Tree of Savior Forum

KToS General Thread v3.0 LOL

General Discussion
#2733

RNG isn’t bad in and of itself, but it’s bad when it’s the only form of progression, and when you put multiple layers of RNG progression on top of themselves. Now you need to RNG a weapon with good stats, RNG enhancement, and if you don’t have billions of silver it’s more economical to RNG transcend than to fully invest shards for the higher levels which take hundreds of shards but at least with transcendence they give you the option to gamble as much as you want or to just go for the more expensive sure-thing. Why can’t a system like that exist for everything? Oh, right, because it does exist, except only in a cash shop item.

Like, you just pointed out the problem yourself. Gearing is the only end game content. What are you gearing for? There is no challenge in the game at all. PVP is a joke and the ■■■■■■ up gear system makes it MORE of a joke. Instead of adding more content, they add more RNG and more gear treadmills.

3 Likes
#2734

I dont like the Idea.
Whats the point on the whole game for a pvp player then?

Theres to much rng involved sure.

Trans just make the gap to big and stupid full con builds.

#2735

Good RNG adds variety to the game and spices up your gaming experience.
But RNG in ToS just forces players to either do boring chores or pay (buy TP or RMT).

Not only gear-related grind in ToS is pretty much useless (no content to use that gear on) but you also have to cross several layers of RNG which can instantly invalidate all your previous grinding efforts.

They should make people grind for cosmetics instead (and other casual rewards like toys, titles, etc). Or combine gear-grinding with cosmetic-grinding like they kind of tried to do with the new Belcoper raid (costumes). Although, I understand people who grind weapons for cosmetic purposes since weapons have actual visuals unlike armour and jewellery.

1 Like
#2736

This. The grind isn’t dice rolls for interesting gear or fun mechanics.

Has no one here played a game where you dice roll your starting stats? This is what TOS is. You just keep hitting that “reroll” button and never really play the game, because you’ll never get the perfect roll.

Except of course instead of just a button to reroll, in TOS you have to go through daily / weekly / monthly grinds that take hours of your daily life only to end up with bad rolls and having to repeat it again for good luck.

I’m just saying that all that time could be spent playing games that are rewarding and fun. Games that are just as online as a server with less than 300 players. Just saying.

Ok let me play devils advocate:

Suddenly out of nowhere 10,000 new players arrive to the newly merged servers!

  • They level, quest and see the sights
  • They realize their specs suck
  • They hit that “wall” of 3/3 dungeon runs
  • Someone tells them about the end game grind
  • Someone tells them about Hidden classes
  • Someone tells them about no resets
  • Someone tells them about Practonium / Blessed Gems / Past Exploits

You wouldn’t even see any of these players anywhere. They would stumble on the starting maps and get frustrated with the game and wouldn’t even reach level 200. The few hundred that do reach beyond 300 would realize just how little there is to do and how little THEY can do without +16, 10 stage weapons and without a Token and 1,000,000,000 silver.

Then they find out about Necrobotting, cash shop updates and the contents of Leticia cubes being direct causes as to why the game economy crashed. I mean, EVEN IF a surge of players happened to this game, it couldn’t sustain it.

8 Likes
#2737

The few hundred that do reach beyond 300 would realize just how little there is to do and how little THEY can do without +16, 10 stage weapons and without a Token and 1,000,000,000 silver.

now tell me how little can you do without +16, stage 10 weapon and token and 1b+ silver in the game? Just curious cuz I only have token and and “surprise” I can and do all game content.

5 Likes
#2738

Question regarding the stats extraction: can those other options from the Masinios items be extracted too?

Like the Xbow’s option to raise all QS skill levels by 2, the Rapier’s sharpening proc, or the 1h mace’s option that gives 30% chance to do additional damage?

#2739

I doubt you can, but keep lying and making it seem like the games end game is accessible for fresh new players.

#2740

I don’t think that’s going to happen, On one of the dev posts about they said that PvP was one of the feature that would be silver dependent…

#2741

Is he lying though? You don’t need that much gear except if you want to catch up with people in PVP (worthless) or World Bossing (actually you can if you have a support character). Meanwhile, you don’t need +16 stage 10 weapons for Saalus, HG340, CM, ET and Nobreer Raid.

