Tree of Savior Forum

There needs to be a reason to sub

I would have just put this in a response to one of the many posts complaining about whats going to be in the cash shop/sub bonuses etc etc, but theres just so many.

I don’t think a lot of you realise that if IMC give you what you’re asking for, a perfect f2p model, they will make very little money, there needs to be a reason to buy a sub/purchase stuff off the cash shop that isnt just cosmetic, I know we have things like Path of Exile which do amazingly well with just cosmetic items but thats a entirely different game to ToS.

Now Im making this point because another MMO, Wildstar, went f2p and say what you want to about that game, but its f2p model is simply amazing, so amazing, theres no point in a sub, no reason to spend anything on the cash shop and no reason to support the dev (I have over 2600 hours on that game)

I for one dont want to see ToS go the way of many MMO’s with massive p2w elements but there needs to be something there to make me say “I want a sub/spend money”

anyways thats just my 2 cents about the whole thing, I tend to be quiet on forums but just thought I’d say something.
Have a lovely day/week/month <3

2 Likes

+exp and + special emotes atm sell it to me …

But trade restrictions and dungeon limits … make me hate it.

IMC still needs to find a good middle.
And reduce the price …

18 bucks (if its going that way) will be just to much. As some will only take it for the trade … and lifting of restrictions.

It’s to early atm … IMC needs more expierence.

4 Likes

;_;    

1 Like

I guess they could remove some of the benefits from the token to reduce the cost of said tokens for say the +exp and + special emotes.

Just going to copy and paste my response from a steam post that I made in the game’s discussion forums.

                           ↓↓↓

I don’t believe the token benefits are game breaking or unfair and this is coming from someone who doesn’t plan to buy tokens at the start, but will if I enjoy the game. F2P games require a constant flow of revenue (surprise) for game maintenance, server host cost, expansions, etc. Cosmetic and convenience items alone won’t work. Sure, they may work for MOBAs and FPSs because of how they’re designed, however, it doesn’t quite cut it in a MMORPG.

Either you provide a P2P service such as WoW, FFXI, FFXIV. You provide a B2P service with a cash shop such as GW2, BDO, etc. Or you provide a F2P with only a cash shop, which, in turn will output more unfair items in it because they require a way to encourage people to spend money. Or lastly, you have F2P with a premium subscription with a cash shop such as Tera, Archage, Wild Star, Rift, Tree of Savior, etc in hopes of having revenue mostly come from the subscription. This allows the company to put cosmetic and convenience items in the cash shop.

At the the end of the day they all have a way to have you put money into their game to make a profit, and to provide upkeep to the game.


Using the famous EXP boost and cosmetic items as an example, here are a few reasons why a purely convenience or cosmetic cash shop may not help an MMORPG thrive.

  • EXP boosts are by definition a finite resource. The sales for EXP boosts will deteriorate over time as people reach max level.

  • EXP boosts are not enticing enough alone. I have never bought an EXP boost in games I’ve played, yet I’ve paid for Tera subscription, Archage subscription, etc as a long-term player when I played those games.

  • You require a constant influx of new players who are willing to buy an EXP boost to keep profiting off EXP boosts or a large amount of people willing to buy them for alternate characters.

  • Realistically, most influx of players will be to “try it out.” It doesn’t guarantee an EXP boost purchase. So, lost revenue. Besides even if they become a long-term player it doesn’t guarantee an EXP boost purchase.

  • Cosmetics has always been “hit or miss.” I’ve long-term played Tera, Archage, Rift, Guild Wars 2, Black Desert Online, World of Warcraft, FFXIV, etc a.k.a games in general that offer a form of cosmetic through mini-pets or clothes and I’ve never purchased them due to the fact I didn’t find them appealing.

This is why premium subscriptions are slowly becoming more apparent. Yes, they are optional, however, they provide beneficial bonuses to long-term players as a reward for supporting the game and entice, but do not force, the F2P players to supporting the game. Do you need the movement speed increase? No, but it’s enticing to players who want to move around the map quicker. Do you need the 10% tax? No, you can survive just fine off the 30% tax, but again it is enticing to players who want that little extra.

Maybe, I’m just crazy and I know there will be people who disagree with me, however, this is my 2 cents in an attempt to hopefully help someone understand why I personally don’t mind a premium subscription.

6 Likes

More like reduce some of the restrictions and thing of actual benefits that people would want xD.

We didn’t had tradeing restrictions in the previous betas.
And the reasoning given to us is more or less … a blatant lie … or cover up for the true reasons.

But anyways.

VIP should give the following: (again as i had said so many times)

  • buy in shops
  • bonus exp
  • emotes
  • discount on cash shop items
  • special pets/ etc you can only buy while in VIP. Just for looks.
  • each month / token +1 char slot
  • higher free tp regeneration maximum (atleast as much as 9 tp)
  • event headgears for x time spend in VIP mode.

Trade would work still. And we don’t need two different taxes for AH …
And for the benefits. Buy in shop is something nice, which people will want.

Make it 5~10 bucks max … and lots of people will buy it.

