Tree of Savior Forum

True open-world is something you can't fake

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#88

As was said earlier, “sandbox” style doesn’t always work and people tend to leave those MMO’s since there is basically no guidance or no idea of where to go. RO was somewhat sandbox in that there really wasn’t a “storyline” to follow so you could kind of go anywhere, do anything that you’re capable of. I played on a midrate server which was like 13/13/7 I think so basically you had to save up your junk to buy potions but it wasn’t necessary if you knew where to go, and I had great grind locations for each class and some that I used for every class. You get tired of visiting the same places, but if you do it right you can totally win by putting your ranged people where they belong and your magic people where they belong and your melees where they belong. I rarely took my Swordsman characters to Toyfactory level 2 but my Assassin and Merchants were always there because they have high survivability and can really benefit from selling the extra items (pearls, cake, etc) while collecting the candies means you can regen your hp without having to sit too much.

That’s all I’m really wanting here. Not sandbox, and not so linear like everyone is “the chosen one” and you just all see the same storyline (like FFXIV or FFXIII or even FFX). RO wasn’t just a nostalgia goggles thing really. It had a good system. The only reason I stopped playing is because the playerbase had moved on, and the private servers just weren’t fun anymore…

That being said, I’m really tired of the devs of all games getting together and choosing the same exact method. I like questing, I really do, but the questing grind is not as fun and really takes the idea of being adventurer and makes it more like being an errand runner for random people to make money and gain experience. It’s just not the same! Let us develop our own quests to some degree. Like before when you could create an economy around something that people actually needed, versus having an established economy that wavers so often and is so fragile. The open world concept allows there to be a lot of different types of monsters with varying degrees of difficulty and use, some things you don’t need to fight and others that you do need to fight but that can change based on what class you are. That’s how it was in RO. I collected Skel Bones in Payon 1 to afford a lot of my starter gear when I was a newb and didn’t know anything about anything. Well…that and sticky mucus…

Point is, each new game that has been released on a massive scale has been roughly the same in terms of how you make progress. Go here, go there, do this, do that, follow the prescribed leveling guides. As a Wizard in RO you could find a party at like 15 different dungeons, all dependent on how balanced of a party you could get, and you could find lots of places to solo exp if that’s what you wanted too. That’s what I think a lot of us miss, the options, the customizability of our experiences, and not having to all fight for that 1 good leveling spot for 10-20 levels. This whole idea of “changing channels” really bugs me and I haven’t even seen what it’s like in game yet.

6 Likes
#89

Win thread lol. The only hope I have for this problem is the many unused map connections could allow future expansion.

I wonder how the linear issue ever got past Korean CBT feedbacks.

#90

One of the issue here is that high level monster doesn’t reward you with sufficient exp (lv190 only give 1000exp)
And to make things worse, there is this dmg received penalty if ur lower than monster lvl.
This highly discourages exploration and players end up checking world map and following the numbers available to them mindlessly (lv96, go to kateen forest entrance lv106, then owl burial, then poslinkis, then saknis, then dvasia peak.)

Furthermore, this game unique selling point is in the unique class system which i really like. However, creating new char results in the mindless questing again… and the story isn’t great either… always wishing i can skip the cinematics/spam spacebar (too fast end up closing dialogue)

#91

If only i could give 100 likes…

2 Likes
#92

Well yeah you could, mage casts fire wall to block raydric and acolyte could cast pneuma vs the archers making them a great combo. Tho you won’t do much damage against them due to their property or mdef, forgot about that. I started killing clocks at lvl 25-28 on my mage. Those mobs are atleast double the lvl. It didn’t matter what lvl u are they give u the same exp. (Obviously talking pre renewal, renewal is the same mechanic like any other mmo).

Anyway it doesn’t have to be like ro but the current system won’t cut it imo. And looking at how it went from top place to the bottom on twitch with not even 300 viewers for a game that is in closed beta I’d say it’s not going too well either.

1 Like
#93

Bc this game is nothing like wow rofl.

#94

What I see Tree of Savior is made for casual players, especially the big demand of old RO players who still missing it and now has become working adult with a family, there will be great number of female players into this game. Hence, making the game in complicated open world with is not really a good idea, but yet it still should open enough like GW2 to gain exp from everything you do.

Between the hardcore and casual players, there must be a balance for this game to sustain. What hardcore see is 8-12hours per day while what casual see is 2-3hours per day.

Increase map number like RO without new content will end up snowball rolling until a point it is difficult to maintain the game.
Instead, I think we need to enhance/adding content into existing map and also unite peoples on same map.

  1. Open Map boss on selected map
  • This is what important for RO players, MvP hunting.
  • Do not like quest boss, this should have the power of darklord/baphomet to make peoples kissing floor.
  • Everybody get a token to exchange legendary item for participant, do not drop items for last kill which is unfair, the random legendary drop keep in on quest/dungeon boss.
  1. Random Event
  • Wave of monsters
  • Helping NPC to collect something
  • etc
1 Like
#95

I don’t comprehend these people who defend this game by sticking their fingers in their ears and hollering “It’s not RO” over and over.
They seem to think that it is too much to ask that someone, somewhere, copy a formula that has already been done multiple times and to great success.
They say that “The old ways don’t work any more”. Yet some of these “Old and busted” MMOs maintained large and healthy populations up to the point where they attempted to transition to the linear questing format that seemed to make WoW such a huge success.
People anticipated this game because they thought it was a return to the old. Now they find out it’s just a modern smart-car covered in the shell of a classic. If IMCgames is lucky the art style will attract enough of the people who play these games for the dolly dress-up aspect to cover the cost of development.

