Tree of Savior Forum

My feels about TP compensation in an ugly comic

General Discussion
#101

Seeing that this thread is still going on, i will try to give again my point of view about this compensation and what’s wrong about it. Note that i didn’t read all those walls of text above.

In the end, most of the debating about this issue is pointless, because people are arguing for the wrong reasons. Do people who bought token with silver deserve a compensation? Yes, i think so. Do they deserve to get a TP compensation? No, not really.

That’s what the problem with this compensation is (as i said in some other thread but was ignored), people are getting compensated with TP they never had in the first place. Because people didn’t buy 198 TP to buy a Token, they bought a token off the market: so they should be compensated with a token (like an extension of the one they have). While people who spent TP to get a token and still have it should be compensated with TP.

In the end it’s mostly IMC fault, because they decided on a lazy way to compensate people, thus causing the “convert silver into TP” problem.

That’s all i have to say about this matter and i believe the other people arguing about this are just wasting their time, because IMC won’t prolly change anything.

4 Likes
#102

Yes, we keep on going in circles because you can’t let go of the assumption that I am complaining because I think I deserve it. When clearly, I never even suggested that. I am in fact, a free player; and will be getting the TP compensation when the time comes because I own a token or two; because like you, (most likely) I planned carefully how to approach this game as we plan to invest a lot of time into it.

You are aware yourself that there is a transaction that happens between the player and IMC when one buys TP. So when they buy the token with the TP, on record, it is them who used the TP; and therefore should be the one to receive said TP-refund. What happens to the token afterwards, is irrelevant. Is that fair? It is not. But that’s how this game’s cash shop is built. Somehow, this is how this game is built… seriously, in 2016…

If(/when) they push through with their TP compensation, it’s fine with me obviously. I get myself some TP. But this proves, in a way, that the problem with IMC is beyond server issues. And that’s alarming.

2 Likes
#103

So refreshing to be able to read this. Thank you.

#104

My thoughts exactly.

1 Like
#105

I still dont understand why some like you feel the need to crusade against others.

It has every relevance to the topic at hand.

If you want to make it into some kind of crusade of free players against paying players, then you are making it into something it is not.

Blind zeal doesnt help anyone, especially since the people you guys are arguing against likely spend less money on the game then you did…

There are less and less players each day. Bad decisions like the way they are handling the compensation doesnt help.

You know what I would do if I was actually playing the game?
I would farm silver and buy 20 tokens, get myself 1980 TP without spending a dime or penny. Or 3960 TP actually, since I would make use of the TP on two servers.

And this is why I’ve said ‘‘stupidity’’ more then once already.

How hard can it be to read ‘‘I have not bought a single token with TP -or- silver’’. Apparently, incredibly hard, since you’ve missed it yet again.

Why would I want to be compensated for something I don’t deserve? I’m not like you.

Even if I intentionally make my replies stupid, to match yours, I don’t think I can downplay to your level.

But who is the bigger fool in the end? That would be me, for trying to reason with a fool.

#106

Time to sell a token for 2mil and get filthy rich over other people’s hard work.
Gotta be balling.

Btw, I know you have a good reason to be feeling fooled and such…
But you do realize that when people farm to get money to buy a Token, they are investing their life time while you payed with your work money, which also subtracts from your life time (But the pay is obviously better)… I mean…

This is a Time vs Money scenario. Don’t feel bad about it. You got what you wanted without having to spend a lot of time in-game. :slight_smile: And you enjoy it don’t you? That’s what matters…

But I do feel that people will abuse this. I mean… It has a “PLEASE ABUSE ME” written on it.

I’ll contradict myself now, cause I just realized how badly people are gonna be able to abuse this. Specially filthy rich bots.

Damn.

If they get 99TP for each 30 Days Token they have… RIP.

#107

How is what you do with the token irrelevant when IMC intend to compensate those with token? That is the most relevant part there can ever be. You’re once again just cherry picking things that suited your argument and ignoring every point that i’ve made in the past 3 posts.

I am complaining because I think I deserve it. When clearly, I never even suggested that. I am in fact, a free player; and will be getting the TP compensation when the time comes because I own a token or two; because like you, (most likely) I planned carefully how to approach this game as we plan to invest a lot of time into it.

When i say “you”, i meant the token buyer. not “You” in particular. I never once assumed you’re complaining because you bought token using TP. Nonetheless, it doesn’t change the fact that your argument holds no water.

