And for skills that don’t do damage?
If you are free to suggest ideas, then I am free to criticizes it.
If you can’t defend/fix the flaws in your idea when pointed out then I question if you actually thought that idea through at all.
Why bother with pre-7 classes? Because you have to level through them anyway? Or maybe they have the skills you want? Or something that work well with your later class choices?
Cleric because 16 heal tiles > every other classes at healing.
Cryo for the ability to mass CC non-boss enemies.
Scout for Cloaking.
QS Running Shot.
Sapper to do that Circling + Punji.
Hoplite for Finestra that your Dragoon would benefit a lot from?
And the list goes on.
Others don’t see the underlying problem that everyone are forced to just focus on R7+ classes because they simply outplay the lower rank classes. This removes the freedom of building and creates a strict meta. The class system is close to being linear.
It’s better to set an example because explanation doesn’t really get through.
For example, the build I plan to go with is,
Archer > Ranger C3 > Archer C2 > SR > ???
For rank 7, I can choose between Archer C3 or Musketeer. I don’t like to play any other classes so I only have these 2 choices.
Obviously, Musketeer is the better choice as it provides a “whole new set of skills with very high multipliers and additional skill damage” compared to Archer C3 which would just barely improve the damage/buffs I already have.
Of course, this is not exclusive to Archers. There’s also classes like Plague Doctor which is SO good that for most cleric builds, they are forced to get it instead of increasing the ranks of their lower rank classes.
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I am not saying for you to stop criticizing, it was my reply to you telling me to stop. If you tell me to stop then i tell you to stop. And now you are telling me to not tell you to stop, after you did that to me. What gives man. Stop twisting words.
Yes both of us are free to tell what we want, ergo dont tell me to stop suggesting stuff.
Back to topic you are telling me that i should choose classes for 1 or 2 selected skills that i might use later on, instead of choosing a class for all the spells it have. Thats seriously narrow choice to make, especially considering weapon type limitations. In the end everybody will be the same of the few viable builds only.
Whats the point to make “builds” then? All archers be musketeers or cannoneers or die trying to compete with those? What if i want to play with bow actually, as a real archer? I dont want to use cannon nor musket. Does it mean i am doomed to be worse? Right now that is the case, and this should change.
Picking low ranks to fill in your build at higher rank because you couldnt pick them earlier should be worth it, but it isn’t, so if you pick one of the classes available at rank 3 then you are not going to pick the alternative class that was available at rank 3 anymore if you want both of them to be c3, because you will be ineffective dmg wise.
And yes people need to keep it up with dmg, otherwise their utility skills wont be worth the exchange they made for other rank class.
All people ask for is for dmg to have better scaling, to make ALL low level rank skills viable to use at meta of the game. Either that or a nerf to top rank classes. Why should these be so superb stronger then the previous ones, i dont understand that. Its against the idea of build diversity.
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Oh, so QC is better because it`s applied at the end of the Damage Formula, while Thauma’s buffs are applied at the begining? But raw boost like Thauma’s buffs should be better with skills with very high hit count and low damage, right? I’m hoping for more skills like that in future classes T_T or to make the low damage skills of early ranks more interesting…
People sometimes forget that even though the rank 7 classes have high base damage on their skills, u actually CANT play the game with them alone, cause of their high cds most of the time (e.g warlock).
I was actually thinking about making a wiz 3 - linker 3 - whatever character just to “build up” the later content of the game. But think about it, u gonna spend 200 levels just spamming magic missile (before u get it c3 i think u just energy bolt stuff and hope for the best), and then u get some pole of agony to use every 2 minutes WTF.
I really hope IMC gives us a direction whether cd’s are going to be reviewed or stay in the same “ascendent path”, cause they seem very random too me right now. If they are being “reduced”, then wiz c3 - linker 3 is really good cause u set up for the “powerful skills” incoming.
If not, just get some low cd DPS class like pyro(low cds)/elementalist(quite ok cds) cause u will need them to keep doing damage as a spell dependant class.
The fact is that the game is so “young” we haven’t reached half of level cap (if its 600) so i would say it’s near impossible to predict whats gonna happen anyway.
That’s only because all the skills of the rank 7 classes are available in one circle.
All of their skills being in 1 circle or not, if it promotes linear gameplay and barely any freedom on builds, it’s a bad design.
The thing is, what I want you to stop is rather specific.
