Tree of Savior Forum

Some doppelmath

Ok, so let’s start dopel math class:

Every lvl of dmg skill gives you 6 - 11 % damage, depending on skill
Yes, DoV is kind of useless because it gives only 2 -3 % but for a skillpoint + increased incoming damage. Might be useful for dps contest in some lab test, but useless for overall game.
sturtzhau might do ALOT more depending on enemy defence

Some cd include use time and overheats.

As you can see - Cyclone is not so OP anymore. First - it is slow. You will need 5.5 seconds to do it’s full damage. And you have to keep enemy close all those 5.5 seconds. Nowdays it is useful only as filler when you are waiting for your burst damage skills.

main burst rotation will be kile this

Zverchhau - cleave - zornhau - zucken - redel - cleave - sturtzhaux2 - cleave - cyclonex2

So we need sw1 - hl1(for 50% critical attack, crown, and block) - barb1( for stun and cleave) 2random ranks and doppel3 for that.
Question is - what ranks would be better to take for those 2 radom ranks.
So here is some combinations;
sw 1 hl3 barb1 dopp3
I personaly don’t like this one, because the only thing you will get - more filler dps skills, that have DPM of a mordlsag ( with no guaranteed crits ) and some of those skills benefit from dex, and you, as a dopel will have next to no dex at all.

sw1 barb3 hl1 dopp3
A bit better - you will get seism ( around 7680% dpm), moar stunn, ~440 phy attack from frezny or 15 - 30% from Frenzy, Personally i liek frenzy better, most time you will benefiet from it more, except times with VERY defended enemies. Last thing - Giant Swing. Sometimes it can show some terrifying damage. And never take pouncing. considering it’s damage, cooldown and usability - it’s worse than even giant swing.

sw3 barb1 hl1 dopp3
My favourite for now. First - you get PB3. With your slow dopel skills and cyclone it will yeild more dps than seism just by not letting monsters/bosses interrupt your combos and cyclones. Then - Restrain. that gives you 60% stun chance on every hit. And you probably have more hits than fencer.
GungHo and concentrate still require testing, but that’s extra damage, always welcome, and finally you can fetch some filler skills from here. bash for knockdown or whatever.

Why no peltasta you say? Why for ? waste a rank for taunt? Noway, we’re damage dealers, not tanks, want to to taunt so much - put 1 point into Punish, if nothing is knocked back it still provokes monsters around you.

What’s your ideas on doppelbuild?

I’m currently cycling between SW1>HL1>Barb3>Doppel 3 and SW1>HL3>Barb1>Doppel 3 and can’t really decide.

HL has some garbage skills, like Cartar and Moulinet, which aren’t really impressive after the update (at least that’s my experience). On the other hand, bleeding+skyliner aswell as Vertical slash can do quite nice damage.

As for barbs, i don’t really notice the aspd difference from Frenzy, despite having no DEX. Seism is really nice with 5 Wild Nature stacks, otherwise kinda ‘meh’. I really love Giant Swing, though, doing 100~200k damage (without transed weapon or attribute points invested ) on the target and possibly targets you hit while spinning in it is so much fun.

I don’t think DOV is useless.
At level 15 it boosts all your attacks multiplicatively by 33%, meaning, for example, your Zornhau lv 10 would go from 19872% to 26429%.
That’s a huge boost and for all your skills. And if you have some healer in your party the additional damage shouldn’t really matter.

Isn’t it difficult (i.e. impractical) to get high crit rate now? To the point pure damage stat builds are just as viable as far as cost-effectiveness goes?

Aside from the 50% crit atk from HL, what else would it be good for?

To make it Clear.
Giant Swing:
3096% Strike Long CD long Animation Single Target(?)

Vs Skyliner:
336%x2=672% Bleeding 662x2= 1324% + Cleave x 1.5= 1986%
5 oH 15s Cool down 1986%x5= 9930%

  • Very Fast Animation +Zwerchhau make it even stronger.

In the time you get all you Buffs on a Hl3 killed the boss/monster already.

following here, I’m trying a full Str build for PvE, do you think it’s worth doing so, or would you go for Str 3 : dex 1?

this was my try yesterday

i’ve been comparing giant swing with pouncing. And giant swing hits monsters with the spin and landding. Tricky, but stil hits hard.

So, where you gonna get that bleeding ? w/o bleeding it’s worse that seism. And other HL skills are just horrible. And how long does it takes to hit all those OH5 ? Seism has similar dpm on 2Oh. Should i demind you that cleave lasts only 5 seconds and you have better skills to land on?

Spending zwerchau with 30 second cd on some filler, when you have zornhau ? that’s just stupid.

