Generally, I support the draconian restrictions.
Don’t understand why they restrict trading between your own characters, though.
They may intend to lighten up the restrictions in the future, erring on the restrictive side for the time being. That’s what I’m hoping for.
I would like to see some kind of allowances made for people in the same guild, at least. Like allowing trades within guilds so long as both members have been in the guild for a month, or something along those lines.
I read a bit but I don’t think I will get any numbers there…
You should just play a single player game, basically what you’re suggesting is to take the MMO part out of MMORPG.
You see, I’m talking about fixing it in other ways. Like I said, the thing about botting is that it’s a business. And any racional human being that works with this kind of stuff would prefer to run it in places where they can get an actual good outcome out of it(Like I said, the bear thing).
It’s not about that issue with mob/grinding etc, it’s more about making botting not worth it. One of the ways mobs get money(the most common way atleast AFAIK) is just by killing the same mob over and over again for it’s loot, then selling it to a NPC, repeat. If they were to cut this part of the cicle(the one with selling their stuff to NPC), they’d be forced into doing things like selling materials that no1 wants to hunt for(which is already a good thing for the community), waiting for recipes to be sold in the AH for the silver etc.
None of these ways are anywhere near as effective when you compare the player-NPC interaction, they’re already losing out on money b/c of tax from AH and not only that, they’ll also have to deal with themselves. Naturally, there will be a few particular mobs that are a better choice for them to hunt because of the materials they drop. If the bots rely on this material to make money, they’ll just make it cost scrap in a blink of an eye because of how much there’d be of it in the market and then again, losing more income. And not only that, they’d also delay their income because they just can’t know when some1 is going to buy their stuff. I think this would be a good fix on the bot issue, but it’s probably way too far into the future(like a couple of months or years).
Pretty sure 70% of these guys saying they are pro bots tends to be botters themselves. So they have reasons to justify their habit. Just wait for the bots guys they’ll come eventually. No need to engage yourselves to actual discussions. Just to clarify im ok with the token system. It may be different from what you have played in the past but it is a step forward nonetheless. Also, I frequently see people saying when you take out trading, you take out MMO from MMORPG. Thats quite incorrect. Its still MMO coz you can still interact during dgn runs or boss raids. MMO stands for Massive Multiplayer Online. There are still tons of people, hence its still massive. The essence of MMOs is not about trading. Its about the people.
I wouldn’t be so sure of that. Do you have even a shred of evidence to back that claim? You don’t need to have evidence, but you sound very sure, so you must have something, right? Especially since you gave us an (arbitrary?) number.
A lot of people being “pro bot” (which is an effective way to misconstrue the argument, I admit) simply don’t want any restrictions and will simply tolerate the bots and what effects they’ll have
I count at least one person in this thread, heheh.
You guys are probably uncomfortable with changes. Change is good. If they deem that its necessary to remove token restrictions then it is another kind of change. But before that you have to just go with the flow. Can you even provide a good effect of botting on a game? I just made a guess on the number but who would probably want to be pro bot but themselves right?
playing dfo and there is nonstop bots and it doesnt effect the gameplay at all, neople even stopped auction during weekdays, bots just dont matter unless you really really hate spam and to lazy to block them
Didn’t I just give you an example of people who would be “pro bot” (which is again a way to misconstrue the argument, but oh well) without actually being a botter themselves?
Eh. That’s another assumption, but alright. I was already willing to first try out this system before really judging it. But that doesn’t mean I don’t have a preference and a general idea for how I think it should be.
Man, i think thats a good solution, but in fact it does require some adjustments on the game:
)But this could be easily fixed implementing some form of downgrading items to its basic materials (like wood, iron…) but still I REALLY like this idea! u could make this a suggestion 
I am not completely sure I understood this. Are you saying to make it impossible to sell loot to NPCs? Then where would the Silver even come from in the game?
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No need to remove NPC selling, just work with the token privileges and percentages; ill use an example:
You get a drop, which you can sell for 60 silver at the NPC, (60% value), u can also sell it at the AH (20% Tax No-Token), making it a 80% value.
Then Token users can sell the item to a NPC for 80 silver (80%) and sell it at the market without Tax involved.
I dont know, thats one way to increase token usage and limit bot usage, and if they keep using bots, they will be paying 1 token to make it faster, but still they will be slown if they want to take the 100% from it, because they have to wait for the items to get sold at the AH, hence slowing them down.
There might be other solutions, but yeah i think this one would be good
I agree. More gold (well, technically silver) sinks is always better. But my point is that if you remove selling to NPCs there is literally no Silver income in the game, and thus no one will have any way of earning Silver
I’m not 100% sure I follow you here. I understand what you’re saying, but that’s the system we already have for the most part, right? The market already works with a different tax for Token users. Just not for NPC selling
Your argument makes no sense OP. It surprises me that so many people agree with you.
You mention FFXIV as an example where there’s many bots, yet FFXIV is also a game where the bots pay for their time spend playing the game.
What on earth makes you think that botters or currency sellers wont buy tokens here? Worse in fact, since they can be bought with ingame currency anyway.
The group that is hurt the most by draconic ‘‘anti-botting measures’’ (lets face it, the no 1:1 trading and market limitations has nothing to do with preventing botting) is the human legit playerbase. Not the botters/currency sellers.
Yeah, but its tweaked the way auction house is more important than NPC selling, slower with higher income.
Might be easier talking with total values (which i should have done in first place, sry :S) : You sell 1 item at the NPC (100% cost), either you can sell it at the AH ( market value with a 10% tax, definetly will be higher than NPC value); or either be a token user and sell it at the NPC with a boost (120% cost) or selling it at the auction house (market value without taxes).
This taking in mind that the cost on the market of the items reaches percentages higher than 120% cost, which definetly will do if npc gives low money per “effort”
Yes. There’s a bunch of ways to get silver into the pockets of players.
1:Regular quests(with actually hidden ones giving extra silver)
2:Dungeon area events(Like legwyn family and Mausoleum Chapel thingy)
3:Instanced Dungeon mob silver drop(INstanced mobs would start granting alot of silver, same goes to bosses)
4:Storyline quest(following the regular quests purpose)
5:Daily quests
6:Instanced Missions. In icbt2, the purpose of those were to obtain some fun equips, like Vulvuzela and such, they could just give it a money incentive instead of the exp one, like what they’re doing in kTOS
7:Crafting recipes and selling those items to other players
8:Achievment goals
9:“Clear Area reward”, where you’ll get it when you kill all of the mobs in that area and explore 100% of it.
10:As I mentioned, regular mobs would also drop silver, but a low value. Making it so being in a Party also increases the amount of silver mobs drop is also a good idea, whereas the increase rate depends on the map lvl(also to avoid botters, they don’t seem to do well at all against high lvl trash mobs).
11:PvP arena rewards, one of them being Silver. With bigger rewards if you’ve remained in top20 or so for a week/a couple of days.
12:Guild activities, whatever they are/are going to be.
13:Field bosses.
I’m planning to elaborate more about this tomorrow, probably will create a topic in the suggestion area of the forums.
Interesting. Not a bad idea, but wouldn’t that just make bots farm these methods instead for Silver?