Are you telling me that you cant cast magic on the floor or carve statues instantly ooooor summon demons/ zombies. LAWL you fail at real life.
@Soukyuu So lets add realism to this game step 1 Delete cleric and mage branch step 2 delete all monsters, gods , etc
Now we have swordsman archers and wildlife YAY!
No one said you can’t voice your opinion so calm down lol. I was simply challenging your argument in that the game should be more realistic, in fact I didn’t use my opinions on the matter. I just (sarcastically) brought up other examples of how the game is unrealistic. Realism isn’t the only thing that may make think twice about using the skill. As mentioned before, the skill had too much of a possible loss in it that people thought twice in even getting it.
You said you wish they kept the realism, well I ask why should they keep the realism with swordies and not with any of the other 3 branches? This type of game isn’t the optimal platform for being realistic. Realistically, blood would be gushing out of Kepas and Vubbes when he hack them mercilessly to death and we wouldn’t be carrying around dozens of weapons and armors and pots and other stuff in some kind of invisible magic satchel. And since when did killing random living things drop money from their insides? lol
What are u talking about?
Ftfy 
@harimaku I think he rushed the message, I don’t think it was adressed to you xD (I may be totally wrong there è_é)
My bad wrong person adjusted it
Why don’t I just go outside and stab some deer with my kitchen knife? Then again, nvm, I’m allergic to the sun. And Deer. And the outside. Good thing I have -Realistic- ToS, though!
Dammit i just realized were going for realism so we need to die in 1-3 stabs/arrows sooo that makes pretty much and swordsman without a shield useless and bows can’t keep up with guns.
So now we have a Schwarzer Reiter on foot (because the mount is fantasy unless we insert a horse) and maybe a swordsman with a shield but thats even iffy. So lets call it Tree of Schwarzer Reiter.
Schwarze new OP class. Challenge is affording enough arrows and finding enough things to shoot to qualify for Schwarze school.
And THEN you gotta pay tuition for the classes until you actually learn the schwarze skills. THEN you gotta buy a horse or a really big dog to be mounted. THEN you gotta get your Conceal Carry license. It’s like 50 bucks or so , at least in my city. And you can’t forget the ammo. What is real life?
O GOD THE REALISM im gonna have schwarze university loans for the rest of my life.
… O no if they add lodging… the mortgages
Don’t worry, we will live in barracks and they are paid for by the taxpayers dollars. I’m more worried about the interest on student loans for mages. I heard Hogwarts is really expensive, even for a Ivy League school.
realism mages can only pull cards out of their sleeves and rabbits out of their hats bad at combat.
Lol real life sucks for mages.
Well you can still keep alchimist and “scientists-like” classes instead of mages. You would do some bombs with nitroglycerin that would nuke the map with you too, that would delete your character and you’ll have to start a new one. Yeah because with realism, each time your character die you lose everything. So you need one character/pvp. So month of grinding to have a good enough class to lose in one or two pvps!
@Spaghetti @Kurche @thebloodyaugust : So you’re saying, because the game has unrealistic elements, we should abandon realism. Sure. Let’s make characters look like floating eyeballs flapping their legs to stay afloat. No trees, no ground, no speech, no realism whatsoever.
This is basically the same way you’re twisting my words. Just because the game has unrealistic elements like magic/fictional creatures, doesn’t mean that things that are realistic should just go away. The better they combine realism with magic, the better the game gets. In fact, in world of ToS, magic is natural - so it’s realistic.
However, just because there is magic, it doesn’t mean it explains everything automatically. Most of those things are conveniences for the player.
If you throw a spear, it will leave your hand and land on the target or the ground. It won’t magically return to your hand, unless it’s an enchanted one - which most of them are not, if any at all, since there is nothing about that in their description. Same for the shield. If the animation shows it flying like a boomerang, fine. If it doesn’t, is it enchanted? No? How the hell would it return then? The skill itself is a physical one, so it has to abide by the laws of physics. Summoning a magic spear to stab would have been different, but it’s the Swordsman class we’re talking about here - they do not use magic.
The lack of blood is another matter altogether (and Kepas are plants). It’s more about censoring/rating of the game than realism. As for carrying dozens of items, magic does explain that. Ideally, monsters would be only dropping stuff they could actually carry, ears for Vubbes, some leek from Kepas, etc. And you’d have to sell those to actually get the money. That’s another thing that’s not explainable by magic, so it should have been different in my view.
I don’t see a problem with having to pick up your spear/shield anyway, provided the damage is good. If it isn’t, then it’s a balancing problem, but it has absolutely nothing to do with having to pick them up.
Don’t fall down too fast with your slippery slope fallacy. There is such a such as being practical. If they made the characters to look like floating eyeballs flapping their legs to stay afloat along with no trees, ground, or speech, you think there would even be a forum to talk about it? Please explain to me the market for floating eyeball mmos.
Noone is talking about having no realism whatsoever, in fact we are joking about the game being as realistic as our world lol.
