I don’t think so, but it could mean that there will be a complete focus on specific classes to do specific things.
For example, Inquisitor could become “the debuffer” in the physical Cleric part(as torturing mainly meant restraining and permanently disabling&killing heretics), meaning that he will receive the majority of debuffs of all Clerics and that other Clerics will have their debuff base removed & replaced, for example Divine Stigma of Krivis could be replaced, Deah Sentence of Oracle could be replaced, etc.
It would make sense to concentrate the debuff-based skills on Plague Doctor and Inquisitor and free up other classes to do other cool things to create new synergies, for example making Krivis an installation-based class to work well with Dievdirbys and Oracle a magic circle class to go well with Miko.
Cleric has far too many classes for them to do mainly the same things, which is kinda bad, because a lot of them will become obsolete in the process.
And while I can understand that they want to keep Priest unique and others,too, one of the major flaws is that some classes are just too perfect for their own good, like Priest, because it has buffs, heal and Revive&Resurrection.
It would be best if Mass Heal was removed or given to e.g. Chaplain instead, leaving Priest as just “the buffer”.
Maybe they could reorganize Sacrament towards Chaplain,too, so that Chaplain has Last Rites (capping at level 5) Sacrament&Aspergillum (capping at level 10) as the basic attack buffer class, switching Paraclitus time (now level 5) with Visible Talent (now max level 10) and add Mass Heal (max level 5) to give a better overall usefulness to Chaplain for its holy property buff & heal kit.
Then move Increase Magic Defense and Aspersion to Paladin and rework Stone Skin to provide a party-wide block buff (increase block rate and damage reduction of blocks) once again.
Remove the block effect on Enchant Earth and put some other effect in instead to make Paladin a unique defensive buffer.
This way the now dead classes could become much more interesting and feel a lot different, and while some classes might be extremely unique, their focus on one thing could make them more or less viable, depending on the party composition,build focus and content.
return with some good old mecanics but with adjustments is fine and a good idea also skills that are not focused on combat are also welcome which can benefit the store classes and the new game modes
Can the road map also take a detour to look at some of the old item drop. The world boss rare and unique recipe drop 1 in every 2020 blue moon, people literally jump straight from uphill set to Moringponia set now since it’s nigh impossible to make drakonas since no one have those pasi.
I find it funny how so many Arts are so shitty/not worth the cost, yet the effects which would have been perfect for Arts have been added as vaivora weapons…
priest/fs-alike with heal burst and ress is a mandatory in any mmorpg raid or high level pve contents.its inevitable. only if your team (or yourself) is already strong enough that make you feel its not needed(for example having soloing cm 1-7 420++(extra thanks to aukuras and flame ground)).but thats not an excuse to requesting for support class nerf. simply removing revive isnt gonna remove the necessity of priest since not only revive priest also there for mass heal which is the biggest healing burst and ressurection.you just want to enrage priest/support bias.imc already noticed how op revive/ress is and its been nerfed in raids and pvp. this is just a selfish request from dps bias to tone down support even further when its the only main thing it can do. so do i can make a request to tone down barb-dopp-bb build by nerf zornhau arts and leather arts which is tremendous amount of dmg boost so you feel less op maybe?and everyone stop meta-ing bb build.
same with laima statue.its just another selfish request.i dont see that reducing cd thats not as crazy as pass back then is that much of hurt to the game.but the existence of this skill isnt the main cause of burst > AA.you just being illogical and nonsense.the main reason of burst >> AA simply because you currently main the strongest burst build in game and the AA buff havent arrive here just yet.another burst build also struggle to reach your point because they cant produce that much high damage that boosted thanks to the gracious arts.to know this simply take a peek at weekly boss raid rank or bernice. if only they implement that new ark + make aspd really works well + remove the silly delay, this ark which triggered by multihits should be a remedy for AA.its just about how they adjust it and whether they want to make AA to be on par with burst or not. but i guess worry not, they seem to never intended to make AA reach that high burst dmg of burst build like yours. things i agree are melee AA hit box is truly sucks compare to SR with its mobility.they dont even touch up archer kneeling shot which potentially gives archer an AA capability back after they move SR to scout. as for cleric with AA imc might be like “we give you wheel”. yeah, thanks imc.with a limited count, sucks duration and only git gud if you succesfully reduce the cd by killing mobs.you didnt even improve this main inquisitor skill with arts and instead giving them extra 3 fire meme
personally this huge rework sound like huge nerfs to me.most people having hard time to adapt,like in rebuild, and prefer to leave rather than embracing huge changes to what they loved.the good case is the class get the-buff-it-really-deserve but since they give 3 fire meme to inquisitor and many other classes sh**ty arts i doubt it.what so funny is they promise more arts when the current are actually unbalance already. most of time its gonna be a nerf especially when that class is less favored and nobody in krtos give a damn about the class.or neglection or half-heart buff. i ll rather take another hiatus and come back when they give me a vaivora selection box as episode reward.what episode? 15? 18? 20? i just dont want to disappoint early like what happened with rebuild.
