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As long as it’s still open world PvP, no IMC can’t ever truly avoid abuse.
This isn’t something inherent to the game, it’s inherent to the people.
You can see the same thing with that thread crying about Alchemist potions being dirt cheap on market due to people undercutting each other.
In some way it might even reduce actual GvG war.
Yes there’ll be more people doing GvG, but they won’t be doing PvP since that’s less rewarding than just trading kills.
Well, if the game supports botting then yes I would.
Much like how I’d say that reaching level 70 in Diablo 3 (someone did that in 33 seconds albeit, not solo) is not as satisfying as reaching level cap in ToS, heck just reaching lv 200 would still give more satisfaction in that regard compare to D3.
Not saying that edgy looks doesn’t attract the crowds, but given the art direction so far I’m not sure we’ll get that ‘edgy’ look ever.
But then again, that’s all just your opinion 
What is so much wrong with each part of the game to give the player a feeling
To avoid abuse in the game, GM’s have to make limits and gain control of the game to avoid the abuse. In pve abuses are botting, that is controlled by limited trade, character/account bind items. While in pvp/gvg it would be selling rewards for lots of in game currency, what can be again controlled by making the items account/character bound, including he pvp/gvg rewards (like war coins, ect). Trading wins in gvg can be controlled by limiting the amount of rewards at a time and disabling you from doing gvg for X amount of time. But all this abuses and how to deal with them are to the GM’s do decide and ALL can be dealt with.
Every content in a game is made to be played. If there is no reward to it nobody will do it. No matter how much someone likes pve, if you be killing tons of mobs and get nothing in return would you keep on doing It? If you are doing a freaking hard dungeon but you get no reward for managing it, would you ever again repeat the dungeon? The answer is no, you won’t enjoy it, nor you would feel like you accomplished something. The same goes for gvg, pvp or any content in a game.
If nobody is willing to play a part of the game, that part would become a waste of effort the programmers, designers, everyone in inc placed in to make it.
If I would make a feature in a game as a programer that never would be used by players or wpuld be used by a really low amount, I would feel like I failed at it.
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what feeling? if ‘a feeling’ is enough then the disgust from seeing p2w shops is not wrong either?
Which also affect normal GvG people as well, and does not change the fact that trading wins is still faster/easier than actually ‘doing’ GvG.
Reward of doing PvP is the joy/thrill of PvP itself.
As for whether I’ll kill some mob constantly? Well, if it’s a fun fight I’ll do it. I played Monster Hunter a lot so fighting something for the FUN of fighting it and not the reward of defeating it is nothing abnormal to me.
Life must really suck for you who can’t seem to find joy in the action itself and must have a carroy dangling in front of your face before doing anything huh.
1st of all, this is off topic. We are not talking about cash shop here, the thread can be found here , and there are many other threads about it.
2nd as I said and as some other said what you might have missed:
Trading wins is one of the abuses I have been talking about.
3rd what i wanted to say with no reward i mean killing monsters all over WITHOUT gaining any experience or items from them. I will enjoy killing 100 of them or so but doing it all over the whole day, for weeks I would get sick of it as every reasonable person. The same goes for any feature in a game.
Thanks for your worrying about my life. I am currently very happy, and i am about to get married and have a peaceful life with my husband. 
Please try not to act rude in the future.
If you are unable to accept someone’s else opinion you should just quit this discussion at once. From all you’ve said i take you as a very closed mind person with low experience in the gaming world at all. It really doesn’t matter for how long you have been playing games, you just don’t seem to understand the basics of games or game design.
Also, your aguments are really pointless and not based on any gaming reality whatsoever, if you want to do something for the fun of it and not be rewarded, that’s your problem. But aboslutely yours only, nobody elses’s. So deal with it on your own instead of trying to push that mentality into others.
As i’ve stated before, i remain unconviced by your silly arguments that my suggestion brings absolutely no harm to the game, also, you’re repeating the same things over and over again just as if you are not reading anything at all.
This is a guild reward system suggestion, it has nothing to do with anything else but that. It is not a suggestion meant to fix the guild vs guild system, neither it can be compared to PvE or Cash Shop whatsoever. If you re-read the whole thing maybe you’ll be able to catch a glimpse of what i meant, like others did.
I can accept criticism as long as it’s based on fact, not on someone’s else incapability of understanding how games work
And I believe I said that I fought them because it’s fun to fight them, not that I got any real reward.