Those who sold their token for silver do not deserve any compensation. At all. Reasons for this have been stated countless time, you just refuse to hear it and keep looping your argument in circles, keep trying to pin the blame on the game and IMC when in fact their compensation makes perfect sense.

The only way you’re getting compensated over those who paid silver is if you refund half or even 2/3 of whatever silver the buyers paid you before the announcement.

Lemme quote the other guy whose post seemed reasonable, except he too was missing one crucial point:

they bought a token off the market: so they should be compensated with a token (like an extension of the one they have).

This is illogical. Firstly, there’s no guarantee that you’ll recover half the cost by selling the compensated token for silver again. As demonstrated on SEA- V, token price dropped 1/3 today. If the people who bought it with silver gets another token, they’re only gonna recover 2/3, at most.

Second, giving them another token means the market price for token can plummet even further, since you’re injecting 1 extra token for every silver-bought token into the game. And if the token price drop even further, premium membership would be way too easy to obtain it’s going to hurt their business.

Since IMC can’t exactly refund players silvers, giving all token owners 99 TP which they can use to either buy another token (not preferred) or things that are untradable (preferred), is the best solution.

1 Like
#108

That’s exactly how its working. And thats also exactly why the compensation makes even less sense.

Want TP? Buy it with silver.

I agree with that. But following that logic there should be no compensation what-so-ever. It makes no sense to compensate a party that isnt affected in the slightest.

1 Like
#109

You know what else is irrelevent to the topic at hand? You.

You literally sidestepped all the stupid ■■■■ you said like how “token price is not dictacted by the real life monetary cost, but purely the demand, and it’s supply” and the dumb analogies you came up with that makes virtually zero sense, and you’re not even playing the game.

Also, i don’t have a crusade against anything or anyone besides those who fail to comprehend simple logic on every front and yet continue to spout nonsense and talking as if they know better when they clearly don’t.

It’s mind boggling how so many people can give you perfectly good reason why things happened a certain way and you’re still going around in circle.

I agree with that. But following that logic there should be no
compensation what-so-ever. It makes no sense to compensate a party that
isnt affected in the slightest.

isnt affected in the slightest.

See? Already answered this plenty of times, but you’re cherrypicking argument that suited your agenda. This, and the fact that you’re not even playing the game, leads me to the conclusion that you actually have zero business in this thread and is extremely bored.

1 Like
#110

Oh my…
I am completely shocked that it just came to me after actually thinking about it.

They need to change this… They need to change this fast.
Holy ■■■■ that’s absurdly stupid!!

Someone please hold me. I’m scared.

@showatt0016

Shush your mouth boy.
You’re being rude for no reason what-so-ever.

#111

This is another one of your golden replies. Just dodging the questions and retorting with content that basically says nothing. Yeah, on top of all the stupid ■■■■ you’ve said already you’re really adding alot to this thread.

#112

I sidestepped only a part of the none-sense arguments. I’m weak to flamebait, unfortunately, or I would sidestep it all.

Try to actually respond to them, and argue against them. I think you will find they make a lot of sense when you use your mind better.

Pure logic only works in a system without variables. Anything else is a bit more…subjective. And per defination ‘‘wrong’’ (that includes my own logic, and yours)

Now that we have that out of the way:

Just because I things in a different way doesnt make you right and myself wrong. You cant justify your poor arguments and way of thinking by calling it ‘‘logic’’ (and therefor by defination ‘‘correct’’)

It’s mindboggling how can you use words like ‘‘logic’’ and use it with so poor arguments that make so little sense.

You have personal gain in this, you dont actually believe all of your arguments yourself right…? I hope so, for your sake.

Precisely because I stopped playing the game (for now? perhaps, the future will tell), is why I have business in this thread.

Poorly throught out decisions by IMC like the way they are handling the compensation doesnt inspire me to have faith in the games future, so that I may come back and enjoy the game again.

But I’ve said this before in this thread. How you can ignore this is beyond me.

Ah, I guess that explains why.

Well that is most certainly one argument I cannot refute.

#113

I sidestepped only a part of the none-sense arguments. I’m weak to flamebait, unfortunately, or I would sidestep it all.

Right, so you admit that your analogies are stupid and your comment like this one

“token price is not dictacted by the real life monetary cost, but purely the demand, and it’s supply”

makes no sense. Glad we got that out of the way.

Just because I things in a different way doesnt make you right and myself wrong.

If you think “token price is not dictated by real monetary cost” you are wrong, because it is. its basically the same as thinking “the sun comes out from the west” which is wrong. It has nothing to do with logic. It’s just you being misinformed, or have the misconception of something. AKA you’re wrong.

