Tree of Savior Forum

My Issues with Wizards

Class and Rank Wizard
#1

Rank 1 is just Wizard. There’s a lack of spell options in the early game, which would be ok if the spells were nay good, and even worse when you go Wizard 2 since you get nothing new. Energy Bolt is incredibly lackluster, it does not grow well with levels and even has a cooldown where I feel that It shouldn’t just so that a Mage would never have to auto attack with its terrible speed/animation. Earthquake is slow and scatters enemies which is really annoying for the most part and is no way an effective spell. The rest are just support options, so Wizard 1 is really clunky.

Rank 2 offers Pyro and Cryo, Pyro is stuck with a Fireball that gets knocked around too easily in groups and its number of hits scales with level, which might make you want to stick with Pyro just so it can be useful. Its burning attribute adds 8 seconds, which is more than half its cooldown, just in an attempt to make Flare usable, which it still isn’t, making Flare a useless spell to have. Flaming Ground is far too small of an AOE and doesn’t affect flying targets, but it still lasts long enough where the damage is good for a while, but I still don’t see why it only ticks once per second when most other forms of Damage Over Time tick every half second.

Cryo is the support path, but leveling alone, Freezing an enemies doesn’t do much when you don’t have anything to follow it up with. The Frost Bomb is about as useless as Flare, but not so much (you can easily tell when an Enemy is frozen vs and enemy is Burning with Fireball/Flame Ground doing its thing), but the Animation for it is slow and if the unfreeze before you’re done snapping your fat fingers, its over.

Wizard 2 leaves you stuck with Energy Bolt and Earthquake, neither spell that really needs Surecast, especially since Energy Bolt and Earthquake don’t scale well, you can leave them at 1.

Rank 3 brings up Wizard 3, which finally grants you a new spell here, and what anyone would bother going Wizard 3 for: Quick Cast, and mainly for its 50% increased Magic Damage. Considering how there’s a lack of scaling options in this game, it kinda feels like if you want to do meaningful damage as a mage (as INT scaling is poor, and Spell Scaling is poor), you’ll want to have this buff up to do meaningful damage in any future DPS class you choose. This means going Pyro or Kino early (Cryo/Kino excluded since this is an OP interaction and should be nerfed and you all know it) means that you’ll probably hate yourself in the late game when you feel that Wizard C3 will be necessary for that scaling damage buff.

Speaking of Scaling, why does Heal, Cure, and Zaibas, all Cleric Skills, get double scaling from INT because its in their calculations, but none of the Wizard Spells do? Just sorta seems that Cleric/Krivis make better nukers than Wizards do in the early game.

In any case, My issues with Psychokino is the fact that their Mind Crush has such a short range. I like the idea of it, but it doesn’t reach far, especially considering the amount of targets it can affect, and is hardly usable until Circle 2 where you get its stun attribute.

There’s nothing wrong with Linkers, and while I think it’d be nice to have an Overcharge of 2 because of its higher cooldown now, I can live with it.

As a note, Earthquake, Fireball, Psychic Pressure and to an extent Burning Ground are all rather close range moves, which is pretty dangerous for a “Wizard” type class. They really shouldn’t be so close, especially when getting Interrupted is such a real thing for them (unless you feel forced to go Circle 2 Wizard).

tl;dr (even though its stll too long)

  1. Lack of useful Spell options early game. Energy Bolt is weak and has cooldowns, Earthquake is slow and annoyingly knocks enemies away, Fireball is short range and doesn’t scale well unless you stick with Pyromancer all the way through, Cryo is weak overall unless you’re with a group in your early levels.

  2. Cleric-based Spells scale better than Wizard-based ones since Heal, Cure, and Zaibas all have additional INT scaling (meaning they get twice the effect of INT than other classes)

  3. Because of such few scaling options in the game, if you plan to be a DPS Wizard in any capacity, you need Wizard Circle 3 for Quick Cast’s Attribute. You may think not in the early game, but 300+ levels down the line and you’re using all your Warlock, Featherfoot, etc class skills, you’ll stop and think “i’m not using my lesser class skills much anymore, I could really use that 50% damage boost to these skills I actually use now” and regret not taking Wizard Circle 3.

  4. A Wizard shouldn’t be forced to use Normal Attacks. I feel their cooldowns are too high on many skills in the early game. Energy Bolt shouldn’t have any cooldown at all. Because autoattacks are ineffective, there’s usually more waiting involved.

