Or you will see 95% of the population going the same build, same gear, same skill. 4% of those with friends to carry them will have the guts to do something not on the trend, 1% for those who doesn’t care about build and just want to enjoy and do what they want.
Watch as they add some crazy STR modifiers to rank 9 skills and shift the momentum back to the STR camp. The troll is strong in IMC. They’ll never let us swordies be settled.
No problem there captain, that is actually something ‘DEX’ Builds will be looking forward, having high DEX at mid game, then power shift to STR at R9, DEX builds won’t be bothered much. infact, they will welcome it with open arms. also, they still got Base skill damage + attribute that benefits well with DEX via Crit. rate.
Where-in, early and mid game STR builds might find a hard time.
i actually wanted to have something like that happen, my dream of building a full-str Glasscannon swordie will come to live.
I’ve done such a thing before (also with manticen) with my own stats reset from STR to DEX (long ago) and yes I got my damage down, as expected, but it’s not all about damage. At least not everyone aims for raw damage only.
Thought it’s 100? Rather above average iirc, higher than demon lord bosses for sure. I take Manticen as my upper limit at crit sampling.
Demon lord bosses (280) area round 85-100,
Yea 200 manticen only has about 75 according to old stat profile. pretty sure it is correct @_@…
Isn’t that already happening, lel. The only real diversification in the game is class build, that is, if you dare step out of the meta with all the consequences.
Man, I’m loving that over 300 DEX test result actually (feckin card attachment update y u no hit my server already!!!). Satisfying.jpg
Even with just 295 DEX I’m evading WBs attacks AND skills reliably. iirc, someone, not Aki[?] claimed there isn’t such a thing as face-tanking WBs even mission bosses? Well he’s terribly mistaken. Mission bosses are laughable, simply stand in the mid of 2, cyclone, maybe get scratched 2-3 times lol. Of course I still try to manually dodge some obvious boss skills, like Marnox’s shoulder charge or Mirtis’s thunder strike (from above, electricity on the ground as cue) with simple side-step.
Finally, we can “discuss” w/o “bashing” on someone decision goin dex/str build.
Im seeing from your 1st vid (str build) at 0.14 (end of cyclone) before you put another cleave manticen hp was around 123k, the 2nd vid at 0.13 (end of cyclone) was around 157k.
Str build cyclone crit = around 26k(495STR-96DEX), Str dex 1:3 (188STR-347DEX)around 20-21k. Diff in patk each build about 400 perhaps? 800 with lv 10 dov? (1st vid patk 3532-3795, 2nd vid patk 2734-2997)
Here’s 280 R7 str-con with 35 bonus stats.
330 R8 str-con with 50 bonus stats.
330 R8 str-dex with 50 bonus stats.
Diff on str > 426+30% = 553.8 (554 patk). Bad at math someone cmiiw.
Yup that correct.
May i add there is also a difference in crit rate and crit damage
it will be 426 crit damage and 360 crit rate. on both builds.
For Str R8 builds
The Pro : 554 pattack + 426 crit damage offset 360 crit rate.
For Dex
The pro : additional 360 crit rate.
Things to note Critical damage (inital boost) is T1-3 mod which is the same as attributes. After Base is added and when you crit it includes 50% additional damage. It adds into the total addition including skills.
The question is is this more than 554 patt or in dopple terms when dov 15 is out 831 patt in difference.
You must also note that with no dex your crit caps out at 286, with monstrance and quicken it is only 400 crit rate. This is only 32 %
where as a 365 build can reach a crit rate cap of 971 with monstrance and quicken which is nearly 95% crit rate.
We are unable to compensate crit rate with item limitation, but we are able to compensate damage due to transcend which is a 80% gamble or even higher 100% if you do it over time.
Crit damage compensation comes from item as well. Key note.
well, that stats are w/o equips and cards. You can pump more to str/con if you aim for around 350-370 dex (with x8 *10 ella), for patk/hp.
Second post for Damage on skill formula explanation vs CRIT Damage,
This is the key note here especially with for example Sturtzhau
Which is 4895 in skill damage. I will keep it simple and exclude attributes because base damage/ crit proc * attributes = total damage.
I will just put deeds in 15 here and STR VS DEX difference now is 554 pattack in this case. So for example your weapon is base 2k Pattack
Crit attack i will leave it as Dex = 300 Str = 746
Base pattack for dex = 300 , str will be 554+300 = 854
Total add up damage
Dex = 2300 patt
Str = 2854 patt
Deeds is added in with 2.5
Dex = 5750
Str = 7135
now we calculate skill damage Without crit
Dex = 5750 + 4895 = 10645
Str = 7135 + 4895 = 12030
Damage with crit.