The problem is with Monk actually. That vaivora mace is a chaplain mace and chaplain needs 1h not 2h. Not every Chap is Monk and 2h has horrible attack speed. Also a shield is not that bad thing for a facetanking class.
Monk on chaplain is a forced synergy from the beginning because Monk wasn’t an AA class. Monk was a skill heavy class with a filler spamming skill Double Punch and it was better as that imo.
I also think their intention was that you use the Nirvana arts with a Monk/Chaplain because chaplain even boosts Energy Blast with Capella. I never tried it so I rly don’t know but it also means it should be worth to use it because it will break your AAs what chaplain is about…so if Nirvana isn’t worth it to break your AAs…I guess that’s a synergy problem too.
Chap has its problems too tho. They killed off a lot of synergies with other classes than Monk that should come back… Just to name a few… we need Sacrament+Last Rites back, Aukuras should affect Last Rites/Sacrament and be better in general, Inquisitors Malleus should be great again with AAs…and I think there should be a lot more synergies… Chaplain was a nice versatile core class that they pretty much narrowed down to just a few possibilities…
I guess it is easier to them to balance the classes but I rly don’t like how they narrowed down builds… Just look at summoners there isn’t too much choices there either…
I agree that they went in the wrong direction with Priest. If it is too op it should be nerfed but that’s not my main problem. I think there are other support clerics that are neglected like this. I think what could actually fix this is to give similar good skills to other classes but give them a global cd so they can’t be used together.
Energy Blast is a little weaker, but at the same time, it hits all enemies in its range, so obviously you use basic attacks on few enemies and Energy Blast on a whole ton of enemies, and to prevent you from getting swarmed if you turn off the knockdown prevention attribute to push away all the pesky mobs.
On Monk+Chaplain, you have AoE and single target damage, though Energy Blast in its current state is still not that great. You’ll need Inquisitor(new attribute & Judgment) on top or Zealot(Fanaticism) to boost its power one more time to make it worth using, and a decent enough crit rate to guarantee that you’ll crit often enough to keep Nirvana going for mobs that don’t die on 3-5 Energy Blasts.
The main problem of Chaplain is the fact that it is very bad against large mobs, which is the majority of the game aside endgame bosses (Tantalizer/Moringponia/Skiaclipse/Demon Lords), so without Monk or Exorcist you’ll have a hard time even trying to cope with the onslaught in CM.
That said, I cannot see any viable Chaplain build happening anytime soon,because even with the Chaplain vaivora mace, you’ll still find yourself better off with the pyktis rather than frideritti set unless you really have no access to Double Punch and rather spend your points into Binatio than Last Rites (which is a good choice since Last Rites scaling is not that much better than Binatios + you need the attack speed boost anyway without Double Punch).
I’d rather have them divide the jobs further, not making Priest do the healing,buffing and resurrecting all together in one class. The other Cleric support classes (with a few exemptions like Paladin,Kabbalist and Chaplain) are mainly revolving about one thing only, and IMCs bad plan was it to give every support class a mandatory heal skill + buffs + debuffs.
The result of this is that on some classes, the buffs are awful (Paladin,Kabbalist), on others, the debuffs are awful(Priest,Kabbalist), and on others again, the heals are awful(Plague Doctor,Crusader). Meanwhile, Oracle and Dievdirbys work pretty well without heal shenanigans, and they also do not really need many debuffs or buffs to have a solid concept.
