Tree of Savior Forum

Don't remove magic scrolls

General Discussion
#1

It seems like there’s no one really saying DON’T remove it, so I figured I’d at least make a post saying don’t remove it just because the most vocal of people are the one’s complaining at\bout them.

They don’t affect endgame, like really you hear everywhere say they don’t affect it much.

Even if I’m not someone who’s rich I’d still like the option of being able to purchase a couple magic scrolls to gamble away. I get why people don’t like it, but I like the idea for when I want to just try it out and get something nice.

Here’s a link for something we all have an agreement on

14 Likes
#2

For what reason is magic scroll even necessary?

I can get those too, but i still don’t like the idea of them.

6 Likes
#3

Seriously they are obtainable in dungeons for free. Also the only stat that carry’s well into late game on head gear is aoe ratio.

1 Like
#4

They’re just a little extra boost to help you out early on.

You say it yourself, the only carry well stat is aoe ratio, might as well allow magic scrolls in shop if it doesn’t affect us much right?:confounded:

#5

No i don’t i was agreeing with you and pointing out reasons it doesn’t need to be changed lol.

2 Likes
#6

oooh, lovely lol. glad to have someone on board.

#7

Yea lot of vocal ppl against it, but i’m all in for it.
More variety with your possible build optimization endgame. (and if it is as in korea it will be available for all in the marketplace, providing you’re not too lazy to farm silvers)

1 Like
#8

I disagree. Some of my arguments are built up from others…

  1. Bad precedent - Might encourage IMC to create more serious forms of p2w of in order to rake in more cash if they see that this is wildly popular

  2. Weak =! Acceptable - It’s the principle here that counts. The fact that a stat is buyable for cash, should, in principle, already ring alarm bells, even if that stat is something like +1 magic defence or something useless. It’s objectionable even if the stat is negligible.

  3. Not actually that weak - 3 stats x 3 can add up even if you don’t get the perfect rolls. Just because it’s not a perfect roll doesn’t mean it is useless. I think it’s bad enough that even one stat (aoe ratio) that could carry on into late game is added. (See #2) And let’s put it in another way, if I roll 1.6k hp instead of a perfect roll of 2.8k hp, that’s still similar to +20 CON. I don’t think that’s acceptable.

  4. Chance is much higher than you think - We calculated the odds of a perfect roll of perfect 3 desired stats to be in the millions. Well, as I’ve said, stats don’t need to be perfect. Nor do they necessarily need to be the most desired stat. Hey, I got Def or HP instead of Element damage. Does that mean it is completely useless? Not really. If you roll something still passably useful, and you roll a passable quantity, you drastically increase the odds of a passable roll.

  5. Also, let me put it another way. This is p2w in a form of a chance instead of a direct hand-out. If someone could buy a stat, all of us would undoubtedly agree that is p2w. Here, it is simply a chance to get a perfect stat. I don’t think a chance to get a stat is less p2w than getting a stat. The fact is both are locked behind a paywall.

Now, I think it’s fine if they aren’t completely removed. They just need a few balance tweaks to work. August is a little incorrect on availability for free players - yes they drop in instance, but at an abysmal drop rate (not a single scroll in 300 runs) which is horrible because you need MANY scrolls to even get a decent roll. If the drop rate was increased to something like 50-80% then it would make sense given the fact that you need hundreds of scrolls to get something close to decent.

The real question is not why should magic scrolls be removed, it is why should they be there in the first place. All in all, magic scrolls simply cost too much trouble to the game, and I don’t think just being ‘a little boost’ or a ‘fun gamble’ is a sufficiently strong reason for their presence.

24 Likes
#9

@elysium

Totally agree with you.

Additionally:

If magic scrolls don’t provide an advantage as some people seem to be arguing, why the heck would imc decide to sell them for money then???

If the magic scroll added stats truly didn’t make a difference, then nobody would buy them and imc wouldn’t even offer them in the first place because there’s no profit to be made.

EDIT:

Yes, magic scrolls do drop. But if the magic scroll drop rate was reasonable, why would imc be selling them in the cash shop? Pretty much everyone would just be playing the game normally to obtain them instead of paying money for them. There would be no money to be made from such a situation. The answer is that the drop rate for this item is likely poor to abysmal.

4 Likes
#10

These 2 things here are something I can go along with. Don’t delete the scrolls but in the future dont do more stuff like this. I’m 100% behind that.

#11

I was going to answer all of your points 1-by-1, but realized my answer for each point was pretty much the same. So…

Is it really even P2W when scrolls are obtainable as a drop? And when you can buy enchanted headgears from the auction? A F2Per who spends all day farming silver can theoretically buy a perfect headgear at auction.

The stat is also obtainable without paying cash though.

Again, no pay wall when it is a F2P drop.

Now, I am not saying the scrolls shouldn’t be nerfed, or that the drop rate shouldn’t be increased. I believe currently they only drop from dungeons, perhaps all World Bosses should have a chance to drop them? I just think the core idea of the scrolls is good, I would be OK if some of the minor details were modified.

12 Likes
#12

Yes, magic scrolls do drop. But if the magic scroll drop rate was reasonable, why would imc be selling them in the cash shop? Pretty much everyone would just be playing the game normally to obtain them instead of paying money for them. There would be no money to be made from such a situation.

The reasonable answer in my opinion is that the drop rate for this item is likely poor to abysmal for normal players.

What guarantee is there that imc wouldn’t stealth change the drop rates if they need some more cash moneys?

2 Likes
#13

There drop rate is reasonable <-- played Ktos

There in the cash shop because the stats u get a rng based so it is real good item to get people to spend tons of money trying to get the perfect stats.

#14

It is currently poor to abysmal in kToS. <- hasn’t played kToS

If you look at the math behind getting a perfect headgear, you need over 7 million scrolls. That is why people will pay real money for some. Even if you raise the drop rate to a reasonable amount, you will still not be able to farm enough for your perfect headgear. So, you can pay to instantly get some extra scrolls.

#15

I really am happy someone else agrees. You make some excellent points, there is no pay wall because they drop.

#16

Define “reasonable” drop rate. Cause all i’ve read about it is that it’s actually rather low. Especially considering that dungeons’ access is limited per day - and thus chances to get those scrolls along with it.

1 Like
#17

There’s an item that makes your character do 25x damage on every auto attack.
It can be bought in the cash shop.
It can drop from bosses at a .00001% drop rate.

  1. That being in the cash shop is not acceptable.
  2. That drop rate is not acceptable for any item in any cash shop.

Okay, yes, it’s blown out of proportion. It’s the concept that matters though.

2 Likes
#18

I believe the range we got in the ktos forum was about 20-30% if i am recalling correctly. And don’t forget bosses now drop 2 cubes each run.

#19

no it isnt.

a multiplier is relevant at all stages of the game the flat stats on headgear are not.

#20

We have a suggestion to at least make them less random(so you can choose stat but value would be random) and make only 1 headgear active at a time. So 3 scrolls would be enough to get acceptable headgear.