Intense Class Balancing, Here We Go

[soldatazur]

imo = in my opinion

Really Captain Obvious :> ?

The reason I said that Krivis has a benefit from free stat-choice is that he can boost his survivability and/or attack values.

It’s not a free stat-choice anyway, not because of the class but because of the game system itself.

That’s why it synergizes way more with physical attack builds (e.g. Monk/Inquisitor) that benefit from both Zalciai(crit resistance reduction) and Aukuras (accuracy debuff; this is especially potent on a DEX-based Monk/Inquisitor as the value of evasion is increased even more) and actually need STR to hit the targets.

Did something change, is it a build people are doing now ? When I was playing this game I never saw a single Krivis Monk Inquisitor. If you’re talking about a Krivis buffing a Monk Inquisitor, fine, but guess what, Priest is really good at this job too, if not much better than a Krivis. If we are really talking about how those classes are doing their support job, then you have to think about what a Krivis is giving to 5 players (including himself) compared to a Priest. And that’s a fact, not an opinion.

On top of it, the current scaling of Krivis’ skills makes it less punishing to have buffs/debuffs not maxed in contrast to Priest (might change with the upcoming balance changes,though; my guess is that Divine Stigma and Aukuras will recieve some sort of scaling with stats, let’s just hope that it’s not scaling with SPR).

It actually makes it way more punishing as you don’t have ratio, so your stats are useless for almost all buff effects… Only your skills points can save your character. I don’t get how is it less punishing.

Also, we must not forget that the developers already balanced Priest, but are now focusing on balancing Krivis,Oracle and Druid, so we might see some great changes on Krivis in the near future that makes him even more viable than Priest for a lot of Class-/party settings.

Let’s just hope they make Krivis viable, not more viable than Priest.

[anon55982834]

Did something change, is it a build people are doing now ? When I was playing this game I never saw a single Krivis Monk Inquisitor.

That’s strange,though, because there are Priest>Monk>Inquisitors,although Krivis actually has more synergy with Monk than Priest.

then you have to think about what a Krivis is giving to 5 players (including himself) compared to a Priest

Yeah a maximum 30% rise on Blessing and Sacrament (if the Priest actually has as much SPR as the shop Pardoners) + a Stone Skin for the people who actually don’t have enough mdef. Revive and Ressurection are so optional, I’m always angry if someone clogs the buff slots with useless Revive that does nothing if you actually aren’t naked.
If I want Monstrance I scroll the skill. 700 silver for 320 seconds isn’t that expensive.
Daino costs 5 times as much(i.e. 3500 silver) if you want level 5 in comparison for the same time.

It actually makes it way more punishing as you don’t have ratio, so your stats are useless for almost all buff effects… Only your skills points can save your character. I don’t get how is it less punishing.

It’s less punishing because you can spread the skillpoints more without becoming useless. If a Priest spreads his skillpoints more (e.g. only level 10 Blessing/level 5 Sacrament) his buffs will become worse than the 30% reduced buffs from Pardoner shops in town, so he can’t do this. This is why I stated that non-statscaling buffs can be advantageous, especially if they are scrollable and the effects depend on the caster of the skill.

I never said that it’s “good”, it’s just “less punishing” to spread stats and skills compared to Priest. That’s why:

It’s not a free stat-choice anyway, not because of the class but because of the game system itself.

Is wrong. You can build all builds with all stats with Krivis, while Priest builds either are locked to SPR or have to give up on the usual Priest buffs (which might be an interesting solution to the initial problem of having less points; e.g. a Chaplain going full DEX/CON or DEX/INT for more ASPD and damage with Aspergillum)

Let’s just hope they make Krivis viable, not more viable than Priest.

This is actually what’s going to happen, because Priest can be easily substituted by equipment (Revive/Ressurection become useless) and Pardoner buff shop (unlimited Blessing/Aspersion/Sacrament for 45 minutes);
If Krivis gets any better there is no way that actual gameplay need a Priest in the party anymore, rather a Krivis for support skills without having to spend on scrolls every time.

[soldatazur]

Yeah a maximum 30% rise on Blessing and Sacrament (if the Priest actually has as much SPR as the shop Pardoners)

Blessing has a maximum hit times (currently), it’s the main reason for having a Priest in your team. It is also funny to see how you see Pardoners and Priests, like Pardoners were selling their buffs without a single Priest circle.

Revive and Ressurection are so optional

As I said, no, not in all cases.

If I want Monstrance I scroll the skill. 700 silver for 320 seconds isn’t that expensive.

Daino costs 5 times as much(i.e. 3500 silver) if you want level 5 in comparison for the same time.

Are you trying to compare Monstrance and Daino on their price and not on their effect ? Daino is a must have in most cases, Monstrance is just a bonus. Still Daino is the result of a bad game design.

It’s less punishing because you can spread the skillpoints more without becoming useless.

??? No ? I explained why.

If a Priest spreads his skillpoints more (e.g. only level 10 Blessing/level 5 Sacrament) his buffs will become worse than the 30% reduced buffs from Pardoner shops in town, so he can’t do this.

As stated above, Priest is mostly here in your party because Blessing has hit count limit. Revive is really good in some situations, and Mass Heal which is an alternative way to heal your team is way better than any support skill from Krivis (except Daino). Both Krivis and Priest are punished if they spread points.

This is why I stated that non-statscaling buffs can be advantageous, especially if they are scrollable and the effects depend on the caster of the skill.

I don’t get this part, certainly because you’r not explaining why it’s less punishing. Zialciai lvl 1 ~= 15 ? No ratios actually means you need to put more points into a skill like Zialciai, Aukuras, Divine Stigma…

Is wrong.