If IMC makes a decision to move all of the support classes into one direction, focusing on either buffs, debuffs or recovery and reducing the overall intersection further, every class could be unique and be more or less useful,depending on the content it is used on.
That’s what IMC should primarily focus on, classifying the classes and then change the skills, attributes and arts according to the primary focus of the class. This doesn’t mean that a class has to do one thing only, but it should be obvious from skills,attributes and arts what a class excels in and what you’ll want it to have for.
They don’t need to nerf revive, per se. Instead put a debuff on you after receiving revive, much like pass, where you can’t get revive again in a certain amount of time.
That way this nullifies stacking multiple priests to basically trivialize content.
for example I thought this last patch of physical damage clerics was good, making them more unique, like the inquisitor and of course there will always be complaints about lack of damage, but mechanically they were interesting.
I blame the mechanics rather than this. If for example Revive and Resurrection would consume your revival count, there would be no point in having Revive/Resurrection.
The easy fix for the Priest meta is thus not the removal of Revive and Resurrection but the introduction of the same penalty that a soul crystal revive has in raids, 5 revives and that’s it.
For PVP, you could easily just disable the basic effect of Revive and give it an art that makes it into a 30 minute buff that allows you to always have full HP when respawning.
I hope we actually see some revamp on the amount of skills and average skill levels,too.
It’s completely bonkers how some classes get to max nearly all skills while others have 3 or 4 skills that require 15 points to max (hello Inquisitor, 15 points to max Malleus Maleficarum, God Smash, Pear of Anguish and Breaking Wheel;
Meanwhile, Zealot after the rework now only has 2 skills left that require 15 points to max, 2 skills that require 10 points and 3 skills that require only 5 points.
It’s high time to reduce the max level of Pears to 5 and of Breaking Wheel to 10 after the changes…).
Also, 6th skill for Scout & Cleric base class,please, and some rework of required skill points.
Make Double Attack,Teleport,Concentration and Guardian Saint 1 point skills so we can spend the points somewhere else
Oh, and let’s not forget 30 minutes buff duration for a ton of buff skills that are still kept way below this while still having 100% uptime. It’s just annoying to keep track of every single buff that doesn’t have 100% uptime yet is crucial for the play style of the class.
Worst example is Chaplain, with now 6 different buff durations:
Capella : 30 mins with new attribute
Paraclitus time: up to 30 seconds
Aspergillum: up to 15 minutes
Last Rites: up to 10 minutes
Binatio: 30 seconds
Visible Talent: 10 seconds
Is this really how you casually play a game where one class has to keep track of 6 different buff durations in a build of 3 classes?
ohhh please it is obvious that there are classes with difficult mechanics in which you need to dedicate yourself to them and of course if you cannot manage them it is not smart to use it together and for me the worst example is not the chaplain but the oracle . From the way you speak in the last part it seems that you need to use all the skills at all times which is not true.
Finally some semi-good news. I don’t want to sound too pushy, but please improve Musketeer, Tiger Hunter and other various archer classes. Musketeer, who I believe should to have the highest single target damage is weaker than Crusader, which is (supposedly) a support cleric (if we are to judge by the color of its class emblem)! The only serious archer classes are Mergen, Cannon/Matross and Pied Piper. Classes that need to use items to cast skills (Wugushi, Sapper and Fletcher) are weaker than Mergen, why is that? And please, don’t go around like you usually do and nerf other classes to bring them closer to those.
I am dissatisfied with quite a lot of classes (I’ve been buying a lot of character slots, probably less than half the classes I own are satisfactory), the following being classes that I have or I have had very recently:
Musketeer
Tiger Hunter
Wugushi
Sapper
Hunter
Quarrel Shooter
Ranger
Peltasta
Hoplite
Rodelero
Murmilo
Sadhu
Monk
Paladin
(very slightly) Krivis
Squire
Shinobi
Linker
I got a lot more characters than this, I currently own all the archer tree except for Matross, Cannon and Hunter, all the cleric tree except Miko, half the swordsman tree, a cryo-onmy-kino and all the scout tree except for linker and rangda (which I recently reset). I also have some duplicate classes on some characters (like a BM for PVP and one for PVE for example).