Dex = 10645 * 1.5 + 300 = 16267.5
Str = 12030 * 1.5 + 746 = 18791
Assuming both sides are going crit rate gear (+ 280 ) on party terms with monstrance + quicken. So you can assume Dex builds will crit at 90%/100
Str build going at 40%
We will average out DPS in 10 hits of Sturtzhau
Dex will crit 9/10 hits.
Dex damage = 16267.5 * 9 + 10645 = 157052.5
Str will crit about 3/10 hits
Str damage = 18791 * 4 + 12030 * 6 = 147344
This is a difference with high skill damage. That include multi hits of cyclones on level 15.
This is the problem on 330. 280 is still fine and STR > dex due to the fact you can easily boost your crit rate onto 50% which is ALOT more beneficial to strength builds. As you level up your crit rate decreases. Monster resist up as well it’s shiet.
Where as Dex builds suffer more at R7 due to low skill base damage + transcend system wasn’t ready for them.
Now enjoy the maths.
TL:DR
DEX builds benefits more due to lack of crit gear. You can compensate damage with transcend and damage gears. They give + aoe ratio too.
Where as STR builds have to run full crit gear cap. They are still facing the issue and the additional damage from crit base + crit damage will not be as effective.
for those mechanics hungry peeps here you go.
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Then we factor in defense and how crit attack value ignores it. This is why yellow numbers sometimes can get significantly higher (% wise) than white numbers on high defense enemies, or on level penalty.
#justyellowjunkie
Looks like team DEX stop bashing you after you proof yourself that STR > DEX for Dopple DPS, lol
apparently people stopped bashing him the moment he stopped doing a stupid reply, so it’s a good healthy discussion we can have now rather than stupid bashing all over.
also I didn’t read the above posts, but his vid is still R7, not R8. Should see what happens after.
I don’t think there is a need for bashing when everyone is down for a healthy discussion of what is happening.
This is still R7 where DOV 15 , Cyclone 15 , Zwerchhau 5 , Sturtzhau 5 is missing.
If you are following the topic closely. It was already mention due to the fact crit rate can be boost up to 50-65% with just current gear standing.
(290 crit or more 42*3 + 14 + 70 + 74(sissel) + 6 base))
Assuming manticen with 75 crit resist in this case
crit rate at R7 = ( (290 - 75)*42) / 280 = 32%
Crit rate at r8 = ((290-75)*42 ) / 330 = 27%
VS
Crit rate at R7 = (649 - 75)*42 / 280 = 86.1
Crit rate at R8 = (649 - 75)*42 / 330 = 73.1
This will change alot in R8 due to “Reverse scaling for crit.” well you will see what will happen when R8 comes. It’s self explanatory once we reach that stage.
You want to do a damage over time test? Just do a full rotation of the skill sequence
Cleave > Zwerchhau > Cyclone > Cleave > Cyclone
Cleave > Zwerchhau > Sturtzhau > Redel / Zornhau + Zucken
Record this damage on 1 rotation.
Add in Crit rate with similar setup + party buff (scroll monstrance and quicken from chrono)
R7
STR
((322.8 - 75) * 42) * 1.25) / 280 = 46%
DEX
(714 - 75) * 42 * 1.25)/280 = 119% <-- this is over shot but lel.
R8
Str
((322.8 - 75) * 42) * 1.25) / 330 = 39%
Dex
((714 - 75) * 42 )* 1.25)/330 = 101% <---- just nice.
Why is R7 stronger with STR? Key highlight. Due to low POWER skills.
Transcend wasn’t in it earlier until late. Critital damage is low as well from equipment boost. At most 350-600? (Phada x2 + weapon/gems/headgear)
Why is R8 Dex scaling better? Key highlight. No improvise crit rate gear.Skills are not % scaling.Unlike Cannoner/muskeeter etc. They are flat numbers…
To be honest, i just realized even at R7 DEX is better DPS than STR.
the real deal comes from this goddamn Glass mole cards.
Do note that even if you go FULL STR, even without the crit, it will deal enormous damage if paired with 70% damage modifier. (but it didn’t happen, because STR builds wants those yellow numbers, so they went 7x Ella cards)
Then comes DEX that gets amplified P.atk from different sources. and the ability to constantly deal Crit damage, which is another 1.5. paired with 70% bonus from Glass mole cards. that’s where the gap is.
then here comes R8 with another 10% bonus from glass mole…
To add up, HL3 has Armor break to deal with enemy DEF.
i can see why the famous route SW > HL3 > Barb1 > Dop3 comes to life. HL2 offers 3 Slash skills with decent cooldown and attributes, HL3 comes with Armor break. while Barb only picked for the cleave debuff. Dop3 amplifies Slash damage that makes this route popular now…
i’d say i’ll blame this glass moles card doing enormous amplification to damage…
SW > Pelt > HL3 > Barb1 > Dop3
thats R9 dude. 