This is really dissapointing to hear. Before i made a swordsman i already knew it was will probably be overshadowed by other classes. But hearing it again really made me loose motivation to continue it. Or even play the game. I was hoping high1 barb3 doppel2 would be quite fun. But appearantly not. Maybe i should have played wiz3 ele3 lock1. Like every other else. Seriously swordsman need reworking. Im already feeling the crappyness of my swordsman and im only lv110. My chaplain around that level when it was still a priest kills way more efficiently and does way more dps with itâs buffed autos. And can heal and not need to campfire. Never ran out of mana either despite never investing in SPR.
donât be hurt from reality.
pure STR isnât vialbe. unless you are otherwise rich, able to invest on gears and attributes.
donât say that DoV stuff in this matter, because the issue your talking into is STR>DEX
if you say STR + CON (DoV) > STR + DEX
you are again wrong, this is not theoretical, this is proven build.
before you pull out 10stacks of DoV you are already kissing the floor.
and yes, no need to read the full guide. unless you provide formula, data, videos and other important details. until then, feel free to guide people with your 'TOP 2HS DOPPEL" build.
(2HS build with a shield, that is)
What are you pumping Dex for on Fencer exactly?
Thereâs an 80% evasion cap.
devs didnât really lie to anybody when they tell ya back at level 1/2 âSTR and Con are the stats of Swordsmenâ.
For instance there are classes that also reduce opponent accuracy, trying to cap evasion on your own just causes redundancy when you run into those classes which also then means the Dex got wasted and you wouldâve benefitted more from STR, especially since Fencer skill damage is at a tier where STR > Dex.
You can always remake into dex.
I honestly love my dex dopple build. And with the barb buffs coming, only going to get better.
With 60% into cyclone, I kill the 190 boss (no armor and cloth) in full buffs + 2x cyclone.
Canât wait for the +50%.
Just pump enough dex then get rest of evade from gear and buffs. According to the creator of the dex vs str spreadsheet evasion isnât good until you get alot of it. Like 700-1000.
how much HP exactly this 190mobs have? if they are more or less than 80-90k, a combination of stunning skill (helm chop or seizm) + cleave x2 is already 40k++ for me atleast. followed by some seizm, and a series Z skills from doppel can finish it.
btw 50% attri cleave here w/ level 13 cleave. i previously posted my cleave crit dealing 22k each. (at stunned units)
does self-poisoning (lapasape mushroom) stacks DoV?
If you would allow me to contribute as well I would love to.
First of all there is something people need to keep in mind which is there are way too many factors and variables for a Strength versus Dexterity discussion to be precise, let alone worthwhile, at this point of the game. Some love to state that Dex is useless, others love to state that Dex is only sub optimal. Please just keep in mind that the only possible way that Dex would cause a considerable drop in DPS is if full invested with 0 points taken in STR and even then the 1.5x modifier + critical attack modifier from gears would make it a fair fight later on once Crit starts stacking. Dex seems to suffer from a sort of sin(x) curve (obviously this is being overly simplistic and it is only for the sake of a graphical and mental image of what is happening), where right at the beggining it feels useless, near mid values is starts to shine and once you reach a high enough ammount of it having even more dex seems an overkill. Obviously that without elemental damage from off weapons and headgears your basic non critical attacks will only tickle most enemies but even then when a skill criticals it slightly bursts out a pure strength.
However, this is a swordsman, and swordsmen do not get any worthwhile or longlasting buff to critical rate or evasion (for all those already thinking about Lunge and Cleave, the former lasts 4 seconds not counting its own animation which leaves you with a 2sec+ buff, making it a kind of reaction means of defense).
On the other hand, having Dexterity does not equal having no Strength, despite its superior scaling one would end up having close to 200 Str rather than 350+ (because if you chose to have no dex at all you willl eventually need to get some Con for the situational boss encounters on dungeons; quest mobs are a complete joke).
In short, or as you like to call it, tl;dr., do not worry if you took high or full Dex at all, it has its pros and cons as every other stat. There will be plenty of changes hopefuly and while the 30%buff to Str scaling (if if ever hits iToS) turns things in favor of Str, our Enhance Attributes slightly turn them back in favor of Dex.
Please do not panic on whatever build you might have chosen unless its a full int/spr build as a swordsman because yes that is indeed what most would call retarded.
Edit: edited some english retarded mistakes in order to make it more comprehensible for our full-of-12-years-old community. joking. possibly.