Poorly throught out decisions by IMC like the way they are handling the compensation doesnt inspire me to have faith in the games future, so that I may come back and enjoy the game again.

“Poorly thought out” according to you. Given your track record of poor analogies and illogical thinking I wouldn’t trust myself if i were you.

#114

If they don’t change this… Bots will be balling so hard with ∞ TP…
I can’t believe there are people actually supporting this.

#115

The damage done by Bots wont be lasting tho, as Token minimum prices reset every maintenance as far as I’m aware.

That’s something atleast.

#116

" If they don’t change this… Bots will be balling so hard with ∞ TP… I can’t believe there are people actually supporting this."

Except bot don’t gain anything from having TP aside from buying another token to sell for silver. This will happen regardless of players getting compensated in TP or tokens.

The only way around this is to not compensate anybody, which I honestly wouldn’t mind, but it wouldn’t be good for the community.

Shush your mouth boy.
You’re being rude for no reason what-so-ever.

Nope.

Try to actually respond to them, and argue against them. I think you
will find they make a lot of sense when you use your mind better.

Already did:

You and the car crash has no correlation to one another. You are not at all affected by the crash, whereas the people who paid for the tokens with silver took more time than they should have, farming those silver.

#117

Don’t be a fool now.
Do you really think they don’t log with different flags for people that bought the Token directly from the TP shop?

People that get TP as compensation should ONLY be the people that actually spent TP on said Token.

[Edit]

You even retracted your comment. I know… Don’t worry it’s no shame to admit you were wrong on this one.

#118

The irony is, that I don’t. But even so, I have to try hard to have less thought out arguments.
That’s pretty sad, if you ask me.

Poor analogy, your words.

I have already explained why this is the case. Token minimum price limit, and supply exceeding demand. In real life the first is called '‘price fixing’'
In addition to this, the value of the fictive currency ‘‘silver’’ has a greater affect on pricing them the RL currency does.

For the average RL cash spender, what matters foremost is what they get out of it (silver) rather then what they spend on it (RL cash).

Here’s a good analogy, try to learn from it:

That’s like taking a statement, ignoring all the arguments supplied with it; and saying the statement is wrong, because there are no arguments to support it.

#119

yes but the thing is… why does the TP spender deserve any (additional) compensation?
i mean if they still own their tokens, then obviously they qualify, same as any other token owner…

however, if they’ve already sold their tokens… then they’ve already received their compensation – as the price paid for the sale.
that was the “contract” implied in the sale of the token: basically, an arrangement to exchange “dollars” for “silver” at the going rate (198 TP for… whatever they can make a sale at on the marketplace). they spent their dollars, gave up their claim to the token, and received silver as their compensation.

that is because you don’t understand the situation as well as you think you do. granted, you appear to have a much better grasp on it than most, but still not a complete grasp.

examine it from the opposite perspective. (bear with me; i know the scenario is a stretch, but i need something that would mirror the “refunds”.)

you bought a token with silver. IMC decided that the price of tokens was unfairly CHEAP, and have announced they will double the price of tokens. anyone who now wants to activate one of their tokens must pay the extra TP cost.

now who should pay that cost? following the logic of your arguments so far, it would be “weird” to make the current owner of the token pay that. the person who originally bought the token is the one that should be paying the extra TP cost. they bought the token, it’s their money, so they should pay the extra.
and the new owner of the token bears no responsibility for it.

…which would be complete and utter BS.

the -only- logical person to hit up for the “extra costs” would be the owner of the token who is attempting to activate it. the person who bought and then sold the token no longer has any responsibility for the token, nor any other association with it.

so why, when TP is -refunded- do we suddenly shift everything around and think that the original buyer now deserves anything more for something he has disassociated himself with?

you missed tagging the quote in your post, and replied to the wrong person…

bots (assuming you mean farming bots for gold-sellers) are going to get approximately zero from this.
as i’ve explained repeatedly before…

buy token now, at badly inflated price: stuck with that token forever. (one trade only.)
wait for compensation, get 99 TP, buy a new token.
sell token for no-longer inflated price… lose a bunch of silver.

and it isn’t like there are a whole lot of tokens left to be shopped around. when we started f2p? there were dozens of pages of tokens for sale on Orsha… a few hours ago? 1.5 pages, prices of 800k to 1.5 million. will some people try to abuse this? sure, of course they will… but honestly, the people who will profit most from this are the ones that have been hoarding tokens from the start, literally for over a month before the announcement, back when they were cheap and plentiful.

#120

Is this even english?