Other feedback I’d like to give is that the cooldown of Revive in legend raids is too long, at least make it 4 minutes, not 5, it makes Priest pretty useless in Skiaclipse, I’m better off with a Plague Doctor - Kabbalist with lots of healing, rather then Revive because Mass Heal and Revive can’t keep up unless I get some OP party members. It’s already bad enough that we have to wait a lot for Revive to cooldown after we already took a hit (skiaclipse parties with 2 priests is not unheard of). Also, it is pretty stupid that Modafinil has to suffer the same nerf in legend raids. As with Revive, at least make it 50% uptime of the cooldown.
Another annoying thing is that there is no easy way to see what the hidden arts do. You can check specific skill art in the skills window, but you cannot see at all the specific class art, like Monk’s Nirvana (which I had no idea it existed for probably more than a month after arts first appeared). Not all people know of or want to use online tools like tosneet tosguru. I checked tosguru to see if it has been updated and I just now I have seen that Tiger Hunter has a class art that increases damage against bosses. Make those arts visible under the skills window in the attributes section for each class, the only way to find about these “hidden” arts is by going to the class master and checking each art book (which is also filled with the other classes arts - this is time consuming).
I won’t quote your Skia review, because I fully agree with it. Having limits on entries is also forcing people to do content ASAP in order not to lose their chance to do the raids in the current week (this is especially bad for weekend players in smaller servers like Europe, when most people already did their 5 runs during the week). I’m usually a healer for legend raids, so I know how painful it is to help others clear Skia after my runs have finished - and I’m not getting any reward for doing so. I had to do 2 Skia runs with some OP party members, then I had an emergency and had to leave, so during the weekend I looked for 4 other people who needed 5 runs of Skia, we did 3, left their party for a while to let them check for other people (needed any, a person could change to healer) - after 30 minutes of constant shouting and looking for people in groups and guild chats, nobody came. I helped them finish, but it was exhausting and unrewarding for the many times that we died (the black smoke swamp is real when you don’t have OP party members that already have OP Varna equipment on them). Any sane economy would be allowed to farm items as much as they want and increase the supply of good items. It’s already bad enough that not only Unique raids and good Unique Dysnai items are hard to find, but we also have a big chance of losing our loot when ichoring them, making the game experience even worse. We have to enhance items to +16 at a minimum, with 90% of game equipment not going over +11 without losing 70% potential (dealing with potential is another stupid mechanic), then we have to ichor Dysnai and Unique raids equipment, then we have to transcend our legend equipments that are already hard to obtain.
Either making the entry counts to legend raids to 1 and multiplying the rewards by 5, or getting rid of the limit would improve the game economy, first because people will be able to farm items faster, second because people would have more time to do other content as well, like CM or dungeons, both of which will bring down prices of equipment, blessed gems and arts tome pages.
@hdogan
The point of requiring a new steam account was EXACTLY so that the steam player base would increase. It is a tactic to make the game seem like having more players then it actually has. After the merge, people who joined the new server will be left with 2 accounts. This is beyond bs. We already went through a server merge and IMC knows how to deal with it (Klaipeda / Orsha US East / West coasts and the Asian servers, people just had to choose what characters to keep and delete the ones they didn’t like and transfer their items to other chars).
@Yuukikami
Yep, exactly what we needed, thanks IMC for thinking about us.
Yea, you try avoiding the mechanics when they are bugged. You also have no idea how many times Skia became invisible in the 2nd phase, forcing us to leave the raid. Same happens with the mechanics, sometimes lightning strikes you before the sound or the red lines even appear on the ground, making avoiding it moot and forcing you to have 250k+ HP to survive the attack (and good luck making Skia forget it with Fade when Skia is right next to you).
@mulyanto1978
If the maximum anvil would be +30, I’d understand why most items in the game can only reach +11, but when the maximum anvil is +40, I have no idea why 95% of the equipment in game can’t reach +16 without losing 70% or more of its potential.