If you mean repeated action to the point of being sick of it, the same could be applied to GvG which would make people want to…you know, find ‘easier’ way of getting that point limit quota if the OP’s system were to get implemented…
Never heard of anyone who got punished for open world win tradings (I know it can happens with ranked system like arena), can you provide such proof?
I mean, I played Blade and Soul briefly, and there’s a daily quest to defeat players of opposing factions. People asked for kill tradings, and I have never heard of anyone getting banned for it.
Right, because saying someone should just quit the discussion is obviously such a sign of being open-minded right?
Or telling someone
So you say I have low experience in the gaming world, then proceed to say it doesn’t matter how long I’ve been playing games…? So what’s the point of that first part if the next line you’re going to invalidate the reason for you to criticize me?
Also, you advice me to quit the discussion, but if I truly am not making any good arguments, why not just ignore me?
MY argument that YOUR suggestions bring no harm? Are you sure you’ve been reading my posts?
Of course I’ll repeat my point if I believe my stance is right, I’m not Trump.
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Fine you can repeat yourself over and over all you want, but you have totally missed the point of this whole suggestion and discussion! You are talking about trading wins to acquire vanity itens! You’re talking as if there ARE people doing that while this is still just an sugesstion. You’re also talking as if there are no ways to deal with this kind of abuse, are you serious? This is basic! Now, again, if you want to do something and not get any reward just because you find it funny, that’s YOU, don’t try to force other people to agree with that, most (and i say this based on true numbers) players of any MMORPG plays for the sake of achieving new things, striving for hard-earned rewards. Now, before you go again and repeat “hard earned? trade wins yadda yadda”, IT CAN be dealt with.
Just because you haven’t seen someone getting punished for trading wins in any game before it doesn’t mean that it could never happen. This system i suggested exists in quite a couple amount of other games, yes, people do abuse it! And in some games the rewards are even game-breaking, and yet the rewards are the exactly only thing that keep the war / battleground going on, or else nobody would do it!
Example: If they would remove battleground’s rewards from World of Warcraft, do you think people would do it for the fun of it? As much as they do right now because they need? Don’t lie to yourself, maybe people would indeed do for the fun of it, but you’d probably be staying in a 20minutes guild to play a “fun” match with no rewards. This is just an utopy!
Also, when you say “will i be forced to do something i hate to get a VANITY ITEM”, are you SERIOUS? FORCED? Nobody is forcing you to do something! If you don’t want to do it, don’t do it! This is also an reality in a thousand of other games, where one does need to grind or farm his way over and over to achieve that nice looking ~thing~ that doesn’t give him any advantage but makes him look “badass”, this DOES move the game, i’m sorry if you don’t believe it, but that’s the reality.
While not in ToS, you can see it in other games that people can and will try to do less work for reward if they can get away with it, or gravitates towards the most ‘rewarding’ options i.e. daily quests that give massive exp in many MMOs.
TF2’s idle server, achievement server, etc.
If you want it within MMOs then the Blade and Soul thing I mentioned before is very similar to this.
So right after you said it can be dealt with you give me an example of a game that can’t/doesn’t bother dealing with the abuse?
Also isn’t the order of things wrong here? That the reward is the only reason people do those things and without it nobody would do it, instead of the reward being bonus for enjoying the gameplay.
There were people doing the lv 19 twinks before battleground gave exp, and honor was worthless to them, so yes people DID it.
WoW players stops doing OW PvP BECAUSE battlegrounds de-value it by making queue’d PvP have reward, thus the non-rewarding OW PvP were entirely ignored.
(I was there when South Shore vs Tarren Mill was still a thing)
What abuse? I see no abuse in World of Warcraft’s BG system. It’s a random thing so there isn’t even a way, so this argument is invalid.
Exactly my point, and why did Battlegrounds de-value it? Because there are rewards. Now imagine if there were also better rewards for players doing OW PvP in WoW, such as mounts, etc, don’t you think they would bring it back? They would. And that’s just exactly the point of my suggestion.
Rewards are important, and most of the time they’re the reason one decides to strive for something. Rewardless systems tend to fail over time, until they die out completely, just as WoW’s OW PvP did.
So i guess now you finally will be able to get my point
This abuse you mentioned:
And my argument is that people will abuse it to get those items without actually ‘playing’ the content (kill trade, etc) while also breaking the essence of OW PvP.
BG rewards work because it is set in a limited area with properly defined rule and (as far as the matchmaker goes) teams are made to be balanced.