  5. To add, a Spell’s worth seems to be dependent more on its number of hits than anything else. If it doesn’t hit multiple times, its ability to DPS will be particularly low down the line, but then again, that goes for most skills in this game.

There’s probably more issues I have but this opening post is already huge enough as it is.

2 Likes
#2

I gave up during wizard c2 trying to level with level 10 energy bolt and level 1 earthquake was hurting me

#3

I got to wizard c3 by using autoattack only, all points went to non-offensive spells. That was hard and I’d never have done it if I didn’t use xp cards. I’m Linker c2 now and it is mostly worthless, probably should have got chrono instead :frowning:

#4

Solution: Give every class Oblique Shot lel

1 Like
#5

Cryomancer is great. Cryo C1 can be used in many builds for freeze CC and Cryo C3 is amazing in groups and not that bad for solo leveling as long cooldowns on Snow Rolling and Frost Pillar aside. Cryo C2 however is a pain to level through and has nothing of worth. Cryo wont have the damage that other classes do but that doesn’t matter since its CC with is excellent. The thing with Cryo is that Frost Bomb and Gust are not worth taking. Ice Pike is Cryomancers boss killing ability. And Ice wall is useful to delay mobs while stuff is on cool down.
Edit Also until its nerfed freeze in pvp is lol overpowered on any class without a dispel.
Edit 2 Grammar and typos
TLDR Cryo is great but Gust and Ice Bomb are a waste of skillpoints so if you took them lol.

#6

Yeah, I think Ice Blast deserves something special especially because it requires targets to be frozen. Maybe even just something like the Icewall shatter effect coming from each of the frozen targets would be cool.

#7

It was pretty easy for me o_o energy bolt 15 and earthquake 15, just reseted it and got pvp build, I am level 200+ atm

#8

Or giving it an AOE that matters. AOE size on a lot of skills is lackluster and should be increased across the board, with effects that graphically show this AOE. Its kinda hard to tell how large something like Psychic Pressure extends, I mean I know its small, but there should be something visually there for it.

In any case, there’s plenty that need to be changed for all classes, such as damage scaling on skills, same as for defenses and such. Wizards specifically, I’d like to see several things:

Wizard:

Energy Bolt should have no cooldown for what it does. Its a generic spell that does not scale and does nearly no damage. Its Sleep attribute requires Sleep of course, but bosses (and probably other boss-like enemies) cannot be slept. Since Spellcasters require multiple hits for spells to be effective, this needs to gain targets/AOE or scale incredibly with levels.

Earthquake is too slow and requires you to be very close. Its also a single hit spell, meaning it doesn’t scale compare to a skill that hits multiple times. It should at least be a targeted spell that you move along the ground and cast, but you should not be stuck in animation while it explodes. A real earthquake should hit multiple times, but then it might be too similar to Flame Ground.

Sleep and Lethargy should be combined into one skill. Enemies that fall asleep would be groggy when they wake up, makes sense. This would cause them to have their weakened attack/evasion since they’re stlil not fully awake after just waking up from Sleep. Combine these two skills together.

Surespell should not even be a skill. Set it up as an Attribute for Wizards C1. Considering Surespell can have over 100% uptime, I don’t see why this attribute can’t just be 100 Levels and be done with it.

Quick Cast should be Wizard C1. Quick Cast’s 50% Magic Attack is one of the few ways to scale offensive spells at the moment, as Spells do not Crit, and Wizard Spells do not have double INT scaling, like Cleric’s Heal, Cure, and Zaibas do. This leads many to feel that going Wizard C3 is mandatory for late game damage as your Warlock, Featherfoot or other high damage offensive Wizard class will be weaker to those who took Wizard C3. If not this, then the “50% Magic Attack” bonus needs to be moved elsewhere into Wizard C1.

Wizard itself needs a new offensive Spell at Wizard C2 as Energy Bolt and Earthquake are painful to use until 40.

Pyromancers

Fireball is a Spell that also requires you to be fairly close to set, or you need to use a Staff and go the extra step of swatting it away which sometimes goes too far. Its Burning Attribute raises the cooldown by over 50%, making it deal less damage compared to just leaving Fireball at its original cooldown without the Burn. There’s also the fact that ANYONE can knock it around, making it annoying to use in groups.

