That seems way more like a balance issue than a downside to a reset option.
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And the problem is?
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Obviously.
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It’s a balance issue if, like you said, one build totally nullifies an entire class tree. It has nothing to do with the viability of circle reset.
On topic:
ToS has an insane amount of builds and it’s very easy to mess them up (more so if you consider future circles, patches and lack of skill details). IMO it’s unhealthy for the game if players have to reroll if they make a mistake. Depending on how far they got and how bad the mistake is, they’ll rather just quit.
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@Chakri_Griffindor the issue you’re talking about is class balancing and class counters. sw3-cata3-dragoon are designed to hunt down softies and beat them to a bloody pulp. but they need to get within range to kill - therefore any class with cc (wizard sleep, cryomancer walls) and any class that can protect their allies (paladin barrier, cleric safety wall) will counter hard-hitting melee classes.
this has nothing to do with circle resets.
time argument
a 30yrs old working adult can often (but not always) earn 200 usd faster than a 20yrs old student. the thing is, that 30yrs old adult does not often (but not always) have the same free time a 20yrs old student has.
i believe a such a working adult should have the opportunity to experiment with builds and be able to test these experimental builds at the end-game even when they can only play 1-2 hours a day.
abuse and pay-to-win
money is not petty. it is what keeps Tree of Savior alive. But there is a fair way to get money without harming the experience of f2players.
selling items that give players a direct and visible edge in combat is an example of an unfair monetization plan. a player resetting his/her circle gives no direct advantage in combat, especially if there’s a time-lock on resets. one player may switch to a build that counters another particular class and build, but that new build also becomes vulnerable to another class and build.
this is practically the same as a f2player grinding out three different classes for 200 hours each and then bringing them out as needed in PvP/GvG engagements.
ghost-maps
as i mentioned before, this is a problem with ToS’ game design. there is no real reason to interact with players in the normal maps. in fact, it is annoying to have to deal with players who are kill-stealing and hogging the quest objectives in field maps. i’ve rolled five characters already, and i’m getting seriously bored of having to do the same mind-numbingly inane quests over and over (and over) again.
this boredom is something that repels rather than retains players, which will do more harm than good to the game.
silver selling
selling resets is not the same as selling silver. selling resets and TP tokens do not affect the in-game economy, as they do not add or remove silver from the market. directly selling silver, however, reduces the value of silver. too much silver in the market, and the value of silver goes down - aka inflation. this is how directly creating silver for sale is destructive, while selling circle resets and TP tokens aren’t.
but you are right: anyone with enough money iRL will have infinite silver in ToS by simply buying and selling cash-shop items in the open market. that’s a reality that comes with the business model that IMC uses for ToS
exp card sell
those with time can grind away. those with money can pay to skip the grind. this is the system that kept world of warcraft alive for so long - and it is a system that can keep tree of savior alive in the long run as well.
and besides, it takes effort to earn money. what’s wrong with bringing that effort put into work over into the game?
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This isn’t true because why would someone go to arena/pvp with a messed up build with the current situation? It is the same… Ppl just copy builds from the guides and that’s all. Also it is worse imo now because ppl don’t have the courage to experiment… because they are afraid it will end up badly.
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Agreed! as you all already know, Swordsman without Pelt 1 invested aren’t welcome in high level grinds 250+
Kinda sad for playing some swordsman class unless you are a Shinobi or Dragoon then you are fine :3
I couldn’t agree with you more not only will the circle/class reset be helpful for those who didnt plan out there classing (like me) it’ll also be a huge improvement to the pvp/competitive side to the game.
“One hour of reading will save your wasted 300 hour character.”
Nah, it won’t, considering the amount of misinformations, the giant amount of mixed opinions, min max for earth tower purposes so that you can actually participate in the current endgame, one hour won’t help you out.
I did my research when I started out as a newbie, until I understood that my character I spent already 100 hours into would be useless at the end and that it would just be an “ok” char to pvp with.
Currently the way newbies/casuals can avoid being disgusted and feeling like they wasted a ton of hours into nothing is to tell them to go with a cookie cutter build.
