50-60 is ok if you alway party with cleric (even 30 is fine)
100 con is for safety when you solo or using DOV
after reading this part i stopped already,
giving no importance to DEX. this is just amazingly wow i forgot i was playing ToS already.
mobs gonna rekt this guy so hard not even 250CON would save you. specially spell caster mobs that deals 1.2-1.6k per atk.
oh wait. i forgot this is a âtheoretical buildâ
mybad.
Thanks a lot for the guide, well-written and informative. It was a pleasant read.
Legit question. How viable endgame (pvm only) are these builds, compared to stuff like Fletcher 3/Scout 3 for example? You mentioned that the Peltasta 1 makes it viable for 280+, but do you deal any actual damage on high levels?
Also, how is barb compared to highlander? I wouldnât really mind the slow leveling on either of the two, what I am concerned about is the endgame. I hear barb used to be awesome when the cap was 100-ish, but now he seems to be almost a running jokeâŚ
Of course Con doesnât save people
Con isnât a saving stat. Outside of passive/active block rate it provides no defense, its just flat health that you look for when you canât survive a hit.
Outside of that all your real sustainability comes from the Cleric.
Not like dex will save your ass again magic so whatâs the point of your post?
You do realized that you CANT dodge again magic attack right?
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you are right, but wait, it says " TOP 2HS DOPPEL SWORDSMAN BUILD"
if we want a meat shield, that isnât 2HS, we might be on the wrong section.
like how âTOPâ korean swordie build gets fvked from recent patch and everyone gets to re-roll C3 cata to dragoon.
TOP builds as always.
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My boy, you need to get the idea that "tank have to hold C " out of your head.
If you actually own a Pelt cata you will realize the that Pelt Cata have the luxury of not needing to hold C every time due to its superior mobility.
You can outrun pretty much any melee attacks, resulting in zero damage dealt, which leave the rest to range attack + magic attack. Range attack can be slightly negated through guardian which gives increased evasion, while finestra gives increased block rate at the cost of - 11 evasion only. Pelt cata also have +25% block rate which helps negate some of the downside of having fewer dex.
This is why so many people consider dex not a priority for cata (another is the fact that hop finestra gives bonus crit chance). Saying that a Pelt Cata would do no damage because heâs holding down C all the time is just grossly skewing the scenrio in your favor
The only time a Pelt Cata should ever hold down C and does nothing is when all his skills are on CD, or when heâs out of mana or when he has positioned himself in the middle of a massive AOE combo and all the mobs are gathered around him. This is to help the actual DPS (namely the wiz and archers) DPS easier.
Most of other time Pelt Cata are doing the exact same thing as âdps cataâ, run around, charge Earth Wave, charge Doom spike, Rush, StabbingâŚetc.
If you ever see a Cata sitting in the corner pressing C, that cata is just bad.
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thats why DPS player will invest more on Dex for the lucky Cri/Dodge.
The way crit chance is calculated is that the higher level you are the more crit rate you need to maintain a consistant crit. And no matter how high your dex is you will never crit 100% of the time (as I understand it, but i could be wrong).
This is another point in favor of a balanced build with either 3/2/1 or 3/12 str/con/dex because while you can never crit 100% of the time, you will still crit even if you have lower dex, just not as much.
Also if you are looking to dps, you definitely should invest STR over Dex because as much as you crit, if you have low STR you wonât crit for much even if you crit.
And a high Con swordsman isnât really a DPS, heâs looking to tank, so his dps is irrelevant to the discussion. The only arguement here should be STR vs DEX. While people have different view on which one is better (Some say Dex, some say STR) the general consensus is that you need both stats to deal dps reliably.
Comparing Dex to Con is just another one of your skewing tactic to tip the arguement in your favour. Obviously a swordsman with high con and low str and dex isnât going to dps as much as a dex swordsman.
EDIT: Also, Str grows a lot faster than con or dex so you can afford to have more points in Con and still have some stats left for dex to maintain a healthy dodge/crit rate.
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Weâre talking about this because Iâm questioning the validity of your scenrios:
In real situation, example as below:
High Con 40k hp
swash 5physical 5magic monster, each 1k dmg. Estimate 10k dmg total.
High Con receive 5k magic dmg.
35k hp remaining.
Deal 0 dmg (coz holding C for blocking)
High Dex 15k hp
swash 5physical 5magic monster, each 1k dmg. Estimate tanking 10k dmg.
High Dex receive 5kmagic dmg, x physical dmg.
around 10k hp left.
Deal some dmg (coz relying on Dex for dodge)
Firstly youâre comparing the dps dealt between a dex swordsman and a con swordsman. Well sht son, ofc con swordsman is going to deal less damage.
But thereâs one fatal flaw in the scenrio you have listed, youâre saying con swordsman will deal 0 damage because heâs holding down C all the time, which is not the case. (like i pointed out)
We also need to know exactly how much con is considered high Con. Are we talking about a 1/3/ str con build with bonus point into dex vs a 1/3 str/dex build with bonus point into con? Or a 3/1 con/dex tank vs 1/3 str dex build? High stat =/= full stat.
