Swordies are bad not because of their damage, but the lack of AoE and exposure to the enemies, you have Running Shot to keep running and hitting.
Lets just save all of us some time and say the overall output is bad. Regardless if someone sees it as a damage issue, skill issue, etc, the output itself is what suffers. o.o
I donât think that damage is a problem, maybe some people say that because they fcked up their builds, Iâve seen so many swordies whom hit HARD, like really hard.
Wouldnât be surprised. Dex builds are a little too dominant, and seem to overshadow whatâs really best for the class pathing some players follow.
Swordsman dps as it is , not so bad. The rest out dos it, thats where the problem is.
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please make this phrase a thread in the swordsman section rofl 
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actually playing the class you like is the best
fk those meta
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Donât get me wrong, Iâm loving my class so far, and have just recently hit Barbarian C3. But Iâm still suspecting Iâll meet the conflict some seem to have at level 200 and beyond, due to the scaling Swordsman has in terms of output, compared to other classes. Iâm dedicating my efforts in utter ignorance of that problem though, not having waited this long to not play what I had intended to play from the beginning. But inspirations can only get you so far in terms of justifying the result.
Oh god no! The EnglandâŚtoo⌠Strong⌠Canât⌠Understand⌠My head⌠My eyes⌠NOOO!
Swashbuckling and âtankingâ is a newbie trap.
Even if everyone takes their time collecting mobs in 220+ grinding spots with basic attacks and moving in together instead of using swashbuckling the exp/hr will end up the same because whatâs actually limiting it is aoe cooldowns and crappy respawn times.
Swordsman is 100% useless and peltasta only has a worthless visual effect.
People who think âtankingâ in TOS is useful somehow are inconceivably dumb.
The archers in here admitting that they are so useless and terrible that swordsmen do noticeable damage compared to them should quit.
stop smoking the stuff you smoke dude
also
swordsman class is garbageâŚ
lowest damage output from all characters⌠even offensive cleric builds are more stronger
in end game Swordsman class isnât in meta. You donât need it for ET Chrono+Ele/Warlock+Healer+AoE Archer+flex archer or flex cleric = who need tank not to mention who needs melee dps (im plying that there is something like melee dps in this game)
only purpose for Swordsman class in this game is to pick Peltasta and then be the agro/taunt bot for lv 200+ grind parties and then everyone is ditching swordsman players when it comes to everything else since Archer+Wizard+Cleric combo is perfect.
same goes for bossing⌠you have no option to generate as much dmg as archer/mage classes and be sure to get loot box
IMC made most stupid idea during class design by not making separate Thief/Warrior/melee DPS tree and keeping Swordman as the knight/crusader/melee utility class type⌠they though that mixing melee DPS with TANK into one class tree would be good idea. Now they no clue what to do with Swordsman class to make it viable/good. If you make offensive Swordie classes (Zerk, Corsair, Dragon, etc) deal damage similar to archer class then it will create gigantic balancing issues but on the other hand if those classes wonât get buffed they will be useless piece of garbage
people already are tired as hell of the âyou must pick peltasta1 (taunt) to be useful in PvE and invited to partiesââŚ
I wish that IMC could go back in time and actually make Thief/Warrior class to avoid the problems they have now with current Swordsman class. I miss the good old class system from RO. It worked perfectly and IMC should aimed for something similar during creation of ToS
well most of those archers are probably
rainbow builds
edgy assassin wannabe PvP builds
single target A3/Q3 builds
âhurr durr Iâm not dealing lots of AoE dmg, no one wants me to eng game partiesâ
âhurr durr Iâm not OP OP boss killer!â
âhurr durr stupid healers donât heal me and I die whole time! Who needs CON? Iâm pure STR in leather armor and I have 6k at lv 180+)â
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Even in RO, the classes has many variants that had both Tanking capabilities, especially the melee combat ones.