Flare is completely useless. It is hard to tell when something is actually burning if you do choose to use Fireball’s bonus because Fireball and Flame Ground both make the enemy glow and all the damage numbers don’t really make it clear its on “fire” for Flare. Its damage for its requirements is also quite low. Not only that, but the animation is slow, meaning if an enemy is no longer burning by the time it takes that second for you to snap your fingers, the skill is wasted. If this skll has an AOE, its hard to tell as well. Its supposed to cause an explosion, it should be large and noticeable.

Burning Ground’s AOE is too small. Again, Mages should be further away from enemies, and its small AOE requires you to run around a tiny circle within arm’s reach of enemies in order for it to be effective. Burning Ground, unlike most other forms of Damage over Time, only ticks once a second rather than once every half second, making it seem weaker than other similar skills.

Enchant Fire needs to scale (though ALL BUFFS should scale in some way to your stats. Enchant FIre also needs a larger AOE. Why does Blessing and Sacrament hit the screen while Enchant Fire literally needs to be on top of someone to get them?

Staff Attribute for Fire Damage needs to scale. NINE Fire Attribute Damage is nothing, who made up this number? Give it a Percentage, such as 10% of your Magic Attack is added as Fire Attribute Damage.

Cryomancer

Ice Bolt should have no cooldown similar to Energy Bolt since both only hit once (or twice visually, I don’t get how it works sometimes). Freeze itself probably needs to have diminishing returns on the same target over time as most games tend to do with Crowd Control skills. Fireball hits multiple times and lasts a while, so I could see a cooldown for that, but Ice Bolt there’s no reason for it.

Frost Bomb has the same issues with Flare, except for the fact that its easier to see when an enemy is frozen compared to an enemy being burned. Same issues apply though, weak single hit damage, small to no AOE, and slow casting animation makes it useless in many situations.

Gust needs to be redesigned. There’s no reason for it to deal more damage to Frozen enemies, then Unfreeze them. That’s what Frost Bomb is for.

Cold Attribute for using Wands also needs to scale off of Magic Attack so that its useful.

Ice Wall’s Ice Shard damage needs a nerf.

Psychokino

Psychic Pressure’s AOE is too small. It also needs an indicator to its AOE size while its in use to make it easier to see where you’re hitting at. It has the ability to hit many targets, but only if they’re right in near Melee Range, meaning you just get knocked out of it easily until you can stun them at C2. Even then, you aren’t likely going to get that many enemies with the way spawns are sometimes and its AOE.

That’s a lot of stuff, I just ramble on too much. I like this game so I guess I have a lot to say, I just wish things didn’t feel so untested and mechanics poorly decided on. There’s a reason why there’s no linear scaling in games. Its harder to balance as the game goes on.

1 Like
#9

cleric and krivis are nukers, esspecially for the fact that they are support xD. but as a cleric u can only auto attack flying enemies, but cure znd heal are boss killers and so is zaibas.
im a cleric so i dont know much about wizard
pyro fireball - i feel ur pain cuz i have dievdirby and that hapens with owl all the time Q_Q]
only class i feel that is underhwlming is swordsman, i out dmg them all the time
and about earthquake i can see y it knocks back enemies, im sadhu so we have astral which knocks back enemies, it does it so thay wont be so close to you, i use it when monsers are close to e to knock them back, so i can stay safe. thats how i think earthquake should be used and if we dont go cleric c2 we will regret it later game. as i see it auto attacking as a wizard must be a pain, i started a wiz toon just to see wut it was all about i planned to delete it , i noticed how bad the auto attack was xD. but u guys have energy bolt i guess lol. there are so many wizard rant threads.

#10

You try using Energy Bolt, you’ll see how bad it is. Getting to 40 is a pain to finally be able to have a useful spell in Magic Missile, which honestly should be a Circle 2 Spell.

If Earthquake’s only use is to knock enemies back, then there’s no reason to use it past Level 1. Give players a reason to use it or level it up past something so little. This is a class you’re forced into. I feel they should have the most utility that scales with them.

1 Like
#11

is energy bolt really that bad? and youre forced to use it until c3?

#12

It’s easy to level through Wiz C2. You have so much cards that you can just spam through Wiz C2, so the time you spend in Wiz C2 is actually minimal.

The only class that falls off late game in Wizard class is probably just pyro though. But considering the buff on Pyro 3 recently in ktos, if that came to itos, we can safely said that every rank of Wizard is useful.

Also, I didn’t really use much auto attack on my way to Wiz 3 Ele 3. I’m pretty sure those that used too much AA is not using their spell efficiently. You should gather mobs on your CD, then use your spell to clear bunch of it, then gather mobs on CD again.