Huge boost But it costs you 15 skill points.

Ok. 10 redel 10 zucken 10 zornhau. 3 cyclone 1 zwerchau 5sturtzhau

6 points left you have to take away 9 points from above to make it worth it.
every point in redel zucken and zornhau = 7(5 if moved to DOV) % damage. Every point in sturtzhau - 11( 9 if moved to DoV) % damage
taking away from zornhau - that’s just stupid.
so we take em from zucken and redel till 6 adn one from strttzhau - for less damage to dpm
( with less than 6 the buff won’t work. )
Now we have
zucken - 6936 + 33% ( 9228 )
redel - 7320 +33% ( 9735)
And OP 26429 on zornhau

That might fly

So quality build on doppel will look like 15 dow 3 cyclone 10 zornhau 6 zucken 5 redel 1 zwerchhau 1 sturtzhau,

yet + 19 % incoming damage. Glass cannon, huh?

So what about ranks b4 dopel, what to take?

IMO for DEX = Highlander3/Sword3>Barb3
STR = Highlander3/Barb3>Sword3
CON/PVP = Sword3>Barb3>Highlander3

Without DEX the crit attack bonus is next to useless so is could be replaced with Sword 2 or Barb2 for restrain + other buffs or wild attribute e.g. +another 50 crit rate from cleave etc. Highlander(2) and Sword3
have skills which benefit from DEX attack speed, you can easily fit crosscut and 5xSkyliner into cleave’s debuff time. Also, auto-crits on anything in cloth + High Crit attack (with mordschlag) sounds nice.

If crown is still the same then the reduction in damage taken is related to your physical attack, and unless you’re running max STR and lvl15 Cross Guard it’s hard to block anything. IMO builds with many (low %) multi attacks are better with a STR build than a DEX one.

Sword3 has two really noticeable buffs being, restrain and a high level pain barrier but in and of themselves they don’t increase damage values.

Regarding DOV,

+19% of 300 (how much rank 8 mobs hurt me with my trash armour) ~ 360
+19% of 1000 = 1190

You’re not taking that much more damage, so I’d hardly call that a glass cannon… maybe a brass or a bronze cannon…

Guys just make a cleric Kappa

Im sure you get 5x Skyliner faster through then Giant swing with some dex and bleeding … crosscut??
Crosscut>Cleave>Skyliner x5.
ITs not a filler anymore with this huge dmg.

And sure Cyclone 3 …

Cyclone is you main source of aoe Dmg.

And oh yeah armor break is so useless ~.~

It WAS main source of aoe dmg. Thing is - by moving 7 point from cyclone into zornhau and zucken you will GAIN ~1200%( of your weapon) dpm. Considering you will be able to do all 11 second of cyclone w/o interruption, If cyclone will be interrupted - you will gain much more.
Cyclone has same duration on all lvls now, so fewer points in it - has less impact on dpm.

One dude told me, that there is a synrgy with cleave + warcry for 13 seconds of slashing damage buff, gonna try that barb 3 tomorrow.

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Yeah i see the bad scaling just now.
lvl 15 gives 10x% more atk all 0.2 secs.
That isn´t worth it.

Never was a barb c3 player but i read barb has another way to rise crit rate then cleave?

It does still have +8 aoe atk ratio so, it will hit 3 to 8 more targets than zornhau or zucken.

Requires an attribute on warcry, it’d also extend zwerchhau duration (or any other debuff).

Technically it’s still cleave boosting crit rate, but with the wild attribute cleave can give +100 crit rate instead of +50.

so what is better? high or barb? actually feel very nice the filler skills and rotation with high3 but cleave crit is good too.

Im very confused guys :frowning:

https://tos.neet.tv/skill-planner#112666999.354555.253545.5a6aaabf.1a536a7a8a91a1

any tips with this build? I don’t really like cyclone lul

don’t skip punish or mordschlag, 1 point in each will suffice but they’re both good with their attributes.

bash instead of concentrate

Any idea if Restrain works in combination with Cyclone e.g.? Could be interesting to stun a whole group of monsters.

Guys i need some help… I am comparing cyclone and dovne

Assuming 2000 physical attack

Lvl 9 cyclone (211.6%) with lvl 15 dov (33%) versus
Lvl 15 cyclone (257.8%) with lvl 9 dov (21%)…

So it means option 2 is better dps? 20002.5781.21=6238.76 vs 20002.1161.33=5628…

Prolly made a lot of mistake in the calculation… thanks in advance.

anybody else experiencing bugged cyclone? You can only move after a few seconds. You stop on one spot after a while. I guess they forgot to extend the movement duration when they extended the cyclone duration.

Yes… cant move suddenly… lol