The problem here isnât that thereâs a lot of possible builds mothballed into one meta-group. The problem is that most of the skills arenât designed to work in a way that is helps some class builds benefit more from certain stat builds than others.
Some skills need to scale with STR (Gung Ho), some with DEX (Concentrate), and some with CON (Pain Barrier). Some can even come out of left field and scale with SPR or INT, but the intent is fairly simple⌠to make build paths more apparent and create better synergy between jobs of the same type.
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just because something has high hp does not mean at all its a tank . it doesent even matter because even with all that hp you die quick so thats one thing to take into consideration but even then sometimes some of the highest hp classes usually have terrible defences.
now considering that swordsman has 9/14 attack classes, 2/14 defence classes Squire and 2/14 support classes its pretty clear what kind of path they wanted swordsman to go. surely if they wanted swordsman to be tanks there would be a larger number of defence classes?. and much more wanting us to use a shield over a 2 hand weapon?, problem is you cant tank all you can do is aggro and run around. and if you cant do that lol what use you got with swordsman in their current state.
if anytihng melee should be doing alot more danage. being how you have to run up to someone face and dont have to hide behind people or rocks and the range is much smaller . go ahead argue about defence defence means nothing in this game. exspecailly magic defence so unless they either make the swordsman more useful in damage or being able to defend against magic and melee they are kind of useless ,
for those who say get spriit lol 1 mdef per 4 spirit is a joke swordsman already gotta worry about str, dex and con they dont need a 4th stat to worry about too unlike everyone else (COUGH , FULL VIT WIZ COUGH)
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They already did, that interview was so weird because it seemed like it was made beforehand (probably) and just recently reached us.
They already made an adjustment to Swordsmenâs STR on Ktos (fairly recently) unless theyâre planning to make another.
Okay, so give Swordsman a necklace similar to Animus that gives them 40% STR or DEX instead.
I can guarantee you it would still not make a full STR dps Swordsman on par (or even close) to a full CON Animus dps Wizard.
The funny thing is, the biggest problem with Swordsman isnât even STR. Itâs the animation lag and lack of more CC negation/removal options, as well as bad scaling for their skills in terms of damage and cooldowns. More animation delay means Swordsman cannot commit to dealing dps even if they are in melee because they have to be worried about moving out of the way of CC/Damage, and lack of CC removal options means that while in melee, if they are CCâed they cannot get out of it and lose out on dps. Lastly, their skills donât scale well against mobs in the higher levels⌠higher skills have too long of a cooldown to be reliably consistent dps or do too low of damage⌠or both.
or⌠or maybe⌠maybe u go make a full con animus dps wizard
your lack of understanding of a swordie/wiz/archer/cleric really shows in your argument.
i dont think u have even fully comprehended the ranks and skills of classes.
you dont even understand what an animus does.
youâre so saltyâŚ
and youâre probably right
and i understand u, i felt the same way for pyro builds.
and so i suggest u to take this advice and stfu.
âif you canât beat them, join them.â
If youâre going to make blanket statements like
âyour lack of understanding of a swordie/wiz/archer/cleric really shows in your argumentâ
âI donât think u have even fully comprehended the ranks and skills of classes.â
âyou donât even understand what an animus doesâ
âyouâre so saltyâŚâ
Please explain how you know I donât understand/comprehend these things and how Iâm salty in a well written argument ^o.o^
The point I was trying to make wasnât so much that Swordsman need a necklace that gives their main stat a boost based on some kind of percentage. The point was that dps Swordsman will still be weak even if they had one.
I bring up the core reasons why Swordsman are still considered weak, and I even forgot one glaring issue which is the fact that they have to balance between 3 stats as opposed to Wizards that only need to balance between 1-2 depending on their build.
Archers can focus STR because of classes like Rogue that gives them flat +crit chance allowing them to bypass the need of high DEX to get good damage, but even a DEX or STR/DEX Archer can do well by going Archer C2 for +25% crit rating and math/theorycrafting has already been done that shows DEX is good for Canonneer/Musketeer and both are optimal dps choices for AoE or burst.
