Tree of Savior Forum

TIME vs MONEY... Which do you have?

General Discussion
#1

Everyone is familiar with the saying, “money is time, and time is money…”

MMO’s require that players spend an exorbitant amount of time playing the game to reach the top. Although attractive at first glance, this requirement does not cater to everyone. Being one of the old masters, I find that I have significantly less time to play TOS than I did RO. Before, I spent 8-12 hours a day playing RO, while living at my mom’s house. Now I am a dad, with a house, working 12 hours a day. However, my love for this kind of game has not changed. I still want to play TOS and feel like I am not falling.

Everyone frowns on the idea of “pay-to-win” because it helps players who pay progress faster. But what people fail to realize is that there is another hidden currency that NO ONE ever talks about. TIME!!!.. I simply do not have as much TIME as most people. But what I do have is MONEY!!! Traditionally, MMO players prefer to pay-to-win, BUT not with MONEY. Instead they use TIME!.. I CANNOT afford 12 hours a day anymore.

Now there are different types of pay-to-win:

a) players who pay receive clear-cut advantages such as more damage, better items, and faster characters.

b) players who pay receive more exp, higher drop rates, more gold for items sold, less taxes.

I am a proponent of option B. I would never want to be better than a player because I spent cash. I just want to be able to keep up with the general populace who spends more time on the game. As far as I’ve seen, TOS is following option B with the exception of +3 faster run/walk speed, which I hope IMC makes available to everyone (as long as they fulfill certain requirements).

As the game gets closer to launch, these issues will become easier to discuss. For now, I am proud of IMC’s approach to the way they will generate income for themselves. I intend of being one of the players who will regularly pay for IMC’s cash benefits. That way, players who DONT pay will still have a game to play.

More to come on botters, gold sellers, and the trading system…

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#2

i have both sucka :sunglasses:

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#3

dude, game generally is for kids.

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#4

Says who? kids grow up and eventually become adults, many of us still enjoy playing a game, sadly we can’t spend sleepless nights like we used to 10 years ago but we still play here and there :slight_smile:

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#5

And we get wicker as we grow up. Before I just want to play game for fun, now I want to beat that guy ass with my money and cheating. Bravo!!
Sad

#6

I agree with you. I would be all for a concept of cash exp scrolls which would give bonuses based on how much time you spent offline. Playing no-life? Not able to use them. Simple as that.

ps. the trading limit however worries me.

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#7

I don’t think nearly enaugh people even realize that there are several different opinions out there about what exactly P2W is and where the line between acceptable CashShop and P2W can even be drawn. Usually people fall into huge discussions about P2W without understanding that this term is not universally defined but argue soley on baseis of their own definition of P2W like it was everyone elses. I think that alone is one big confusing part in such a debate. It’s nice that you pointed that out but apart from the options you gave, like i said, there is even more to it than that.

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#8

Interesting points. What I fail to understand: from my impression over the past week I get the feeling that most players complaining about ToS being P2W(which is a debate - elsewhere to be undertaken) seem to have an underlying principle of absolutely not wanting to pay anything at all for this game for the sole reason it is called a “free2play” or because X/Y sucks, yet demand unnegociable equality between players supporting the game and them.

Which in my opinion is a completely twisted moral - since obviously the game has a development and mainanence cost and families have to be fed. If one invests so much time of his day (and I hope everyone thinks highly valuable of their time) then I cannot understand why dropping money for e.g. ToS is such a huge burden on some people(this is completely seperated from being able to afford it or not - I am talking about willingness). They get something - they give something in return.

Sure the game advertises as free2play because someone once invented that businessmodel and made it sound great for advertising purposes. But common sense should tell everyone that this is not what F2P literally means and that there needs to be people spending money in order to keep the company going, this model is about trusting into the customer that he will do the morally right thing and support the game if they enjoy it and play it extensiveley. Now many people that seem to worry about CashShop items in the late game seem to want to be super invested in the game, playing it for hours long the be the first up there competeing in high level PvP, PvE and whatnot yet they seem to frown upon the idea that they would “need” to puchase e.g. a token to not be at a disadvantage(which is again just a blatant statement from me and an entire debate itself).

And please remember this could be written about any game out there I am not trying to defend specific problems that are currently discussed about the game within the community. I just needed to get this out there for once so maybe some people will have a second thought about this…
Edit* I guess this turned out to be more philosophical rant than practical for this discussion~ oh well

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#9

What type of attitude is this? This statement is beyond childish. It’s ignorant, and disrespectful.

A game is for anyone of any age. It’s because of your parents that you were able to afford to play games and use the computer / phone that you are using to type that idiotic comment. And if you sit there saying “no it wasn’t, I paid for all of this myself” then you better sit down and realize you’re an adult already by most of society standards.

On-topic: I don’t mind a few of these ‘p2w’ bonuses. Increased experience is my personal favorite. It’s open to anyone, and as someone that works most of the day, and has other things he has to do during the night, it’s nice to be able to accommodate my lack of time accordingly. I don’t like being able to buy gear, or equipment though.

I think a lot of the problem stems from people having this need or desire to be ‘among the first’ to get to max level. I’ve seen posts about people taking days and even up to a week off work to play this game simply so they can hit max level. Which is fine, no judgement there. If you can take time off work that means you get your shit done or else you wouldn’t be able to. But it’s generally kids who can’t take time off school that are upset by these type of things because they can A) not afford the extra experience and B) have this idea that being among the top players in the game makes them generally better than other people in real life.

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#10

“game” generally is for kids.
Why do you have to be that salty?

#11

I’m ‘salty’ because you lack education. ‘game’ is not generally for kids. Basketball game … baseball game … Video game … all of these require money that you don’t have or make unless you ARE an adult, or you have an adult that pays for that kind of stuff. The best players in the world in sports are generally adults, the people who make ToS are adults.

Stop generalizing. If you don’t like the idea or don’t agree, comment accordingly, but don’t go around telling people what they can or can’t do with their time.

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#12
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#13

I didn’t tell anyone to do anything. Do you play game often when you grow up and start working for higher goal in your life? Say yes and I would say you’re unless useless or working in entertainment industry.
Both way is fine, I’m not criticized anyone about their life, watch your mouth. I already have 2 bachelors degree and working on my master. And I won’t argue with someone like you.
Have fun

#14
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#15

You’d think with two bachelors degree and a master’s thesis in the works i’d be able to understand the first three sentences. Are you telling me i’m useless if I play video games while working for a higher goal in my life?

I won’t insult your education, despite my thoughts that two bachelors degree’s only tell me you wasted 3 years of your life when you should have been working on your master’s thesis.

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#18

You don’t even know what I studied and you can guess I wasted my time.
Bravo!!

#19

flagged
ez
/20charssssss

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#20

:joy: :joy: :joy: :heart:

#21

“oh hey guys! I have money! I get advantage now?”

^literally cancer. Inb4 equally cancerous excuses such as “I work hard all day so I have a right to this” or “I just want to support the developers!”

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#22

I don’t understand how anyone can claim Pay To Win when there’s no real reward besides being at the maximum level.

It’s not like other titles with weekly loot lockouts where you have to finish the end game content on week one or you fall behind. It’s not like there’s a ranking system with special rewards for the top x players. Guild vs Guild is still new and rather inconsequential. We’ll all get top level eventually, there is no particular skill involved to stop the worst player from getting there, provided they invest enough time.

If IMC wanted to sell level 280 in the cash shop, based on the current end game, I wouldn’t even care. There’s nothing special about being the first except your own ego. Me? I’m playing to experience that journey from 1 to 280 and don’t care who gets there before me.