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Errrr⌠Finestra provides up to 150 crit rate and Guardian: Evasion provides 18%. Both can last more than 1 minute. Kind of a big deal if you ask me. Maybe Finestra will drop off past level 280 depending on what they do with monsters crit resist beyond those levels but Guardian will continue to get better thanks to percent scaling.
For those bad at math, itâs easy to get 700 evasion with a 1:2 STR:DEX build. 18% will net you an additional 126 evasion, which is about the same amount of gain as a full DEX build. So Peltasta is more than just Swash Buckling.
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Apologies, given the starting topic I completely disregarded any form of spears and went a ahead with 1/2h swords in mind. Yes you are completely right about finestra being a big deal for spear users.
On the other hand, this whole thread was derailing to the point where it meets the Peltasta 1 mandatory argument, which means those +18% evasion at the cost of potential higher dps (in case you take higher Gung Ho or a burst/dps oriented second rank), which I tried to avoid altogether.
Your answer brings me to another point which I find ridiculously underrated. That is, having Guardian and consequently more evasion means one would be able to stand in front of his/her target longer and consequently deal more damage per second which i believe is essential both when tanking and DPSing. So once again you are correct, Guardian and Finestra, which I previously ignored due to the (2hander doppel) starting topic, are relevant.
Thanks for clearing it up for future readers.
Updated the guide. Iâm too lazy to update the post but if you click the link to the ToSbuild website itâll have a couple more stuff thatâs new and updated.
Update: New descriptions on certain skills
Added more descriptions of why I chose certain skills over one another.
swordmanC3 ,barbC3, Dopple/Dragoon , this build for restain + pounching , +200% damage for stunned enemy
Thanks for the guide.
Iâve read a lot about the poor state of swordsman dps. I agree with the original poster that strength is the stat to go for. Pre 220 gear I expect swordsman damage to feel lackluster; whacking a monster with 500-700 auto damage when they have over 15,000 hp isnât going to feel good.
However at 220 gear you will get your end game sword (at least for the next six months or so till regular 8star gear is available). Superior twin blade has two gem slots that will give a player an extra 60-80 crit depending on how patient they want to be with their green gems. On top of the 30-40 points in dex, this will unlock the crit damage stat that has otherwise been dormant for the past 200 levels of gaming experience. Max frenzy and warcry, especially with the future cooldown buffs, also provide significant physical attack. Another positive thing is you barely have to pay attention to 170 gear since you will card past the exp dead zone, the exp curve will reset and propel you into range of the 190 and 200 dungeon. This gets close enough to 220.
No one should be expected to burn level +6 green gems on gear that will be outdated easily by proper dungeon, missions, and carding. That means the pre220 swordsman experience will be a lot different then the post220. The pre220 swordsman solo levels well enough and through diligent green gem leveling will have their unlocked critical attack damage to look forward too.
I think the sad part of the game is once you close in on 270. The maps in that level range should be filled with monsters that drop 8star gear and recipes but because the game was released in an unfinished state, killing those same monsters might have to be repeated in the next expansion. The same goes for getting zero exp/silver from the monastery missions or any play done once youâve reached the current level cap. All exp earned when at the cap can not be applied retroactively so imc will be forcing max level players to grind all over again when a new cap is out. It is unlikely they will have empathy towards their players to reward those who have been playing at the level cap waiting for the expansion. Although in a sense that means there isnât anything for a max level player to do besides gather resources, work on gems, pvp?, guild membership, socialize, network, play with economy and help other players.
From this came my point of view on earth tower as end game content. Yes the international tos players should not expect a new end game for half a year or more. However a player doesnât have to build all their characters for earth tower. They can build for the play style they wish, leisurely wrap up the last 20 levels or so and just hold out till new content is released. Earth tower can be done later with a ânon metaâ set up. A major reason Earth tower is hard besides its gimmick quests is the absence of 8star gear and class rank 8. Using outdated gear on higher level monsters is going to require more effort. But once the eventual expansion comes people can always double back to experience earth tower after getting the new stuff and abilities.
Side note: The impact of the next tier of gear can not understated. It is something that is always present in the background. Think of the analysis done in League of Legends on the gold value of one level up. In tree of savior the next set of plate armor gives approximately 40def, 40magic def, 15 evasion, 15 accuracy and a few hundred hp. Two handed swords give around 100 more attack. The imc game developers have already given you a sense of the value for those stats from gem levels. For example to get 10 magic defense or 10 defense from a single gems requires an absurd/unattainable amount to gem exp (forum post gem leveling is insane). The value attached to each increment of 10 is astronomical. In practice whether 8star gear lives up to this value depends on how the game designers program effective hp, dps and the monster stats.
