Tree of Savior Forum

Should Dievdirbys statues be immune to knockback in PvE only?

Class and Rank Cleric
#1

tl;dr: I want Dievdirbys statues to be immune to knockback skills in PvE only. They should still be susceptible to knockback in PvP. (Another option would be a new C3 Dievdirbys skill that allows you to carry statues around with reduced movement speed.)

Yes, I know you should place your statues against walls or objects so they don’t get knocked back.

IMC made sure that every instance boss knocks back on practically every attack, including AoE attacks. Furthermore, the knockback range is ridiculously huge—both for how large their hit boxes are, and how far they actually knock back.

Yes, I know you should place your statues against walls or objects so they don’t get knocked back.

Statues are often useless on boss-type mobs in instances with randoms because random parties do not care about positioning. Moreover, most random parties don’t care and don’t even know what Dievdirbys statues do. Yes, I play with a group of friends who know, but sometimes I have to play with randoms and it is painful. And even if I do play with friends, the AoE knockback spam on some bosses is just ridiculous.

Yes, I know you should place your statues against walls or objects so they don’t get knocked back.

I play full support Dievdirbys and it’s getting old explaining why players should stand in Laima or why players should try to bring mobs in front of owls.

Yes, I know you should place your statues against walls or objects so they don't get knocked back.

thx for reading, please provide your input !!

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#2

they need an attribute so owl cant ge knocked back

#3

The problem with players not knowing is a different beast within itself of lacking information about this game. As someone whose considered playing this class my thoughts were that statues take too long to craft and forcing parties into one position is problematic. The general play style this class attempts to put someone into really only works if you’re going to be stationary most of the time.

My question is the real problem here with statues getting knocked back or that you have to wait an absurd amount of time to replace them if they move or the party does? Maybe even some statues don’t have enough AoE radius? Unless you’re paired with an optimal group of competent people it just seems like a burden.

I’ve always wondered though how well Diev + Chrono3 with Pass would work to eliminate the cool down problems.

#4

No doubt, Dievdirbys is optimal when playing with a party that knows what to do and moves with your statues.

For example, in my group of friends we have a system that revolves around my statue cooldowns. We run through the dungeon and mob as much as we can without leashing. We stop at certain checkpoints where I setup my statues, and we AoE everything down (we have a c3 linker).

This is fine and all for trash mobs (and the majority of Earth Tower). What super frustrates me is boss fights, because bosses will just constantly juggle and knock back statues.

Even if you place Carve Owl against a wall, there’s no guarantee that your owls won’t bounce a million times… and bounce onto the other side of the boss so that they no longer face the boss even though they are right next to the boss.

My idea for a solution is to give Dievdirbys a C3 skill (1 point) that allows you to carry existing statues to fix their placement. You would move at a reduced speed, however. (Other solution is just make statues immune to PvE knockback)

#5

Yeah, the problem with the owl “wall” strategy is that bosses can bounce the statues against the wall, and they can easily end up behind them. It happens all the time, and it pisses me off.

Also, sometimes the boss will just randomly run off in a different direction for no reason, and the whole party has to move.

Tanking near the wall isn’t always viable either. Some bosses have lots of circle/cone-based AoEs that make staying close to them very dangerous.

Tanking them against the wall doesn’t give you a lot of room to move around.

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#6

The moment I hit rank 6 druid DPS is so good I can out aggro a c1 pelt and lure the boss to the corner/wall myself. At higher levels (200+) people actually listen to you if you tell them to lure to a corner for your owls to do DPS (unless there’s a I’m kirito style DPS wugushi trying to solo the boss).

I made a suggestion to give owls a block mechanic so they don’t move around any more but eh.

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#7

I agree wit everything you’ve said. It reflects exactly my experience.

Tanking against wall is not always a good idea, and even then, owls can bounce around a lot.

imo IMC should either detain knockbacks (please… every single boss has knockback on like every attack), make statues immune to knockback, or give dievs a way to move statues.

