NO Job reset PLEASE!

[Nirimetus]

F2p models tend to work by utilising the cash shop. Could be a tough one.

While on a business view i do agree with you in there, and most companies do fall on that side, i think ToS is different, because by not doing it, they still earn money from selling chars slots with TP, players will expend more time playing their game and consequently buying more CS stuff and tokens.[quote=“Zero_Sama, post:5, topic:232755”]
It’s not about easy or not. It’s about classes getting nerfed , or class descriptions not mentioning the actual effects of the skill.
[/quote]

You can’t simple add something that might break the game in an irreversible way just because the game is not completed and balanced yet, as i said on other topic, whoever don’t search about the game before buying or playing is dumb, never do that or your will regret.

I am playing this game since the first iCBT, found a load of bugs and some still persist on the actual version, i knew it from the start and i don’t have a thing to complain, i got a cleric stuck at 170 because i screwed its build, it is hard to play it? Yes, but not impossible.

So Until everything is fixed and all class advancements are announced we should have a possibility to class reset.

Do that and you will see hell. No class reset, let it be like it is, there is these very forums to ask for info about classes, tosbase skill simulator to try out builds, people can post here for advice and fix what is wrong on it.[quote=“Shadow_Rose, post:8, topic:232755”]
The problem with that is that the vast majority of gamers in the na and eu are at least a bit casual if not more and when they spend hundreds of hours in a game to find out they need to redo everything because a class reset doesn’t exist then they will quit.
[/quote]

There are lots of casual games out there, this can be played by casuals, but don’t expect things going like every single player will wait for the casuals to catch up just because of that.

Even you will stop playing if you spend several hundreds of hours playing just to end up with multiple very high level chars that cant do anything.

I wouldn’t, i expend some really long hours playing PoE, and that is a game that if you don’t know where you are going on the passive tree you will regret later, never done anything that bad, only lack of gear to complement the build. Same with ToS.

If you want RPG, buy some dices and go somewhere else

As the OP said, if you want it easy, go play CCS.

I don’t understand that mentality ‘I don’t have 10 h/day’, you can achieve the same thing 2h/day in 5 days, is there some kind of race, or time limit, that requires you to reach high level as fast as you can?

Or does playing the game bother you too much and you just want to get it over with?

I want to know that too, if one don’t have time to play a game like this, simple games are better, one don’t need to rush and can play whenever one want lol.

Another thing : Summons. I read the forums many times to see if summons are still bugged and some topics said they are bugged and other topics said they are fine.

Summons aren’t bugged, i do agree that the summon leash is short compared to the summon servant and i think it should be switched, but they work fine as they are.

Edit:
Just an addition about summons that i forgot, the AI need rework, you basically can’t call that an AI.

Now that I picked Hunter, I found out that my companion does really wierd things most of the time but I don’t want to reroll because I already did twice.

A friend picked hunter too, her companion get stuck in the most stupid places and sometimes don’t obey the skills, but still, she can play well with her char without rerolling.

That’s the exact same line everyone says about every feature they want implemented, and it’s basically never true. It is used constantly when people complain about bots, despite the fact they are in every MMO that’s existed for the past 15 years.

+1

That’s how games work these days. You have to be hand-held and rushed to max level so you can complain about the lack of endgame content.

That is how the “smart” (/sarcasm end) try to play a game. (I could go with a more heavy sarcasm but let is be like that and no, i am not being sarcastic to you Vanic, i am just pointing out the others lol).

Most people don’t read the forums or even look here.

And buy the game in the current state to start cry about bug in this, bot in that, not fun in there.

Tos wont survive if it doesn’t at least give the majority some way to make it so most of their time wasn’t wasted in the long run.

I didn’t know the majority was 50 people, so far as i keep track on the forums, only saw around 4 to 5 threads about job reset since the announcement of the first iCBT.

■■■■ i hate when i do this many quotes. Well mostly is the main points of what happen on the forums, people complain and cry about the most silly stuff.

[Vanic]

Only cause i have seen many games fail before the end of a year simply because they made their game to hard.

Really? I’ve played roughly 100 MMOs over the past 15 or so years and I’ve literally never seen one fail for being ‘too hard’. Being hard has been a gimmick for a LOT of MMOs that has drawn a lot of people in, in fact.

A PRIME example of this is Path of Exile, which was fairly hard on release, and they kept trying to make it harder because people wanted it as such. Other games such as Shaiya, Final Fantasy XI, and Everquest have been around for quite a long time with loyal fans due to how hard it is.

I will admit that better descriptions would be good though but i dont think the dev will get to it anytime soon.

This game was largely localized by fans, actually. That’s why we got the release so quickly.

[Ultramann]

This contradicts itself.

If a person doesn’t care enough to check forums about a game he is playing, and do some research about how everything works, he clearly isn’t dedicated enough to care that he will be 10% worse than other classes, so what’s the problem here?