9 Likes
#2742

The real problem is the lack of content to use your hellish grinded gear. End of the day all games are skinner boxes, the fun is found somewhere between the button press and the supposed reward. The mindset that it should matter for some end goal is self defeatist, it will never work out.

Yeah,and the new evil RNG layer comes with a new dungeon and FARMABLE COSTUMES(that also give stats due to set bonus),they even avoided the bullet on making it non gacha.

1 Like
#2743

The problem with ToS’ rng is that it is compounded too many times. The odds of finding a Primus Weapon X the odds of getting lots of stats / the odds of getting the right stats + the odds of getting high stats - the odds of getting the proper awakening ^ the odds of upgrading your weapon to +16 before it explodes. With the introduction of Belcoper gear, they adding additional layers of luck you must break through to make a perfect weapon. Now obviously it is not important to get the perfect weapon because everything in ToS is currently easy, but it is nonetheless possible so everyone aspires for greatness. Failing this feels awful because of how much time and money it costs trying.

5 Likes
#2744

i think the layers of RNG is fine
the thing that makes it so frustrating, is that there is only one path to greatness.
if the game added more exotic stats and varied the way power can be obtained via upgrades then it would make gearing up less about getting stronger and more about finding other ways to get stronger

the biggest example of this is in path of exile, where there are items that seemingly have the oddest properties, but can become extremely powerful if used and crafted correctly.

i dont know if the IMC devs have the capacity to make something as complex as PoE’s item system, but it would be cool to see them try.

#2745

I don’t think it’s that bad.

As said the stats can be upgraded/changed with no limitations to the Belcoper gear so you can start from less amazing and change to great later on. Also with HG gear you don’t need a good primus necessarily, sure they get the best stuff potentially but you can also get lucky with a blue or purple option too. It’s actually a great way imo to use those gear to their full advantage instead of being wasted.

1 Like
#2746

Can anybody provide some information regarding this?

For lower-rank classes, which skill factors remain relatively low, we have plans to introduce a Master Circle (name undecided) which will expand their combat power and abilities to a level similar to those of higher-rank classes.

It’s from the developer’s blog long ago: https://treeofsavior.com/page/news/view.php?n=1116

I wonder, are there any patch notes in ktos/ktest that added the said “master circle”.

#2747

Nothing new about that.

#2748

are you sure not exactly opposite ?
imagine when you someday get Belcoper staff and go to indetification NPC “tada” you got holy resist 35 >>ohh facepalm bad status >>reindentification then
or you can skip the indentification proces just pick a similiar 350 weapon from market and transfer the status
which one is more RNG ?

#2749

yeah its nice the new weapom for can transfer stats how many times you need. so we can try put refining 16+ after change stats to a masinios weapom for exemple… BUT the chance of “pick” this stats of the weapom is low >< so we can destroy a weapom tryng picking stats… we need to see how many this “LOW” is ><

#2750

you only have a chance of transferring stats to the crystal

1 Like
#2751

This. SO much this. I dont mind the RNG, it’s annoying but i can deal with it. But the lack of diversity is making gearing so boring, almost everyone is using the same stats whatever the build.

The game needs more items like Lydeka for example, items with gimmick. They might have less raw power, but have some sort of utility and synergy with your build.

2 Likes
#2752

Right, and its not really difficult to implement this in ToS. Just a few suggestions:

  • Bonus for using grey/blue equip
  • Bonus depending on the amount of (un-)used weight (STR should affect weight limit again)
  • Bonus depending on a combination of Ranks (e.g. Corsair, Squire and Rodolero) or number of different/same ranks
  • Bonus for being/or not being on certain CDs
  • Bonus using non-typical weapons for certain classes (e.g. mage classes for dagger wielding)
  • Bonus for using certain gems
  • Bonus for using party-buffs from different classes (e.g. not buyable or scrollable buffs like pillaging)
    I’m sure others of you will find many entertaining possibilities. It’s not like ToS doesn’t allow for this diversity, it’s just not implemented.