALLY making a statement about what is allowed for AFK and whats notā¦So far Necro AFK is grey area, Sorc is a big NO, Warlocks running with macro are also a NO, and pet afk farming in dungeon is OKā¦ So then next time you see a same path Warlock, or a AFK Necro, or a autopot Sorcā¦ you reportā¦ then the GM list the report by number and then checkā¦ but for that it needs to make a statement( a real one) about AFK farmingā¦
PS: best way to detect a bot is with a cryoā¦ just move them, if they dont complain in any way, most likely they are botsā¦
Also back to the point i miss out. Restricting token is one way, but itās more of killing imc itās self in this way.
There is actually various way to screw RMT around but this isnāt the way to cure the root cause.
Root cause are basically your bots, firm stand on macros and afk farming in this sense.
Killing them off is 1. Next you need to hyper deflate slivers. The basic system atm is inefficient actually in a sense it doesnāt bait or trap you hard enough to throw silver into the drain.
Once this two is gone the market will start to grow.
Then you will need your supply and demand + farmers + opportunities. Those who play eve will understand prolly what i mend.
Also you will need economical and strategic impose to control the whole economy. Monopoly is definitely needed in a way but in a healthy way.
You guys should go take a look at JP markets :^)
That is an acceptable value, due exactly the event happening, but what they are doing is, buying from 2mil to sell it for 4mil+, that is one think I donāt accept, even tho it is legal, itās a nasty way of hinder others, also, in the end, it will bite them back when they try to sell any stuff other than tokens later on, or they will simple stay as token sellers.
You have no idea how many people on the outside of the āgrey areaā we reported, just to find them at higher levels on the next week.
IMC wonāt do a thing so soon, unfortunately, they are letting the game die little by little just for neglecting what should be common sense in an MMO adminstration.
Thatās why I say we have no problems getting the silver needed for a Token. Now, look on new players or players on lower level ranges :x
Letās talk about tokens at 5m, can be cheap for us but can be pretty expensive for others.
Itās not bad if it goes up there naturally, means the silver in circulation and offer/demand are pushing it up.
But it is pretty bad if it is forced/monopoly because it pushes a price that only benefits a minority into a majority and new players.
@gaming.checho
We discussed this more along in the topic, there are more problems than bots/RMT in the token scene. Thereās also player monopoly and price control which I didnāt think of when writing the suggestion.
Iāll edit it to add those other scenarios.
1.- I agree, the player still get the silver even if someone is buying 100 tokens all at once. But in this case it is turning into effectively ālegal RMTā which hurts more than help while also making it harder for new players to buy Tokens, making it a profit tool that doesnāt even get untradable as most of other things in the economy.
2.- Again, same thing about what we discussed, 3 per account prevents market control by small number of people on Tokens.
3.- I agree, that is you. Thatās one healthy way of increasing the price. You can do the same by buying 3 per account, it gets harder because more competition. But things are getting out of control currently, theyāre far from this on multiple servers I think, at least in Klaipeda.
4.- Thereās no real punishment, 3 Tokens buys per month is pretty fair for Premium purposes. As we also talked in the thread, the monopoly isnāt illegal (also AFK farming is allowed for now) but still hurts other players too much because of bad design of other things.
Which goes exactly into what @unicorntheshiny says. It can have bad effects. I agree with both his posts to some extent.
At least one of the things should be handled.
But on a note, I wonder if it is healthy to turn Token into a āsomething that people buys to resell instead of usingā effectively turning them into legal RMT. It sure gives more money to IMC but not sure if it is healthy in how it is being done currently.
LMFAOā¦
I have to agree on this, The token prices in market now is broken I cant even imagine what is happen right now, its like scaring the newbies to buy tp to get token rather than saving silver and buy tokenā¦
It all the respect: You kind of wrotte a paradox.
You say you want this suggestion implemented to combat RMT, but when Token are in a righter price, this is exactly what make people not buy from RMT.
I will cite my serv Silute as an Example. Barely no one buy from RMT, not because they have moral or something, NO (on the contrary 
), its because the risk is not worth it, since buy a Token and sell it in game is much more easy and safe, and also, great part of RMT sell silver with a price highter than the price of a Token, so lets say that: when they (RMT) resell Tokens they are harming thenselfs.