I somehow managed to avoid any major mistake just by reading reddit and this forum, if someone put even less effort than me, means this person doesn’t really care about being competitive in the first place.

And making bad class synergy doesn’t really do any major damage to the gameplay, you can still finish entire content without effort, and if you want to be the best and op then you should have do your research. Game should be about winning and losing, not only winning.

[Vanic]

My only regret in life is that I can only upvote this once. That, and that time I trusted gas station nachos…

Basically people are going with this logic: I didn’t put the effort into making the perfect build and now my build is a little bit worse than someone else’s? This clearly isn’t my fault! Give me resets now IMC or this game will die!

[Shadow_Rose]

Personally im in the i don’t really mind redoing 1000 hours of chars if i like the game but im just looking at the future here.

Most people are not nearly as patient.

[Zero_Sama]

I don’t understand why you associate Hard with 100 hours of Brainless Grinding ???
Casual Gamers can play Hard games.
For me a Hard/Complexe Game is not a game where you have to grind 10000 hours, it’s a game where each step must be taken with caution and with deep thinking. It’s a game where lot of skill and strategy is involved.

So don’t go saying If u want it easy go play Dice. I want it complexe.
I like Tree Of Savior and it is the game I wanna play (played 100 MMOs as well and been waiting for a game like this for so long) as it is right now but I want it to succeed.

There is a post about a type of restricted circle reset that everyone seems to agree on and I do as well.

[Vanic]

Casual Gamers can play Hard games.

They absolutely can. They can’t, however, cry when ‘hardcore’ players outperform then though. Well, they can, and do, but they shouldn’t. If you want to be a casual player, that is WONDERFUL. I suggest you be casual. Enjoy yourself. Don’t cry because others are doing better than you then.

it’s a game where each step must be taken with caution and with deep thinking.

Except when it comes to class choices, right? Then it’s just pick whatever you want then reset it because you messed up. Nice double standard.

There is a post about a type of restricted circle reset that everyone seems to agree on

No. Not everyone agreed on it, not even close. There were tons of people who still didn’t agree with it, myself included. Don’t make up things.

[Zero_Sama]

They absolutely can. They can’t, however, cry when ‘hardcore’ players outperform then though. Well, they can, and do, but they shouldn’t. If you want to be a casual player, that is WONDERFUL. I suggest you be casual. Enjoy yourself. Don’t cry because others are doing better than you then.

I’m not talking for myself Btw. I like my build and will stick with it even if my Hunter C1 pick is not working as intended. The issue here is that the only way to test the classs yourself is by choosing it. and when you choose it and test it there is no way to change your decision.
Also I don’t think anyone is better lol, I don’t compare myself to others. If i wanted a build that others find OP and that is currently OP, I would just go the classic Wiz3 Ele3 Wk 1 or The Plague doctor Build.

Except when it comes to class choices, right? Then it’s just pick whatever you want then reset it because you messed up. Nice double standard.

As I said before, the class choice can look good in paper but once you pick it you find that the experience is fked up.

No. Not everyone agreed on it, not even close. There were tons of people who still didn’t agree with it, myself included. Don’t make up things.

I correct myself: most of the people (even some people who disagree with the global class reset) seem to agree for that specific type of class reset. I didn’t want to say everyone.

Final Point, Even I don’t want a full class reset because I don’t want to see everyone having the same OP OP class for PvP and the same OP OP class for PvE. But What I Want is the possibility to have a soft class reset scroll for when everything is working fine and semi-balanced.
.

[GlobeInternetSucks]

or class descriptions not mentioning the actual effects of the skill.

True. i was fooled and i took c1 paladin for my 6th class and i when i was playing it already i already knew i ■■■■■■ up.

[Shadow_Rose]

Final Point, Even I don’t want a full class reset because I don’t want to see everyone having the same OP OP class for PvP and the same OP OP class for PvE. But What I Want is the possibility to have a soft class reset scroll for when everything is working fine and semi-balanced.

I agree with that one.

I think that would be a good middle of the road solution.

There are just way to many bugs, bad descriptions and just plain easy mistakes with the way they are now.

[Nirimetus]

The issue here is that the only way to test the classs yourself is by choosing it. and when you choose it and test it there is no way to change your decision.

That is what make this game an RPG, made decisions will be definite and you have to deal with it, you have the forums, reddit, steam discussions to know what is what on the game.

As I said before, the class choice can look good in paper but once you pick it you find that the experience is fked up.

See above again.

I correct myself: most of the people (even some people who disagree with the global class reset) seem to agree for that specific type of class reset. I didn’t want to say everyone.

I probably saw and ignore that thread because of the silliness of it, so you can guess that i won’t agree with any kind of class reset except the actual skill reset since it was already planned.

Final Point, Even I don’t want a full class reset because I don’t want to see everyone having the same OP OP class for PvP and the same OP OP class for PvE.