See that ‘if’ in there? That means if it’s a suggestion that already took into account what it’ll affect, I might still point out flaws, but I won’t deny it.
If my previous posts haven’t been clear enough, your suggestions so far would just cause imbalance elsewhere, making its point of attempting to ‘balance’ things moot.
You can yes. Pretty sure a lot of Falconer took that class for Circling alone.
I think I’ve said it before, a build is considered from its whole, not just at specific point of it.
Fletcher, Magic Arrow is ridiculously strong.
Well, yes, since that’d require rank 8. (r1 r2 r3 C3 + r3 c2 would be the most you can go)
Which by design is NOT what the dev want.
I bet Pryo will get a fire spell synergy down the line, tbh. We got plenty for the ice and lightning just waiting on that fire.
what lightning? D;
Electrocute?
No ice rune… If you’re running double cooldown reduction and you’re casting it gemmed with DM it’s almost full uptime… Imagine something similar to that with Pryo. Actually I’m pretty sure it is full uptime. If you’re not including the recast.
Ice rune is 70sec duration when cast as rank 7 with gem and DM.
180 base CD - 20% and then -25 every 50. So 144 modified and then pass casts… Ok, so 6 sec CD cause you got to wait for the 3rd Pass cast. And that’s if Pass isn’t affected by Deiv statue. If it is 100% uptime.
But what about Ice Rune is Lightning “synergy”? Or am I missing something…
I assumed the common synergies were known about?
Thanks!
I forgot about Cryos Atr., but the JP one is completely new to me LOL
It’s a really strong mix… Did a duo with a Cryo/Link and a Krivis… That’s something that’ill scale right to 280. And still be badass.
Sorry but what I did was to counter your order with the same order. One does not simply tell people to stop without being told to stop telling them to stop. Thats all there was to it.
You didnt answer me. Yes i can what?
Let me rephrase it to you:
Is it OK for you that lower level rank spells will be meaningless and only 1 or 2 of their spells will remain used in meta? For me its not, and seeing from posts of other players around the forum they feel the same, ergo people ask to change this before the game launches since there’s still time for changes. I doubt designers would copy-paste the idea someone suggest anyway so all we need to do is ask for the change without bothering to be the creators of new system. Designers can handle this, they are smart enough, you should belive in them.
No its not. Not as strong as cannoneer and musketeer skills.
And do you think that build would be still viable at r8, when even more powerful class might be released then the r7 ranked ones? I seriously DOUBT that. Unless we get some changes made.
You can’t really tell that. Perhaps those damages are low FOR NOW, for beta sake. Perhaps they just want to avoid the power creep builds in low levels while not improving the skill system for beta, ie for now.
To me it would be good enough if once player hit higher rank if it could buy dmg uprading attributes to lower level ranks his/her build is made of. IT would make low-rank-only builds viable but propably more costly to keep up with the damage. Yet it wouldn’t be impossible.
I think you made a really good list of skills that don’t fall off.
My concern is with pardoner scrolls. Almost every single one of those cleric skills you listed can be pardoner’d. What’s the point of bringing a krivis if someone can just spam scrolls of daino, or having a priest leveling buddy if you can just buy sacrament scrolls.
I’ve even heard of people bringing barrier scrolls for it’s incredible usefulness which completely negates C3 paladin… really drives me crazy. I wish they would make it so only C1 spells can be scrolled. It wouldn’t solve all my issues with it, but it does at least solve some.
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You realize that currently all R7 class skills are condensed into rank 7 right?
When R8 is released, a subset of the skills will become R8. When R9 is released, a subset of the skills will become R9. Same thing that happened with R5 and R6.
Musketeer and cannoneer have rank 9 skills. Think about that for a sec.
It’s unfortunate that tree of savior is as incomplete as it is, but you really are in no position to suggest going back to the drawing board when you haven’t even seen the full picture yet.
I also think that higher ranks should give cool rewards. Neat skins, awesome skills. It’s a huge investment to get that high, you should be rewarded for it.
I must correct you here. Magic Arrow at Fletcher C3 has 25 hits, it does a hit with 100% multiplier each at .5s interval. Considering all hits lands, it has 2500% total multiplier. Not to mention, it only has 5s cooldown.
This correction doesn’t mean I support the idea that other lower classes still underperform though. I’m still all for an improvement on the class system.