#8

Immunity to knockback for pve only will be really good. I don’t mind increasing the carving time 2x just for immunity. :3

#9

If knockback stays in, Dievs need a way to move their statues around. This is my favorite middleground, personally. An extremely low-effort solution would even be to make a Carve attribute that can knock statues around. I don’t think this is really ideal, but it seems like it’d be easy.

Failing that, complete knockback immunity would be better than the current state of things. It wouldn’t be such a big problem normally, but as pointed out before, pretty much every boss spams knockback.

1 Like
#10

+1 to this
happen to me too all the time for the owl and i feel like i am useless for helping damage to party (even though i am still a healer)
As for other player lacking of information i already experience it my self when my party member died because not move into world tree when i carve it and do otherwise because they don’t know about silence ability.
But then again its a different problem. For me just add immune knocked back abilities

#11

its not a knockback problem. its more like a tanking problem. making statue immune will make it OP.

#12

its not a knockback problem. its more like a tanking problem. making statue immune will make it OP.

So you’re saying that the tank should be aware of when owl statues are bounced around and constantly re-position the boss. While blocking with C, while attacking in between blocks, while trying to move the boss in a small area against a wall, while staying near heal tiles…

It’s a fair point, but I think it’s unreasonable to expect tanks to do that in normal play, ESPECIALLY if the owl bounced into a terrible spot.

Also, making Diev statues immune to PvE knockbacks will not make it OP. However, my other suggestion is to give Dievdirbys a skill to move statues around, if you really think PvE knockback immunity is OP.

#13

2x carving time? Hardcore… I already cry so much when bosses who spam AoE knockbacks (with a short telegraph) hit me out of my Carve Owl casts.

#14

I don’t really think slowing down the gameplay is necessary.

Like buttes pointed out, removing knockback from pve isn’t really overpowered to begin with. If it becomes a problem, emphasize the health bar. I think owls dying is better than owls getting knocked back. Plus, maybe you can do cute stuff like safety zone or heal them.

#15

Well, something got to give. We can’t be asking for something without giving back something in return. Owl statue is already in a good position minus the knockback/frozen problem, and I don’t want a damage nerf if owls can’t be knocked back. If no increase in carving time… how about 4 logs per owl statue?

#16

Carving my way to 280, there isn’t really anything wrong with the statues. Sure, you lose your main source of DPS, but if a boss were to say, move around often, then your owl has no value. Right now, the issue with Dievs in general is that two of its five statues can be easily ignored which are Vakarine and Zemyna.

Vakarine is bugged, in which you can coordinate in a manner that only 1 level is needed.
Zemyna falls off late. If people were to invest into this skill, it’s simply enough points so that they can refresh the effect.

#17

not really…the tank could always play a simpler game like farmville or tetris, if he feels doing tanking chores is too hard for him/her.

btw the heal tiles are the job of support to place it on or near the tank.

#18

Eh, that’s a great idea but I’m really concerns about how other classes will play their role in term of party.

Giving Owl’s knockback immunity meaning…

  • Taking away Peltasta’s role (Aggros + Tank)
  • Overpopulate Cleric classes because Owl is already OP enough to solo everything
  • Replaced certain Cleric sub-DPS classes like Paladin, Monk, Bokor, Sadhu, and Chaplain.
  • Replaced certain Wizard sub-DPs classes like Cryomancer + Psychokino and C3 Wizard (Except for Linker)

So far, this is my opinions at the moment and i do favor in this change… but it feel like we are just literally taking everything away from other classes.

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#19

tetris is a more difficult game than ToS. Have you ever seen top-tier tetris players?

you probably have never played a cleric without Mass Heal, or you probably play CON cleric. For lots of bosses it’s very dangerous for low HP clerics to go near a cone in front of bosses. If the tank is taking enough damage to need heals, you will probably be one-shot or nearly one-shot (unless you are silly C3 Priest and/or have CON)

#20

Your concern is partially offset by carve owl having an extremely long cool down

1 Like