You got the main point of it all finally.

For me a Hard/Complexe Game is not a game where you have to grind 10000 hours

Btw you are contradicting yourself, EVE Online is a very complex game and it take years to reach where you want since the training is in Real Time.
PoE take some hours to reach Lv 70 (max is 100) if you go full hardcore gaming, but it take a few days playing normally and the passive tree is scary that if you mess you have to reroll another char or pray that you have enough reset points to fix the mess.

So you can’t have complex and fast at the same time, unless is some puzzle game like Portal or Talos Principle.

[marcello]

be rdy for a class reset soon because casuals are crying about it and in a p2w game like this everything is possible

[Zero_Sama]

That is what make this game an RPG, made decisions will be definite and you have to deal with it, you have the forums, reddit, steam discussions to know what is what on the game.

I agree only if the RPG is working as intended. I mean even dark souls skills and weapon descriptions are complete. They describe everything even though it’s a hard game with no leads.

Btw you are contradicting yourself, EVE Online is a very complex game and it take years to reach where you want since the training is in Real Time.PoE take some hours to reach Lv 70 (max is 100) if you go full hardcore gaming, but it take a few days playing normally and the passive tree is scary that if you mess you have to reroll another char or pray that you have enough reset points to fix the mess.

What i meant is that the grind 1000 hours part doesn’t make a game complexe but it is its gameplay mechanics and content that do.
As you mentioned, PoE has a massive passive/active skill tree which justifies the complexity of the game.
I haven’t played EvE but I’m sure it’s not the time consuming part that makes it complexe.
I’m saying this because people think that rerolling is hard and people who can’t reroll ( grind 100+ hours again) should play candy crush. Rerolling is not hard, It is just a time consuming robotic task you have to do if you want to make another character.

[Nyyppa]

Rerolling is not hard, It is just a time consuming robotic task you have to do if you want to make another character.

You seem to mention this multiple times. You’re playing a Korean mmorpg, what were you expecting to await you? It’s common knowledge that they contain lots of grinding, always. And that’s what many are actually looking forward to. You can be sure getting to those 500 or 600 levels won’t be a breeze when they will rise the level cap eventually.

[Nirimetus]

I agree only if the RPG is working as intended. I mean even dark souls skills and weapon descriptions are complete. They describe everything even though it’s a hard game with no leads.

Indeed as i said, not sure if this thread or other about this very subject, the skills descriptions are missing on ToS and i do hope they at least fix that in the future.

What i meant is that the grind 1000 hours part doesn’t make a game complexe but it is its gameplay mechanics and content that do.

Unfortunately ToS still far from completion, lack lots of content to be able to satisfy who don’t like to grind, most quests are bland (kill X monsters, pick X stuff) but there are some fun quests (Steele Road kick the trunk in the fire, the first forest area in Orsha side where you have to follow the dog and other quests alike).

I haven’t played EvE but I’m sure it’s not the time consuming part that makes it complexe.

Its more like the decision on which path you will take, the deeper you get in, the longer it takes to learn new stuff, and if you regret, too bad, was a lost time on that path, you can do all the paths on a single char, but if i am not mistaken, it would take around 25 years (IRL) to get all the skills.

Rerolling is not hard, It is just a time consuming robotic task you have to do if you want to make another character.

Yeah, as i said, the game still lack content, but it is a given since it is not complete yet and there are major issues to fix, imagine when F2P hit and people can’t log in because the server crashed due to the flow of logins? lol

[Zero_Sama]

Yeah, as i said, the game still lack content, but it is a given since it is not complete yet and there are major issues to fix, imagine when F2P hit and people can’t log in because the server crashed due to the flow of logins? lol

This will happen for sure even doe they should learn from the previous mistake of not preparing the servers for a flood of people.
But this must be separate from the gameplay issues since there should be a team dedicated to gameplay bugs and another one to network & system issues.

[raikouski]

Please stop making five threads about this there’s already two with 500+ posts

[Satoru]

While the pro-reset makes a refined topic with dozens of valid arguments taking down all “problems” a reset would bring, the anti-reset just come whining with the same beaten up “problems” again because yes.

[Stride]

The topic starter is right. Skill and stat reset is fine (I understand that you want to earn some money), but class reset will ruin 99% of the game.

[Zipzo]

eally? I’ve played roughly 100 MMOs over the past 15 or so years and I’ve literally never seen one fail for being ‘too hard’. Being hard has been a gimmick for a LOT of MMOs that has drawn a lot of people in, in fact.

Um, were you in a god damned coma when Wildstar, a triple AAA hype-meter wow-killer game that basically ran its whole marketing compaign on going back to the hardcore days and reversing all the casual-friendly changes, flopped harder than a pissed off cook at McDonald’s?

Wildstar is literally the fuckin’ poster child now for any game that thinks they can get away with alienating the casual player-base, protip + spoilers: it isn’t/wasn’t a good idea.