What? Swordies have a lot of compatibility among them. Probably the only one that lacks it are the mounted classes with shield and sword, which have very few options to choose. The point of build theory-crafting is to choose the best classes that fit your play style, with obvious penalties if you go with incompatible ones, like Schwarzer Reiter - Assassin. You may get away with Hybrid builds, like Assassin - Bullet Market with weapon swap, however, the builds weren’t intended for such compatibilities. When Re-Build came out, IMC stated clearly that you should either be a pistol or dagger Corsair build. You can of course go hybrid weapon with Corsair and Outlaw and get away with a really good build, however, that is just a fortunate accident. People aren’t supposed to invest in both a dagger and a pistol, but they can if they want to.
I do agree that some classes with weak damage, like Quarrel Shooter, Ranger, Hoplite etc. should receive some love, however, changing their mechanics in order to appease all kinds of incompatible builds seems like a really bad idea.
As if farming legend equipment wasn’t hard enough, now we need to not only make them harder to farm, but also impossible for casual players to farm. You have no idea how many Skiaclipse legend raids I did when we had another priest besides me, because we kept dying because of buggy mechanics (I know all the mechanics in Skia, yet they aren’t always avoidable, because this game is filled to the brim with bugs and glitches - more than half my in-game recordings are bug/glitch recordings).
I think the Linker link buff that would share buffs among party members should come back, maybe a little nerfed, as in, the buffs are only shared when people are within range of Link (ie: if Link breaks, only the people that had the buffs will still have them). Maybe instead of Link to have it on Lifeline.
I really, really hope that finally the migration to UDP will solve a lot of legend raid glitches, like lightning and meteor spawning without any warning.
I really don’t think that the forum represents the majority of iTOS players. Mostly enthusiasts are watching this forum, reading patches and complaining that the game is too easy. Most people are casuals (and this is proven by the GTW, Boruta, Skia, Lepidoptera and other end-game content lack of participation). Most people don’t want the game to be harder, it is already hard enough, with all the stupid RNG, bugs and difficulty in farming decent equipment. And the difficulty in farming is why most equipment is not affordable on the market to the most player base. The supply is so small, that people are willing to pay a lot to make their characters stand out. And frankly, with all of the bs going on in all the end-game content, it is literally easier to farm money and buy equipment, instead of enjoying some good raids and being rewarded for your sweat. Add to the fact that with the enhancement RNG you may lose your hard-earned equipment and you got a recipe for disaster. Dying and failing 6 times with all the shop buffs and food in the game for every single Skiaclipse kill is no fun at all, of course only OP players will be doing that content. Not even the Episode 11 Savi equip is enough by itself to tank Skia, you need to at least ichor some Skia Unique items into them and reidentify them endlessly until you manage to get some CON before you can even dream of doing Skia Legend, not to mention Lepidoptera, Misrus or future content.
I personally don’t have high hopes for this game and I have been playing since it first launched. It’s a miracle I haven’t quit already, steam reports 3952 hours in it (that is around 164 full days of my life playing). And that is in 4 year, so I’m by no means just any other player, it’s just that I’m a casual and I absolutely abhor the fact that I can’t enjoy all the content in it because I’m limited at each corner by the game (bugs, mechanics, market etc.), even though I put so much time in the game. Before all the Savinose events and now Episode 11, I was starting to develop PTSD because how many velcoffer items I broke. And then, each Savi event that gave me some hope, literally made me waste all my blessed gems, because pre-transcended items came in the next iteration. Now I got all the savi sets (plate, leather and cloth) at either +11 trans 8 or +11 trans 10, with only 3 of them having a Skia unique ichor in them (which I was lucky to even get). If more people would be capable of running Skia Legend with me and if RNG wouldn’t be an absolute bi-, I would start crafting Varna +16 or +21 equipment. But there is no much point in even struggling for this.
Haven’t had this problem of Skia being invisible, sounds like a buggy interaction with a skill. The mechanics are not bugged, again, you are just not understanding what is causing them to happen and are doing the encounter incorrectly. You should not be getting hit by lightning at all, it indicates you are standing too far away from him but close enough that you are getting hit by lightning. Again, this is a you problem.