Screwing up your build is all fine and dandy if you don’t have to grind another 100 hours again, or if ToS didn’t have all the others crappy problems it has (like fps drops or that questing in a party with your friends constantly bugs) and that we could enjoy the core of the game and love the game.
How many players make it to 280 with a build they’re feeling comfortable with while enjoying themselves and having fun? How many quit before even reaching 280? Before reaching 200?
A class reset circle would help greatly to keep the casuals longer, and bring more public as well as more money to the company.
And yeah, plan your build ahead, and circle resets are not needed. You won’t need to spend a single cent if they implement a circle reset item in cash shop. So you’d get the same results of somebody that paid after he screwed up or wants to switch from pve to pvp.
So basically, with or without money, you can get both to the same results, one is just more flexible and could go faster than the other. But still the same results. Thus, it’s not pay 2 win either.
Circle resets are needed if you want the player base to grow.
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Guys… The game is agonizing so much that they made a CLEAR SOLO DUNGEON VOUCHER BECAUSE WE DON’T HAVE ACTIVE PLAYERS!
If you are okay with this voucher, but not okay with class reset, I’m gonna say this to you: you have no vision of game design nor commercial decisions.
Class reset could help saving this game, but instead they prefer to leech as much money as they can with palliative measures.
They made a game with the main pillar of its conception being “We have tons of class options that have their unique signature, come and have fun with them!”, so if we cannot make several characters because every single char demands A LOT OF TIME AND EFFORT (I say this in a practical way, this not count if you are a teenager that do not study with tons of time to spend), the game should provide at least a class reset option! Of course instead they could give you a lot of characters slots and have a leveling rate that is not painful and laborious. For now, we cannot exactly enjoy the main feature of the game, while we have a lot of problems when one or more elements of our build (classes, itens…) get nerfed, or when they release new classes and itens.
So… While they procrastinate and delay this decision, I’m playing other thing waiting for a private server of ToS.
EDIT: Oh yeah! I forgot one element in discussion: People will “cheat” and make use of profitable builds when PVEing, then reseting their build and do cool stuff in PVP, and the same for GvG and other cool elements of the game… Why we should not be able to enjoy all the cool stuff in the game? Just because you think it will be unfair? People, like, enjoying the elements that compose the game?
PS.: Sorry for bad english.
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There will be always new player to come, when Rank10 launch and the new meta builds are stablished this game will become very popular, it doesn’t matters if we lose players today, in the near future this game will be overpopulated even more when they release the WOE alike system, just let them go, maybe they’ll come back later, even the players who made suicide letters come from time to time to complete events…is just to early and people don’t have the patience to live with the game continue progress and evolution. i just chill and don’t get stressed by the actual issues, this game is fun to me and i’m anxious to see what is to come.
Depends how resets are implemented. If there is a cost like losing attributes you invested in… class swapping to PvP wouldn’t happen.
I think IMC is aware that it’s hard to level characters and that’s why you’re seeing a lot more flexibility and speed with leveling. And it’s becoming more viable to switch characters since Blessed shards and Transcended weapons will soon be fully traded. Or you could share gear between your alts that is transcended now.
Along with the greater level span for getting XP from mobs 20 instead of 10. And those dungeon clear scrolls you mentioned for dungeons people are blowing past in a day.
Like… DG50 people would likely only have a day or two per character made that it would be viable for them to do DG50 for leveling so scrolls were a viable option here. Since everyone just blows right past that level range.
the topic was written in april.
He was right: 95% population quitted
Not the only issue with the game but one of the heaviests
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Resets are not needed if they start worrying about balance. In fact, not having circles resets makes them worry more about balance.
If you put any cash circle reset, this will lead to one of the worst cases that can be imagined: the balance will shift to money making scheme, thus, classes will be nerfed and buffed in order to make players buy resets.
A circle reset after every major update would be a better idea. Although i still think this could potentially lead to classes being more abandoned than they already are. “Balance what is relevant and what most of the players play, forget about the rest and monk.”