It’s really easy. You can get to C3 by just start spamming card around level 20+ once you have enough card to reach level 46.

Lethargy+Earthquake level 1 pretty much demolish everything before level 30.

1 Like
#13

No you can’t, I’ve leveled enough characters to know that much, including a Wizard.

The only reason to hold onto cards is if you find yourself underleveled or when hitting a deadzone. You do not have either of those issues in the lower levels, so you’ll have to collect just as many cards as any other class, though most any other class can kill much more effectively, so they will actually have MORE monster kills and therefore less need for cards than you, so you’ll be reliant on doing a ton of extra quests out in other areas to push it.

Not sure why you bring up Lethargy, since it doesn’t help you in the slightest for damage, and extra damage with “Strike” attacks means nothing. Earthquake shouldn’t be a “Strike” attack in any fashion as its a Spell.

#14

Lethargy + Earthquake deal double damage (double attack). It’s a hidden mechanic.

Another great combo is Sleep + Energy Bolt.

The main thing of saving cards are so that you can gain exp while doing quest. By the time you finish all the quest up to before Tenet field and Orsha equivalent, you can spam card to Wiz 3, and continue every quest easily afterwards. That’s the trick to get through Wiz 2 easily as the game only starts to get harder for Wiz 2 at Tenet field of Orsha equivalent map.

#15

@darkwolf7786 I have to agree on many points you’ve stated. Energy bolt shouldn’t have a cool down considering the amount of damage it does, and it’s a filler skill to wait for our other skills to cool down. Sleep and lethargy make sense to combine together and it would save on some skill points; make it work similar to deprotected zone so that multiple enemies can be affected - GIVE US WIZZIES SOME WAY TO DO MORE DAMAGE PLS! I think earthquake should be more of a rippling damage to push an enemy back instead of throw them upwards because real earthquakes don’t toss things up into the sky, and it would still buy us time like we’re already using it for. Surespell and Quick Cast would be much appreciated as for Wizard attributes because a wizard should be a damage dealer.

I’ve been soloing as Cryo2, up to L70 now. And it’s been tough. I have INT:SPR ratio of 2:1 because I’m afraid that if I put anything into CON, I’ll never be able to kill anything.
I find myself and probably with other wizzies as well, jumping around and firing our normal attacks just to wait for cool down to finish. I leveled mostly by mobbing monsters and hoping that I can wipe them out with 2 ice pike casts because that’s all I have for real damage. I’d like to see ice pike with a slightly wider AOE effect because it’ll save on having to become a linker just to bunch the enemies up on a single cell to kill. I use my ice wall as a secondary ice pike when I’m all out on cast and want some damage in.
I was really tempted to put some points into gust because I wanted another spell to use while I wait on cool down, but after researching builds, most players said that it wasn’t worth it.

I’m grinding to cryo 3 so I can get the snow ball rolling for better mob damage.
Planning to do Chronomancer mostly for the cool down spells though…might make my life easier down the road?

I’m envious of the krivis class that can learn lightning spells, I don’t want to become an elementalist for Electrocute spell just to pair up with the frozen abilities. It feels like a waste of a rank when all I want is one spell. Maybe there should be an attribute to learn a lightning spell from the elemental master? Coming from RO, storm gust and lord of vermillion was a very great combo and it doesn’t feel fair to give a class the ability to freeze and not do anything afterwards except freeze it some more.

My major complaint is: I’m a wizzie, I shouldn’t be worried about not being to cast my spells as long as I have sp to burn.

1 Like
#16

Energy Bolt need a cooldown, you will know why if you are playing a Wiz 3 Ele 3.

It’s a great damage source with minimal CD.

#17

Cryo/Chrono is kinda a support build, so you should be with others to be honest. Pass isn’t until Chronomancer 3, which is a long way away and using those few spells you have all the way to Rank 7 as a solo might be tough.

#18

In what way is it a “great damage source” again?

If you’re still auto attacking as a Wiz 3/Ele 3, then something’s wrong. If you’re unloading your spells to the point where you have to use Energy Bolt SIX times before your other spells come off cooldown, then there’s something wrong.

#19

I agree with everything listed. I also think Magic Missile should be moved to cricle 2 Wiz and int scaling should be added to energy bolt

#20

What, you don’t always spam your big spell against a lone monster. When you run out of Magic Missle charges, EB is an easy way to kill a monster with 6k hp quickly.

A 3x normal atk spell with almost instant cast time is really nice at late game.