3 Likes

Your asking for too much for what it is worth you do know how long the tokens last btw if there $18 that is lets say 30 days in a month $0.60 a day if you reduced it to say 5 it would be $0.167 a day you see the difference and also your telling me you cant spare 60 cents a day on a video game…

Hell most people waste like $10 a day on junk food… and don’t complain.

There providing entertainment that is free but has the option to make it better for very little and its kinda bad you want more that’s like kicking a homeless person because they charged too much to shine your shoes.

This is smart, but I can easily see it as high as $13-15. I would be willing to spend $15, but $20 is too much and so is $18 I agree.

;_; as well
as well
as well

Actually, a typical meal for two will run you about $20. I bought Panera Bread for my wife and I yesterday for lunch and it was about $20.67 in total after tax. Heck, people pay $10 a month for Spotify premium or Youtube Red, yet $10-$15 a month for ToS or another MMORPG is to much.

Personally, I don’t have an issue with it as long as I feel like I’m getting my money worth and if I don’t then the kicker to it is…I stop paying.

2 Likes

a small salad costs about 5-7€ here already - a medium size pizza 7€ and thats the cheapest one they go up to 10€ for medium size

in germany 20€ shouldn be much of an issue - not talking about other countries here

30% exp boost is reason enough already to buy the VIP thingy - actually the reason why i buy it from a gameplay perspective - planning on grinding several chars to cap so its helping a ton

I like the discount on cash shop items idea and the event headgears for a certain amount of time being VIP.

Doesn’t matter. I can spend that.

But it’s proven that people buy more if the price is at an certain range.

Sure, selling 3 times 5 dollar vips. Is as much as 1 time 15 dollar vip.
But more people would buy the 5 dollar then the 15 dollar, for the exact eeason of ti beind cheaper then a pizza here.

But then again, the mind of some marketing gus go only like this.
“If we can sell 3 … wha tif we can sell 3 for 15 bucks? Wouldn’t that be 3 times as much profit then 5 bucks?”

xD

You need to see thing sin relationship to each other.
Even in psychological aspects.
18 bucks seems to be a big amount. People will think before buying that.
5~10 bucks is so low, that people will compare it and see it for sufficient for what the price gives.

It’s always a game of minds.
What doe sit feel worth. When do people start to overthink the price?
Which will net in most income, but still not only driven by numbers of sales?

When i realized … that this applys to most things in life. I laughed so hard.
A figurine for 180 Dollars is easily bought. As i like it and i want it. And isn’t it forever? It’s just about a days worth of working + overtime. And only as much as some would spend on a night out …

But then again, a figureine for 200~250 dollars feels like extortion.
While i don’t even need to think when i buy a 40 dollar one, which looks nice.

“The worth of something, lays in the eye of the observer.”

Should be mind not eye.

Your a breath of fresh air in what is otherwise a gas chamber. I’m just waiting for the release so that the whiners can occupy themselves and test the waters before complaining its too cold

2 Likes

its f2p they should do it cheap so ppl arent put off buying it at 18 bucks a pop i prob wont get more after the founders ones are up but if they were like 5 or something id keep em up all the time it does make a difference with a more accessible shop you get more people buying which has a good chance of ending up to a bigger profit. Also youtube red is a good example trying to add a price tag to a bunch of stuff we were used to getting for free. i know alot of people who would donate to a youtubers patreon and buy their merch but wont touch the red service kind of the same deal here if people are happy they spend more just to make sure game stays afloat if it feels forced then people are less likely to spend imo

i’d prob fill the marketplace with token at such a low price - but then posts like “wah wah big casher filling the market with token and ruin economy all p2w” gonna pop and bla bla…endless cycle

1 Like

should try out imcs other flag game Grenado Espada it shows that there really is merit to peoples concerns and by some of the stuff they are doing it seems to be heading in that direction (still gonna play till it becomes unplayable though don’t think im sleeping till launch lol)

Just don’t listen to them.
The moment these are cheap, they lose value ingame too ^^.

Sure somone who buys 100 of thes ewill advance faster.
What then?

Boring endgame and bragging rights ^^.
Maybe he will monopolize items and but them up on the market.

In the end, it wont hurt a soul. That whale and the P2W screamers are reasons, why games have gone a bad direction.

Don’t ever cater to one or two groups alone… how did that game analysing side said. “One needs to keep they’re playerbase in a balanced state.”

1 Like

The fact that the $50 pack was selling the most disaproves this. People will pay into something they think is worth it for something they like. However there’s a divide between the I will put money into this and I won’t be buying a damn thing w00t, people.

You can imagine which side has more support and why subsequently the forums been spammed with cash related threads. The simple truth.

Edit**

Didn’t realise you replied already. I’ve seen people bring up that game before but it’s honestly irrelevant to this game. Hell it is in general. I don’t expect a damn thing in terms of a companies cash grabs or them being ethical? about it. We shall see how it’s handled and I’ll leave it at that

ill prob buy about 1000 xDDDD but hey i keep the server running and nobody can complain about not having token xDDD

1 Like