If its a 3/1 con dex build then forget it that build is made to tank. No way in hell youâre gonna out dps a 1/3 str dex swordsman?
the difference between a 1/3 str con and a 1/3 str dex though? On a long enough timeline, assuming said tank isnât holding down C all the time, the difference in dps between a high con vs high dex probably wonât even be gigantic if they have the same amount of str and spam the same skills, but one is more likely to crit. Much, much more likely to crit.
but since we know you wonât crit 100% of the time, and the higher lvl you go the more crit rate you need to crit reliably, a dex swordsman with crappy gear outputting similar dps as a con swordsman is not out of question. It will be down to RNG and gear and attribute. If the Con swordsman gets lucky and crit a bunch in his skill rotation, and the dex swordsman is unlucky he crit the same amount of time as the con swordsman, the difference would be tiny. Ofc Its far more likely that dex swordsman will consistently output more crit, resulting in higher dps, but thatâs the thing with RNG. The damage you get from dex can fluctuate due to the RNG nature of crit.
with high dex youâll be dodging all the time how you gonna build up DoV stack?
so you get hit occasionally to build it up? thats cool. high con doesnt need to block all the time. if the mobs can be knocked downed or stunned i would use some type of CC then cyclone them to death. high con is just to build Deeds.
deeds gives aspd bonus so you can stack barbs frenzy bonuses faster too. DoV doubles Frenzy and warcry damage too. high con high dex 2:1 str con 3:1 str con str:dex all preference. really no idea whose better. according to a spread high str out dps high dex by a bit. but hey high dex get to enjoy that beautiful evasion. str con get to stack deeds better but have to play moer careful. depends on preference. but magic canât be avoided or blocked so high con will be better against magic. physical, well thats a preference. con to stack deeds dex to avoid. up to you. i prefer con. i believe the glove at your level along with some accuracy gems is good enough to hit stuff. that 50 dex or so isnât really a big difference in damage loss. it might be good to know that your hits will most likely land. again preference
str, con is definitely better. relying on evasion is not that good unless you hard stack on it. like only having 100 more evasion against a mob that has 300+ accuracy (red truffles), no way you can evade reliably on that, better get hit to stack DoV and CC them just like you said. why i said it is not reliable? i have full dex fencer 215, so I have 700 evasion, I use lunge on the truffle and even with the bonus 50% evasion, I still get hit even tho I was only being attacked by 4 truffles at the same time. luckily I learned a technique to not get hit by any melee mob (thanks red truffles), you jump left and right on top of them while also doing jump attacks. They stay on the same spot but canât hit you at all.
after reading this part i stopped already,
giving no importance to DEX. this is just amazingly wow i forgot i was playing ToS already.
mobs gonna rekt this guy so hard not even 250CON would save you. specially spell caster mobs that deals 1.2-1.6k per atk.
oh wait. i forgot this is a âtheoretical buildâ
mybad.
Please link me ANY study in which DEX>STR.
At all and EVERY case swordies will benefit more from a heavy strength build than a half-assed dex/str build with heavy emphasis in dex. You donât need accuracy as long as you have a good set of gloves. Not to mention DoV scales heavily with str (if you read the entire guide you would know, but your ignorance tells me you clearly didnt).
So in essence, do some backwork and research before bashing this guide as you apparently do not know a thing you are talking about.
im making a doppel2 going 100con rest str. is 100con enough for solo play?
i have no experience with swordsman types after 200+ my only 200+ experience is chaplain.
Hello Einzwei. I have con at 104 atm and while it can be higher, you are going for a damage dealing build. Only have enough con to survive, so anywhere around 90-120 is great towards end game content. You want to focus on doing as much damage as you can.
People are going to tell you to get dex instead of con (which is dumb) but the reason why this build focuses on HIGH con is survivability late game (because dodge canât dodge magic right?).
Builds like 4:2:1 dex:con:str is garbage because youâll have so little con you might as well play a cleric or archer class.
Yea. The only swordie type i would pump dex on are fencer builds. I only wanted to know how much coon is needed to play comfortably while dtacking deeds. Since im a build that went high1 barb3 i donât have the hp bonus. Howâs late game when soloing as a doppel 220+?
Playing a Dex/Con dopple.
Currently 260.
I have 280 dex right now.
Cloth targets are killed in a Cleave + Cyclone
Leather targets (low defense) are killed in a Seism + Cleave + Cyclone.
Leather targets (high defnese) require a 2xSeism + 2xCleave + Cyclone. Or instead of 2x seism cleave you use Zucken/Redel.
Plate targets require all my skills to kill.
These are all higher level maps where mobs have 110k+ hp.
If by going strength, you can somehow kill a leather target in a Cleave + Cyclone, Iâd say itâs worth it. If not, no reason to go strength at all.
I soloâd until storage.
Usual fights go pull 5-8 elites, combo, pull 5-8 elites, combo, campfire/akuras, wait for cyclone, repeat.
You only kill when cyclone is up. Itâs literally all of swordie damage. It does more than all your other skills combined.
Also, highest theoretical damage output is kind of a moot point. The class doesnât have the skill cooldowns to compete. If they change cyclone to be 25 seconds, and all other skills to 5 seconds, I think swordies would be competitive. But right now, the class does at least 50% less output compared to the other classes.