Guys, many misinformation here, I will share my actual useful 2 hander showcast of Doppel with different weapons and all skill-sets with each diff weapon, I have all the 3 sets of weapon that matters for a 2 hander doppel, you can check out my other videos for some other questions regarding Deeds of Valor and AoE mobbing/grinding.
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Great video thanks for sharing. Also refreshing to see 280 with no Pelt.
getting petalsta instead of highlander hurts the end game CRITICAL output, lets say if you CRIT 20k with highlander path, u will only get 14k if u went for petalsta path, thats too big of a different, the +50% CRIT attack from HIGHLANDER is actually end game built and it scale greatly
I personally advise do not let all the ignorants swordsmen player telling u to get PETALSTA just to please others or beg for a levelling spot in grinding parties, ur just building a thrash character if u do that, an effective grind party doesnt need petalsta, everyone can tank, FULL CON ELE 3 WARLOCK, FULL CON CRYO 3 CHRONO 3, even STR/CON Doppel with Highlander, this game doesnt need freaking taunt or swash buckling for levelling unless you donât know how to lvl properly. (P/S i m carrying archers and chronomancers around lvl 260-280 while we lvl in maven abbey, the last map in TOS, deeds+cyclone just reckt)
Want proof? I made it to 280 easily and farmed every weapons and equipment out, I m valued more than a petalsta because my DPS means something especially in grind party, I m right infront of ele3 warlock if the party has Krivis that provides Zalchiel (reduce mobs crit resist in AoE).
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maybe someone has the math but from what I understand the crit attack is added at the end, like concentrate so itâs just a flat increase on criticals. so youâre not really gonna get 6k more damage from that attribute. maybe a couple of hundred of damage though.
I took off 2 hander and uses other weapons my critical dropped consistently (the exact 14k vs 20k, and both auto attack has the same dmg), cause the attribute only applies to 2 handed sword, i wouldnt share it here if i havent done the research.
Up to u if u wanna be a subpar Doppel, i m advising taking highlander (if possible C3 it) and taking lvl 10 Deeds, the damage boost is insane in parties (due to stone skin, zalchiel and healing factor), and this really helps in Earth Tower where 1st floor, 6th floor and 11th floor.
Most ppl are playing it wrongly and just listening to ignorants who ask them to take petalsta because they are ignorant of the character Doppel itself, or just too many ppl playing it wrongly(not raising attributes, not using the correct property attack on monster e.g. using slash on plate just facepalm) so leaving an impression that Doppelsoldner is weak in doing damage, but yea, why build a hyper offensive doppel if ur not going the DPS path with HIGH HP? Its the Petalsta path that ruin and crippled the DPS of Doppel. P/S: Cartar Stroke is ridiculously strong and long range, and it is strike, if i say the skill lvl 1 with lvl 70 attribute and deeds can 1 Hit KO a plague doctor or monk in DUEL that wears plate, do u believe it?
And is not just the highlander critical attack attributes, Cartar Stroke and Crossguard is srsly useful in PvP or Bosses.
Swordsman isnt just about Petalsta have or dont have, reallyâŚtheres way too many post that ask ppl to take petalsta and it just making Swordsman worst and worst, guysâŚask urself, if u have a choice, do u srsly want to take Petalsta? or ur just going to listen to whatever the âprosâ out there tells u âNo Petalsta nobody wants u in PTâ nonsenseâŚ
I am the only Doppelsoldner in my server Varena that is 280 and 95% equipment finished, and its already 1 week, most quits the game already due to unable to handle the pressure of people that flip their eye on them, prove it to them, not listen to ppl who duno how to play the character teaches u how to play by asking u to take petalsta.
The top guilds in the game only have like either 1 or 2 Swordsmen, despite their DPS build at the end they are only used as a World Boss tank with petalsta, I am the only that are cherished by my team as AOE DPS with HIGH HP (to absorb hit and get more dmg with DEEDS and have healing factor on me so absorbed hit is regenerated immediately), and i m not disappointing them with my DPS output onpar with ele3 warlock that has animus now, think about it.
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So your suggestion is SW1>High3>?>Doppel2.
Curious : Despite you taking Barb3, as shown in the video you posted, why do you suggest taking High3 instead? Are you in any way dissatisfied with your High1>Barb3 choice?
What would you suggest for the remaining class slot? Barb1? Corsair1?