Swordsman have to balance out their CON more, and even some DEX whilte they invest in STR⌠and even if you manage to somehow optimize your stats for your build, theyâre still not strong for reasons Iâve already brought up.
Another reason why Swordsman fall behind is because their early ranks donât exactly increase DPS like Archer/Wizard early ranks do.
Archer C2 gets +25% crit rate with Swift Step, or they can go Ranger and get +10-20% Missile damage depending on how far they invest into it. Wizard C3 has +50% Magic damage with Quick Cast. What does Swordsman haveâŚ
R2
-Highlander C1 +50% Crit Attack while using 2H Swords? Very restrictiveâŚ
R3
-Hoplite Finestra, but its uptime is basically crap unless you go for R4⌠and its only for Spears⌠and its a flat Crit Rate increaseâŚ
R4
-Barbarian C2 gets up to level 5 Frenzy and Warcry, both of which have long cooldowns and their uptime is not even 50%⌠and theyâre flat increasesâŚ
-Hop C2 has Finestra at full uptime, but again strictly for Spears. Also the Crit Rating will not scale well when we get higher levels because its a flat increase. The only skill they can count on to scale well even later is Spear Lunge, and the uptime for that is only 25-50% depending on how you optimize Overheat. Itâs not 100% uptime like Archer C2 / Ranger C-3 / Wizard C3 bonuses.
-Highlander C3 gets Skull Swing for 75% uptime on Armor Break or 0 defense on targets. This will continue to scale well in the later levels, but by how well is unknown since we donât have data on level 300+ mobs/bosses. With the current cap, this skill basically means +300-400 damage on some mobs with that much defense, but seeing as how Barb C3 buffs can be improved with Doppel DoV, Barb C3 buffs are currently better.
R5
-Barb C3 gets +330 Physical Attack with Warcry on 10 targets, and can reach something like 46% uptime. Uptime of Frenzy buff itself surpasses 50% just barely, but you likely wonât have max stacks until 20-30 seconds into the buff, so its uptime really isnât 50%. Not only that, but this +Physical Damage will not scale well in higher levels because they are not percent-based like Archer/Wizard buffs are.
-Hoplite C3 simply gets slightly improved Finestra (+50 Crit Rate). Again, flat increase.
R6
-Doppel has DoV which means +50% Increase Attack speed and Physical Damage at the cost of 50% defense, but you have to let this ability stack up by taking hits before getting the full bonus, and how often you can utilize the damage bonus depends on CC and Damage of the mobs youâre fighting. Finally, R6, we have an ability that scales based on percent!!!
-Rodelero C3 has High Kick which is supposedly +200% increased Strike Damage debuff on targets and has 50% uptime, but I donât know for sure since I have never seen a Rod C3 talk about High Kick. Even though its restricted to Strike Damage, itâs a good debuffâŚ
R7
-Doppel C2 has improved DoV
-I donât really know much about Dragoon and Gae Balg, but Iâve heard it applies a debuff and buffs with attributes that increase damage.
So you see, Swordsman lack multipliers in their base class or other circles, and donât get reasonable multipliers until way later. Highlander gives +50% Critical Attack while equipped with a 2H sword⌠but to take advantage of Critical Attack, there needs to be more Crit Rating gear available or heavy investment in DEX⌠and by going DEX you lose dps, statistically. Hoplite gets +Crit Rate, but its flat and wonât scale well at higher levels when the limit increases. In comparison, Archer and Wizard percentage buffs will continue to be relevant for all of their damaging skills and for more levels/ranks to come in future updates.
tl;dr Hereâs another opportunity for you to say I donât understand what Iâm talking about and troll me some more :3
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love the long reply, didnt read past my first 3 quotes.
see u, keep on QQing then and dont take my advice