2 Likes
#96

Different classes get different paths in their leveling. Making the leveling experience unique each time will always be more fun than the scripted questing.

Quests should be completely separate from how we play our character, instead of defining the experience.

2 Likes
#97

It’s the contrary, the first quote people are just not delusional like second quote people.

#98

I don’t mind how maps are made, even if its just a small corridor with mobs.

I think what they needed to do was re-arrange map levels so that you’d have more maps for the same level range.

Right now there’s only 1~3 maps being 3 to 5 levels above or below your level. Grinding feels impossible because how crowded the scarce amount of maps are. And you end up running out of quests without having a second option other than grinding.

If they condensed all the 1~600 levels maps into 1~100, there would be a lot more map choices for your level range. It would feel a lot more like a true open world.

They could just make base levels give more attribute points per level and adjust mobs stats. And make leveling from 1 to 100 slower so it is similar to 1 to 600 currently.

#99

[quote=“f00m0nch00, post:95, topic:113714”]
hollering “It’s not RO” over and over.[/quote]
I’m one of those guys.

You seem to think that it is too much to ask that IMC do their work and think of new ways to make a game fun. WTF dude, do you really expect them to just rip off Ragnarok Online? Ppl want ToS to “feel like” RO, not to “be like” RO. Maybe the game you are looking for is Trickster Online. This “RO-feeling” is mostly not created by single mechanics, but by how all mechanics work together and how your brain loves to reminisce about the good old days in RO. But: Nobody said ToS cannot “feel like” RO while having different mechanics.

I’m not saying that. I just say it would be funny to have to learn a game with new mechanics, not to play another rip-off of RO.

#100

People compare to something better for improvement…not comparing to something worse, or on par with. RO might have an outdated graphic but games system wise, its a legend in MMO

2 Likes
#101

Maybe implement something like the FATE system from FFXIV? Its like another way of leveling since alot of people are complaining about the questing and at least everyone will get something out of this small “events”.

1 Like
#102

I call it open tube-n-island world :sweat_smile:

#103

You’re talking about mechanics when what we are talking about is playstyle. Most of us who want them to look back more at RO are saying Hey, the open world feeling was greatfor a game of this look and feel, so why travel this modern road which every MMO travels and each time the classic players point out how flawed it is. Errandboy syndrome adventurers are not the same as the find your destiny ones.

#104

This is what we desperately need. Mausoleum construction chapel is a great example though. I think imc will keep adding to those dead ends to explore as the game matures.

1 Like
#105

All i gotta say to the OP… play destiny… just try it.

#106

Well maybe I didn’t get that @f00m0nch00 was actually referring to the "open world " topic because maybe I did not take time to read and think through all that was said. In that case, I’m sorry. He was talking about copying “formulas” from RO, and that is what a lot of ppl do in this forum, and they do not look at the overall gameplay / playstyle but they complain that mechanics are different.

TLDR: Sry.

1 Like
#107

It’s all good. I don’t agree that they should copy the mechanics, playstyle, world ideas, etc. etc. from any other MMO but I think what most of us are really interested in is another experience that is like RO with it’s open world formula.

When we all start in our city, Protera, depending on what class you are you’re gonna have to walk a bit to get there. Thieves walked south to Morroc. Swordsmen had a short walk southwest to Izlude. Archers took a trip down to Payon. Mages had a longish walk to Geffen. You get the idea! And each character would play totally differently and fight in different areas, but would end up at the same places eventually, like the Orcs Dungeon or Payon Caves 2 or Bibilan(Byalan) Island 2/3. This way, there was a huge playing field where everyone goes where their abilities are best suited and where the exp is the best.

Not only that, but during that time of your leveling stages you are hunting cards and equips which are quests in and of themselves lol and when you hit roughly the level 80’s you get to experience a lot more quests and dungeon unlocks and things like that. Then getting Reborn was super fun. They created a really fun and open experience that ToS is not looking like it’s moving in the direction of.

In comparison, something modern like FFXIV is really pretty dull. There’s not much that’s special about any given class except their skills and class animations, everyone can do basically everything aside from the tank, dps, healer roles which are filled by specific classes. Each one does it slightly differently but it’s pretty much entirely the same where you just pull off your rotations and pay attention to what’s happening on the field (which is often completely random and you have to have watched a video or had someone explain it to you, good luck beating any of the primals on the first try with a newbie group…) The exploration is limited because everyone sees the exact same storyline that takes you to the exact same places, there are no real hidden quests just optional fetch quests and the like. It has some nice modern touches like the dungeon finder where if you don’t have a party you can get matched up randomly across servers. Other than that, nothing really to pull you back in once you’ve left except for the friends you make and maybe finishing the storyline.

1 Like