Tree of Savior Forum

The many flaws of TOS and how to fix some of them

EDIT: the comments on Reddit are slightly more constructive

There is a lot to cover but I’ll try to keep this as concise as I can.

I have currently played up to 160~ on one toon
Archer > Ranger2 > Wugushi2

And In the short time I have played I have run into a few issues…

So, in no particular order, here we go:

  • allow custom AI like Ragnarok Homunculus had or at the very least give us an Agressive/Defensive/Passive option

copmanions in general are (like a lot of things in TOS) very poorly explained
health and stamina seem to do nothing
you can feed and pet your companion but what does it do?
even on zero health my companion will still follow and attack
the AI is horrible, they never attack your target
the whole companion system needs a complete rework

  • disable ally pet highlight, particularly sorcerer pets

this gets in the way so often, and the buff bars are split and pushed over the right which is very awkward

  • remove instanced dungeons

I have found that getting to level 160 you start to rely on instanced dungeons instead of farming fields or doing quests because the quest lines run out and the instanced dungeons simply give way more exp

what should happen is there should be better spawn times and exp rates for field monsters and simply more areas to explore and farm in

instanced dungeons make the game feel like a chore, you login do your instances then logout, its getting incredibly tedious and boring, there needs to be more focus on the world and exploration, forming parties and finding interesting places to grind, there’s non of this in TOS atm

  • spell cooldowns

remove cooldowns and instead have a cast time and allow 50%-90% cast time reduction depending on the skill, similar to what RO had only without going to far as to break abilities

one of the coolest things about RO was the lack of spell cooldowns
it was so much more interesting then every other MMO in existence that has it

because of cooldowns theres much less focus on managing mana
you basically just spam your combo whenever the cooldowns allow, its boring

the SP stat is meaningless for most classes because of this

to counter the " you can just spam your strongest skills" argument

i would say that’s a design flaw of the skills

e.g. if you make a mage in RO that only spams SG, there should be ways to fight against that, or an alternate reason to be careful when you use it

maybe jack up the mana cost significantly, so they can cast it like 5 times in a row, then they have no mana for anything else

or put a charge on it so every time you cast, the charge increases and every point of charge has a 5% chance to freeze you aswell
so you could spam it but it may backfire

there are so many options, its just crappy design that limits so many of these games, they never try anything new, that’s why i have so much respect for RO, they pulled some crazy ■■■■ like instant cast even if it was broken you remember it, what will you remember about TOS other then it was a weak clone of RO?

  • spell attributes descriptions and calculations need to be shown a lot more

its ok to keep some little things secret, but there is way too much core information missing

when looking to make a build in an MMO which takes a lot of investment to make, you don’t want to make decisions without knowing where your going.
the current lack of class and ability descriptions makes this incredibly difficult to do

when looking through the skill calculator and trying to come up with an interesting build, i find something cool, then i search around to see if it is possible and various posts on reddit and these forums say its not

it would be nice not to have to grind all the way up through your build only to find out one little thing that you wanted doesnt work which makes your whole build pointless

E.g. looking at my wugushi abilities some of them apply [poison] but what does that even mean? is it my attack as poison that ticks 1 per second for x seconds? nothing is explained anywhere

  • trade chat

please make a channel for just trading so that players aren’t constantly spamming the ALL channel with WTT [untradable object] or WTB Arde

  • !! Messages don’t persist through load zones

minor annoyance

  • party automation

before TOS was released there was a blog post or facebook post (which i cant find) that said TOS was going to be a very socially focused game which sounded great, and it still can be if some of the issues are dealt with

there should be an option to automate parties which means you can auto join and leave a party based on your current quest line or grinding area

the main thing atm is the parties that show up on the left side of the screen are almost always greyed out, why even show them?

  • if all other members leave party, remove the last player from the party as well unless they were the original party lead

im pretty sure this is necessary to make an automated party system more viable, too many players run around in a one-man party

  • bonfire should scale with duration and party members

the more people around the bonfire the better the bonus should be

also have a look at how bonfire is done in Vindictus, you get a small buff for sitting at the fire for a few minutes, you can use this to help prepear for a dungeon run

  • remove consumables cooldown / % heal potions

health potions heal so little and the cooldown on them means you have to only use them for a clutch escape from a mob

alternatively if you want to keep the cooldowns, make the potions actually heal you for a % to make them more viable

maybe split potions into small instant heals and long duration regeneration style potions

  • attack speed

this is just another way to diversify builds, make the game more interesting

if you want to make a spell heavy archer or a Z attack archer your build path and stats would be totally different

  • spell attributes are boring

almost every spell has +1% damage

please make more attributes that drastically change how the ability works instead of just +damage

e.g. cleric heal could become a panel that heals any ally standing on it over time rather then just instantly healing 1 player for the full amount

  • spell AOE limit, enemy agro limit and leash range

this is probably one of the most annoying ‘features’ TOS has, it makes mobbing pointless and simply encourages single target damage

  • exp range limit should be removed or rescaled

if you can kill enemies way above your level why is there no reward for doing so?

  • stamina

why is stamina a thing? i believe it was meant to be an anti-bot mechanism and we can all see how well that worked. the only other uses are sword class sprint and 1 monk ability

i think this could be removed for simplicity or reworked into more abilities to be useful across a broader range of builds

  • chat censorship

so sick of these… i get that they want to try keep the place nice and civil
but its not even doing that, i legitimately get more annoyed at the filter itself then anything else in the game

leave it on by default, but give us an option to turn it off on our clients

typing “what class should i pick” should not be censored for ‘ass’

its broken and stupid and doesn’t do what it was build for, please remove this broken garbage

  • journal quests rewards insignificant

you have to grind for ages to get specific drops from a specific place and throw them all away for something pathetic like +1 accuracy

maybe they stack up in the late game, they just seem weak for now

##Constructive criticism please, don’t just say “this is wrong” say "this is wrong because"
unless you agree of course!