Is no wrong, you’re just not getting what I mean. There are not many ways to build a charcater, that’s all.

a Chaplain going full DEX/CON

now I understand why you missed my point.

[anon55982834]

As stated above, Priest is mostly here in your party because Blessing has hit count limit. Revive is really good in some situations, and Mass Heal which is an alternative way to heal your team is way better than any support skill from Krivis (except Daino). Both Krivis and Priest are punished if they spread points.

Blessings hitcount was removed,though, so there is no reason to go for Priest if you can get 45+ minutes Blessing from Pardoner.
Revive is so bad, it’s only useful on undergeared people and in TBL.
I never saw anyone actually get even close to death when there was Revive around, so I can tell that it’s a useless skill. If you die in higher content, your equipment is simply not suited for the difficulty or you’re a pauper that doesn’t buy/use potions.

Mass Heal? Aukuras & Squire foods + Restoration scroll actually do a better job than Mass Heal in keeping people alive…

Are you trying to compare Monstrance and Daino on their price and not on their effect ? Daino is a must have in most cases, Monstrance is just a bonus. Still Daino is the result of a bad game design.

I compare them because you can buy both and Monstrance is the only useful buff from Priest that you can’t get through Pardoner buff shop.

??? No ? I explained why.

I explained why but you can’t seem to get my point at all.
Priest skills are bad at low levels (except for Monstrance) while Krivis skills are still decent even at lower levels. If you fail to see this point of comparison, you oughta play Priest with level 5 on all skills and tell your experience…

I don’t get this part, certainly because you’r not explaining why it’s less punishing. Zialciai lvl 1 ~= 15 ? No ratios actually means you need to put more points into a skill like Zialciai, Aukuras, Divine Stigma…

You don’t need to put that many points into the skills simply because you don’t lose much. Blessing,Sacrament,Aspersion all lose a multiplier per level not skilled, while Krivis skills usually (with the exception of part of Zalciai) just lose a flat value per level, so you lose only once.
Priest loses twice because he needs the level and the stat, the more you have from the stat the more you lose per multiplier…

[soldatazur]

Blessings hitcount was removed,though, so there is no reason to go for Priest if you can get 45+ minutes Blessing from Pardoner.

Already ? Tooltip is wrong then.

I never saw anyone actually get even close to death when there was Revive around, so I can tell that it’s a useless skill.

Your experience =/= experience from other people. It is where you are wrong.

Mass Heal? Aukuras & Squire foods + Restoration scroll actually do a better job than Mass Heal in keeping people alive…

But Aukuras has a high CD, can be destroyed by monsters, and like you say need 2 other skills to be useful. It’s like saying ArcherC1 is super strong because you are using Blessing and Sacra from a shop -_-…

Priest skills are bad at low levels (except for Monstrance) while Krivis skills are still decent even at lower levels. If you fail to see this point of comparison, you oughta play Priest with level 5 on all skills and tell your experience…

I think you missed this :

Both Krivis and Priest are punished if they spread points.

Plus you are mixing everything at the same time. We talk about support skills and you start to talk about damage skills (Zaibas and such). Now you start to talk about a Priest and a Krivis at lower levels, we were not talking about low level content. Your way to argue is just going in off-topic .

You don’t need to put that many points into the skills simply because you don’t lose much.

Melstis, you lose the duration increase, Stigma you lose a big amount of STR/INT and buff duration, Daino you lose maximum count (but this skill doesn’t really need to be maxed at the moment), Aukuras you lose HP recovery time decrease, hp recovery and torch duration. If you really wanna talk about damaging skills, you lose number of hits for Zaibas if you’re a Krivis C3 and dont put 15 points in this skill.

edit: Now I think about it, you’re half right, it’s less punishing for Krivis because they have less skills. 6 skills for Krivis and 9 for Priest. But now it depends on what you are doing. You don’t really need to max revive, resu, exorcise, monstrance, sacrament. Skills where the ratio is affected by level of skill : Blessing, Aspersion.

[anon55982834]

Now you start to talk about a Priest and a Krivis at lower levels, we were not talking about low level content. Your way to argue is just going in off-topic

Lower skill levels…

Melstis is so niche, it has 60 seconds CD so it only works well in combo with Sadhus Transmit Prana. All other Krivis skills have a so-so scaling; You lose 8 points of STR/INT per Divine Stigma level, 0,5 seconds HP recovery time reduction and 10 seconds lasting time on Aukuras, 164% damage on Zaibas per level.
I think it’s pretty ok if you don’t max the skills.

Btw, given the new upcoming Krivis changes, Dainos scaling might become interesting, maybe we will see many people maxing Daino now for autoattacks.
Aukuras also becomes great with the new attribute, but you need at least level 6 Aukuras to have 100% uptime (since the lasting time is reduced to 20% of the initial value and the new CD will be 30 seconds with the attribute, you need 30x5=150 seconds lasting time for 100% uptime with the attribute active).

Divine Stigma will become the best skill,though, 6 seconds CD & 15 seconds DOT on top of the stat boost when the monster is killed within the 15 seconds.

[soldatazur]

Lower skill levels…

Not my fault !

so it only works well in combo with Sadhus Transmit Prana.

No, read topic.

You lose 8 points of STR/INT per Divine Stigma level, 0,5 seconds HP recovery time reduction and 10 seconds lasting time on Aukuras, 164% damage on Zaibas per level.

I think it’s pretty ok if you don’t max the skills.

It’s still big, you’re not going to have DS lvl 9, Zaibas lvl 14, Aukuras lvl 14. https://tos.neet.tv/skill-planner#41333..1f4f5a

But hey Krivis is reworked anyway, nerf inc :>.