Also, keep in mind the Market already have a Limit Price for Tokens, that is 3.5kk in Silute. So that will be the max limit an player will pay for a Token, unless IMC see that the bought of Tokens has increased due to people buying it to sell in game, so they may put it at 4M, itās bad for a new player, but for a veteran player, 3 M is still accessible.
Hold on, on which server are people selling tokens for 5mil? They are usually 2 on mine x.x
you can literally make 4-5m in 1 hour if you know howā¦
@STAFF_Yuri @STAFF_Letitia can we get some moderation here if more trolls starts appearing? It seems to be starting to change the flow of the discussion into something outside the original scope because they are confusing other users.
No, it is not to combat RMT. The idea is to prevent lack of tokens along with overpriced ones, which can be caused by a scenario from RMT, monopoly etc.
Sorry, Iāll fix the suggestion text to explicitly talk about this. It is one suggestion and there could be more ways to prevent Tokens from turning into RMT/trading tools (also, thereās no 10% tax on selling Tokens) which only benefits a small part of players while hurting the majority of playerbase.
Also, about Silute market, there have been more of these than on Klaipeda:
@ri0ti0ri I can, I know it. But do everyone in the game can? Thatās my point, by monopolizing/overpricing tokens in market (from people buying more than 10 or more Tokens per month) it gets too expensive for newer players.
And we who can buy the tokens at those prices will just keep pushing it higher if thereās lack of Tokens on market. It will keep on the same cycle while Tokens are being controlled by small groups trying to create a monopoly or pushing overpriced reselling/ālegalā RMT purposes.
Who is paying $10 for token, only who lives in US, dollar here is 3x the value, do you think, lets take me for example, would waste 30 of my currency every month to buy a premium status on a game that is on the verge of shut down, and even if that wasnāt the case, full of bugs, no solid content except mindless AFK farming, broken PvP and the same old Saalus farm?
As I said on other post above, I would waste 30 of my currency on PoE that offer better stuff like account services (stash tabs) and more decent cosmetics (one of the most neat effects to apply in gear or skills I have ever saw so far), not to count that they have a solid economy, the currency have very small fluctuation and they even have a specialized site (fan made) to deal with buying and selling that work well.
We arenāt obliged to buy TP, but the way IMC is doing business is almost forceful, exactly because of the way non-token users are even more limited.
It in fact make the player feel like a prisoner, if you donāt pay, you have to walk around with the shackles, if you can you at least walk properly, and Iām not talking about the movement speed from token.
And here I thought you had a good head over your shoulders, or is it just you trying to pick on @LunarRabbit? lol
Thatās not how you create interest on someone to buy something. People would buy tp if they feel that itās worth, to support the game and others endless reasons. People wouldnāt buy something if they feel they are being obligated to do so ( even more if this āthingā we are all talking is cash on a digital game).
Example for small mindeds: if a new player is able to buy a token in the market once, he will probably spend all the money he has and enjoy the benefits. When the token is nearly over, he probably will not have the same amount to buy again with silver, but, if he liked his experience and likes the game, he will consider buying cash.
PS: Im talking about players, not whales lel
IMO tokens appears to be the most effective way for IMC to compete with RMT/goldsellers. Also, the more higher priced the tokens are in the market, the more tempting it is for people to sell tokens for silver - even perhaps at some point making the practice more cost-effective than buying silver through goldsellers.
Limiting the playerās TP purchasing power will only hurt IMC more. IMCās interest as a business will always prevail, even above that of players.
Too bad theyāre too lazy to make tokens untradeable (but remove the P2W-ish aspects of it) making it a premium subscription model, and instead focus on producing quality cosmetics and effects microtransactions alongside other pay-for-convenience options that wonāt break the game nor sh!t on new players who are still undecided on whether or not the gameās worth their time and money.
But hey, itās been proven time and again that a lot of players are willing to āpay to winā, and that the model outputs a big amount of profit in a short amount of time, with less effort and expenses.
EDIT: My bad, I misread the title and went TLDR. TP shop != market. 
Still stand for what I said though (even if off-topic).