1 Like

Why dont you play RO, its still out there.

Ok, admittedly 3rd class gaming sucks, renewal rules suck.
But dont force an image onto different games.
This is not EASports randomgame1995-2016 with only updated player names and graphics :wink:

1 Like

Because playing RO isn’t going to make TOS any better. It’s not going to make RO any better either.

I have to admit some of his suggestions are legit.

I feel like theres some things in this game that were meant for something else but ended up not being used because the direction of the game is being changed.

1 Like

thank you, the first person to reply without random hate or nonsense :slight_smile:

You should really try reading some of it, I know you stopped reading once you saw the RO part lol. Just take a look at some of the suggestions. Hes not bashing the game.

1 Like

I checked every box and saw “make it RO” - yet again its not, its not meant to be. I like my avataricon for a reason and its not TOS, but I also like fresh ideas and see them through to the end.

seems you have not read anything then, I’m not saying 'make it RO’
im saying there are aspects of this game that would be better in a certain way, they just happen to be done that way in RO already

if you prefer things the new way thats fine too, but a flat dismissal isn’t helping anyone

i want to make TOS better, thats why im posting my feedback on this feedback forum

We might be reading two different posts but he barely mentioned RO on each of his suggestions. i dont agree with all of them but i agree with most of the QoL suggestions.

1 Like

Yup, I like some of your ideas, especially % scaling. But 2 things I disagree:

  1. Cooldown: Many spells in TOS are much much stronger than pre-renewal RO (pls forgive me for this). End game PvE and PvP is going to be about better ping and AOE spamming. Particularly skills that can deal negative status and heavy AOE. As long as your ping is good, you can spam pots like no tommorrow.

  2. Instanced Dungeon: There will be people playing till certain level and start farming dungeons. Pls understand there are maps to explore and other activities to do. I believe devs don’t want to promote farming either. Better spend that Dungeon Rushing time to do something else. Socializing for example

the abilities can easily be rebalanced to account for a no-cooldown system
RO had cast times on most abilities instead of cooldowns, the only thing that was a bit broken then was the 100% cast time reduction you could get with DEX, im not exactly saying do that

if you remove instance dungeons then people will be in the field, much more likely to make parties to explore or grind then to sit and wait for matchmaking a dungeon

  1. Rebalance skills? Seriously, you really think it’s easy to do. How many skills are there in TOS? Do you remember Quick Cast?

  2. Instances: No, no, no, no. Maps in TOS are small AF. You can take a few minutes walking from one end to another. Plus, there aren’t that many mobs either. Remember, instances are pretty much an extension of field but with auto party match-making. What TOS really lacks is a huge raid for 6+ member (well, but fps is still a big issue) and proper PvP

nothing worth doing is ever easy.

so make some bigger ones…

spawn more of them[quote=“hienng1991, post:12, topic:299246”]
extension of field
[/quote]

why not extend the fields with more fields?
the auto system takes away from the MMO experience, there should be more exploration and randomly bumping into people and searching in town for players

I have to say, when I saw this,

I cry. This forum really need a Dislike button. If you dont like Dungeons, go grind yourself and go play another game, dont try force me to play as you think is right, killing 10000 mobs at infinitum just to get some levels.


Not to mention:

I dont like to use it, and you want me be forced to use the have chances of survive? Give me a break.


You may have some good points here and there, but other points are just like :poop:
There is not way people give you moral with this.
[DISLIKED]

Seriously, how long do you think it’s gonna take for IMC to complete half of what you said? Obviously not in a few months.

Pls try to imagine something that goes along with IMC vision or something feasible to do. It’s too late to change the whole system now. Or if you really want changes. Wait for TOS renewal. In the far future

since when is there a time limit for this?

even if they take another year to do it and it turns out good, then it doesn’t matter.

what exactly is their vision? and how do you know its different to what i said?

instead of just saying ‘your post is bad’ how about being a bit more descriptive and saying WHY you think something is bad

pick one thing that i said that you disagree with and explain your reasoning for disagreeing

this game you kind of need cool downs for alot of the skils. some of the skills are pretty spammy. however some skills should have a lower cool down.

for example, im perfectly fine with the cool down for heal but not so much for mass heal. i think it should get a nerf on effectiveness and perhaps a wayyy shorter cool down.

i agree withe the party automation as well. and the bonfire. that would be cool. although the bonus should be minimal

i also agree with the consumables cool down. however i think that there should be a cooldown ( rich people spamming pots in pvp ). just not for as long as it is.

if they want to spend all their money on pots why not let them? they had to farm up the silver to buy them just like anyone else

Vision. Maybe I used the wrong word there. Something similar to “Design principles” should be better. You can figure that out from the game easily

  1. Cooldown. Pls understand, this is not RO. This is TOS. Removing cooldown will make some skills too powerful. Remember how LK mindlessly Bowling Bash everything or Ranger spamming Arrow Storm for their entire life?

  2. Maps. Every field map IS small. I haven’t explored every maps but I strongly believe EVERY SINGLE FIELD MAP IS SMALL

PS: I think IMC vision is making an old-school MMORPG with some modern features, not Ragnarok HD Remaster