But OW PvP has no rule. You can bring 10 people to gank 1 guy who’s also 30 levels below you and the game won’t do anything.
By attaching reward to it, you will also have to have rules to dictate what is allowed and what isn’t to prevent/reduce abuses. But in doing so you also ruined part of its essence (that there’s no rule)
Given that GvG can result only in losses on both side (time, towers, etc) I feel like the Devs are indirectly discouraging it. They leave it in there as an option for people who want to do it (much like the +40 enhancement limit and the attribute prince) but it’s not something encouraged.
I clearly said “Other games”, i never said it’s abused in World of Warcraft, which was my example…
Do you really believe that? I do not… I feel like it’s a new game with tons of space for development, and i do think there WILL be some sort of reward system, i just suggested one type of reward system. Honestly, whatever kind of reward system they add will most likely satisfy everybody (i just hope it doesn’t envolve getting equipments out of it). But i refuse to accept that you do believe they wont be doing any tweaks on how Wars work right now and are indeed leaving it as it is, and “discouraging” it. I don’t see that happening in any way.
So yes, i’ll be eagerly awaiting for IMC’s GvG reward system and i’ll be happy with whatever comes, but since i came up with this idea in my mind, i did want to come here and share, so that maybe the devs would read and consider whatever they want to take from it. Or not take anything at all, it’s fine with me. That’s what the suggestions forum is all about anyways.
If you want a piece of advice, be sure that there will be a reward system, don’t you think they’ll just leave it as blank and pointless as it is, and you and i both should hope it’s nothing game breaking.
Just as @Exile mentioned before, they WILL bring something into the game. Then again, this is just a mere suggestion!
Trust me, nobody wastes its time and effort, not even the developers to make something pointless and discouraging that nobody will use. The GvG system is still in its development phrases. One thing that proves it is the existence of Templar class branch, that still got 2 ranks to go.
All of this I already said here: [quote=“kristipomo, post:25, topic:153195”]
If nobody is willing to play a part of the game, that part would become a waste of effort the programmers, designers, everyone in inc placed in to make it.
[/quote]
Please read more carefully before posting things that were already mentioned and discussed.
EDIT: We should stop comparing a not released game to games that have been going on for ages. I am looking forward to seeing something new and unique that is also not game breaking.
But the part I quoted was:
So your suggested system can and will get abused…
The +40 enhancement cap is extremely inefficient as far as return per investment goes and the low chance + high price of remotely reaching there is extremely discouraging.
But some insane person will still go for it.
And people already do GvG, despite all of its discouraging effects that I mentioned, so you’re already wrong in that regard.
Just because these kind of systems are abused in other games it doesn’t mean the same WILL happen here. Seriously, what? How many times have i stated that it can be dealt with! It - can - be - dealt - with! What the heck dude… You’re not even reading, i give up of trying to make you understand. Believe whatever you want to and don’t be so impressed when some sort of reward system pops up in the game…
Dude, who is even talking about something outside of GvG here and GVG SUGGESTION. This is off topic stop missing the point ffs.
Can you please post me a proof of ongoing GvG in iToS? I would love to see it. Again this is a Suggestion and not somthing that already exists. Stop missing the point and the whole topic by a wide margin.
Edit: Please start talking about GvG Suggestion or I will start flagging all your posts that don’t cover this topic in any way, that includes cash shop, enchantments, ect. Because this is getting frustrating for no reason, since most of this arguments don’t even cover the what should be said in this thread.
So you want me to argue with facts, I use YOUR facts to argue against you.
And now you say it will not happen here because…nothing?
If it really ‘can’ be dealt with, why did it get abused in ‘quite a couple amount of other games’? What makes ToS some kind of unique snowflake that will prevent such abuse?
Limit how many points to earn? That only limit how much they can do, not stop the act itself.
The point is that the Dev can (and do, as with the +40 cap) make something ‘pointless and discouraging that nobody will use’ because turns out SOMEBODY will use it. The +40 cap is just example from inside ToS itself (in icbt2 I’ve seen someone with +26)
Oh I am sorry that in your world only iToS exist and kToS or other version is so beneath your grace that they does not count to be worth considering as examples.
Also, I believe I’ve been maintaining that adding rewards to GvG will make players try to abuse/game the system for said rewards without actually doing PvP?
p.s. ‘threads’ with too many flags will get locked so I don’t believe flagging me is in your best interest.
@rofldat This is iToS and not kToS, a totally different community with different preferences. Flagged the last post and done with this nonsense.
Have a nice day.