And you said it yourself, magic is natural in ToS. We don’t know the “limits” and the actual laws, if any, that magic follows there. If you are fine with people manifesting and dropping meteor on each other and shooting 1 arrow from a bow but 16 comes, how is a spear returning to your hand crossing the line? Why does ToS have to fit in to what you feel is in enchanted or not for this to happen?
And I wanna know where the club and shield disappears to when Monk does double punch.
For explication it can just be a “War God’s blessing” so that swordsmen can continuously fighting their weapons will always come back! ^^
The thing is i wouldn’t have mind if the spear/shield would stay on the floor and would have to be picked up for regaining your 20%atk/def. But the thing is how do you make it if you have a map change between? Why would the weapons return at that time?
The devs made this because it was more convenient for them too. How would you make it if you go out of pvp and then your spear/shield hasn’t return? After winning/losing you get out and would have to go pick it up on the otehr pvp? but what if it’s not the same map since it must be somewhat like instances? Same with pve, if you forget to pick it up and change map, would it still be there since you chnaged map? and have to come back on the map you forgot it to pick it up? That wouldn’t have been good enough for players convenience.
[quote=“Spaghetti, post:43, topic:39936”]
Don’t fall down too fast with your slippery slope fallacy. There is such a such as being practical.
[/quote]Look who’s talking. Thing is, being practical doesn’t interfere with having to pick up something you dropped.
[quote=“Spaghetti, post:43, topic:39936”]
Noone is talking about having no realism whatsoever, in fact we are joking about the game being as realistic as our world lol.[/quote]No, you guys were just saying I shouldn’t talk about realism in a game that has magic. So I didn’t. But hey, it’s automatically a fallacy when I do it, right?
[quote=“Spaghetti, post:43, topic:39936”]
And you said it yourself, magic is natural in ToS. We don’t know the “limits” and the actual laws, if any, that magic follows there. If you are fine with people manifesting and dropping meteor on each other and shooting 1 arrow from a bow but 16 comes, how is a spear returning to your hand crossing the line? Why does ToS have to fit in to what you feel is in enchanted or not for this to happen?
[/quote]The limits are set by the lore. If the lore doesn’t mention it, you have to be able to explain things using existing information. In this case, magic doesn’t cut it. Nor do physical laws. Meteors are explainable by magic. Archers shooting 16 arrows but nocking 1 isn’t, but wait:
[quote=“Soukyuu, post:23, topic:39936”]
Yes, having archers buy actual arrows would be on that list as well.
[/quote]I have already said the archers are currently unrealistic and would have to be changed as well. You can keep finding examples that are unrealistic and not explainable by magic, and I will just keep telling you it’s something that I’d do differently.
I like realism in my games. So when they shave off stuff bit by bit, I don’t like it.
[quote=“Delven, post:44, topic:39936”]
For explication it can just be a “War God’s blessing” so that swordsmen can continuously fighting their weapons will always come back! ^^
[/quote]Yes, but as I said, we need lore for that. Otherwise there is no basis there is such a thing.
[quote=“Delven, post:44, topic:39936”]
But the thing is how do you make it if you have a map change between? Why would the weapons return at that time?The devs made this because it was more convenient for them too. How would you make it if you go out of pvp and then your spear/shield hasn’t return? After winning/losing you get out and would have to go pick it up on the otehr pvp? but what if it’s not the same map since it must be somewhat like instances? Same with pve, if you forget to pick it up and change map, would it still be there since you chnaged map? and have to come back on the map you forgot it to pick it up? That wouldn’t have been good enough for players convenience.
[/quote]Yes, it’s a convenience as I said in the post you replied to. If you change maps, it should obviously stay there until the time runs out. Just like regular drops. I don’t know if PvP force-boots you after a round, but the simple workaround would be not to - let the player pick up their stuff then leave.
I don’t think people should be focusing too much on the realism versus fantasy debate for these skills in particular. It’s a legitimate discussion, but isn’t it like not getting anywhere? 
You’re free to voice your opinions so don’t mind me anyway
I think that while realism was intended in some measure as a design choice, the idea behind you could lose the shield/spear was to push the notion that the game world can be affected by game mechanics and these should feel impactful, which I guess is what any game dev wants. It really is a fun mechanic and it works wonders from an RPG perspective, but only from the singleplayer RPG perspective. At the end of the day, the very online nature of the game doesn’t allow for it though, because of what’s been discussed already that finally led to the removal of said mechanic, which just shows us how capable IMC is of understanding the limits of their own platform.
Relax we were jabbing fun at the realism thing but if it makes you happy heres a more serious answer.
Realism is a poor fit for this games design, even the artwork is opposed to a realism with its cartoony graphics.
That said if u still cant handle infinite arrows and spears showing back up in your hand we can explain it away the same way ever other fantasy game does MAGIC! magic arrows magic spears magic shields now nothing has to make sense all good.
I was just joking around and i think its the same for @Spaghetti neither of us were actually trying to form a argument with our bullshitting earlier.
I’ve already tried to explain why MAGIC doesn’t necessarily explain it, but eh. @Alkaid is right though, this discussion won’t lead anywhere, so let’s get back on topic.