Additionally,
There is a new objective metric which plainly proves you wrong: a DPS meter on weekly boss raids, with several weeks of ktos data and 2 weeks of itos data. They already are improving quite a bit for some of the classes in your list, but you clearly have not played most of those classes with enough time to understand how to play them if you think they need serious buffs/reworks. As of right now and after yesterday’s ktest notes, the only classes that still need a rework are all forced 1h classes like QS/arba/etc, and like… sapper?
It happens from time to time, that right after you kill it in stage 1, in stage 2, it becomes invisible - and it can still attack us, it’s just that we can’t see neither its body, nor its hp counter.
I know why lightning strikes, it doesn’t happen often, but it does sometime happen (most of the time it happens after prison strike). Again, you are blaming that a buggy mechanic that doesn’t announce itself properly like it is supposed to on me. When I hear the lightning, it is very easy to avoid, but when it glitches, it is impossible. This is why it is a glitch. So stop acting as if I never did the raid.
That is at best anecdotal evidence. And even anecdotal, on Fedimian the top 4 swordsmen have more damage than the 2nd and 3rd archers. Why do swordies have more damage than archers and scouts? Of course, I don’t take these stats into consideration, because I know they are too few points to actually make a meaningful statistic on them. Me saying that Fedimian has weaker archers than swordies would be cherry picking. This also applies for you were to say that whatever server has better archers than everything else.
As for my playtime with the classes, my most played are PD Kabba and my Musketeer. If I have no idea how to play those, then I’m either incompetent or you have no idea what you are talking about (and I doubt it’s the former). And I have no idea what is happening on kTest, if the classes I mentioned above are improving, then all for the better! I was disappointed with a lot of weak damage in archers and some swordies (shield users vs 1h spear or even my new 1h sword BB) and some skill changes in classes like Sadhu (removing CC and aoe from Possession and making the attack just high damage single target was stupid and didn’t feel right with the class, that is more aoe and CC inclined with all the stuns and knockdowns - at least removing casting would be an improvement).
Certain areas of the map in the raid obscure the warnings for mechanics like lightning and meteors. It is annoying at worst, and quite frankly getting hit by lightning isn’t the end of the world. I would recommend getting armor enchants to reduce debuff duration and then just casually walk away from his divebomb.
WBR damage is an objective measure of damage, and there are plenty of data points because there are other servers you can view to see their damage as well. It is as simple as creating an alt on them and hitting F10.
The lightning is based on your distance from the boss. It’s as simple as stacking up on top of each other and only moving as a group when needed–and he is pretty much guaranteed to drop the lightning when you all move away. He always targets the furthest person from him that’s still on his aggro table.
That’s the key bit, address weapon compatibility. Swordsman tree has the largest poll of weapons to pick and at least one class that is completely restricted to an unique single weapon (or the majority of skills), blocking the combination of Fencer/Matador with Hackapell, Lancer or Blossom Blader (among many other examples). Even when certain classes have restrictions lifted they often lack a point distribution route that allows you to use all your skill points with your weapon of choice.
The issue here is that this often ends up as a hard restriction on which classes you can/can’t pick and not a management on your strengths and weaknesses, only by forcing you into investing in multiple equipment and make your gameplay more complicated on micro management level. A side effect of this design direction is the fact you can re-release the same class structure for different weapon types, they could give the game more variety and choices instead of being variations of the same class(es). Yet again, this cannot be done until IMC gets classes to have solid identities, excel at it and be valuable for the overall game content.
Quarrel Shooter is almost at the minimal state expected for compatibility, but the execution doesn’t help. Lemme take Hoplite as a peculiar case, if we take the critical boosting aspect of it and apply to every other class, then it surely will be terrible, however the aspect of being strong against large enemies is something that any class combination could appreciate and isn’t found on other options within swordsman, if only the class was focused more on it instead of being a dumb buffer for spear users.
Of course all of this could be solved by making weapons less of impactful, easier to obtain or easier to upgrade, but i don’t think IMC will ever want to address these (and still doesn’t remove the equipment management aspect that likely only few players enjoy). I’d rather have Mergen or Arbalester to be something completely different and be able to pick either for any weapon with half of the skills than have full access on one but only if i play their specific weapon.
