earth tower niche support builds now really viable?
QS - deploy pavise now make a big debut?
falconer2 - needed for AoE debuff?
peltast3/full-tanks - might be needed?
dieverbys - silence statue?
paladin3 - might be needed for barrier?
pardoner3 - decatose? its 15 sec CD with 10% chance to 1hko?
@FatePGN any vid on those reaching higher floors?
That and iād say itās also quite meaningless to crunch numbers when you donāt know the underlying crit chance formula. You might make faulty assumptions on how crit scales.
Wasnāt the crit formula speculated to be āCritical chance = (42x (critical rate - criticial resistance)) / LVā ?
Dievs will likely see some use, but theyāre quite good with the latest buffs anyway. They got plenty of dmg, defense and utility.
Paladins still suffer from the āi deal crap dmgā syndrome, and might stall the mission to much. Unless converted mobs can contribute nicely that is.
Same with Pardoners tbh. Outside of their 1hitko they donāt really bring enough damage to the table. Would be fun to see though.
Yeah, world bosses might hit for 10-12k and those 100 points in CON will give you 8k HP, so it wonāt help you survive even 1 additional attack. I just mean that when you have 30k HP as a warrior, if you invest 100 points in CON you will get āonlyā another 8k HP. And by that you sacrifice quite a huge part of your dps, since on 10 rank every point in str doubles and moreover, every point of stat above 500 gives you double amount of effective stats. So by investing 100 in CON you literally sacrificing 400 STR. Thatās why it might be much better to rely on your party and HP/resists from items. But investing in CON, just as investing in DEX, might still be profitable. I simply donāt think it is necessary for swordsman.
Also I didnāt say that DEX>STR. I said itās like a rock paper scissors, STR beats mages(potentially), DEX beats STR(through evasion) and mages beat DEX(evasion and accuracy wasted against mages, so DEX effectivity falls off). So depending on your preferences, avialble buffs and items, DEX may be better as well as STR may be better, but a good balance of both (probably with addition of some CON to polish) seems to be the best.
Wall of text was here only to show that in some situations DEX build may be better. And donāt forget that crit rate becomes less effective with lvl, so having 400 crit rate on lvl 500 is twice less effective than having 400 crit rate at lvl 250. Thatās why even if you are going full STR you may need to invest in DEX alongside with upgrading your gear to maintain stable crit chance.
In contratry, going full DEX, STR is only important for breaking through high defense enemies, since you can get raw damage from items and more importantly, from skills and buffs.
Pardoner 1hitKO definitely needs some buffs. 5 minutes-300 seconds = 20 uses. with 10% success chance you will get 2 kills of it. Sounds like a trash and wasting lots of money for nothing.
Paladin turn undead can 1hko also right?
Weāre all indebted to you Gwenyth! ć ć ”ć
After so much of a pointless discussion about dex or str or con, lemme just leave it here:
DEX is useless against any source of magical damage(PvE and PvP)
CON is never useless
Full DEX builds sucks because of that
grabs popcorn
@Karjalainen yeah too bad it sucks 
only towards demon and mutant monsters
here go cringe
to make it worse, its one of the most popular ToS videos on youtube
Thatās all the points I mentioned in my posts actually)
With slightly different conclusions. DEX has slightly lower dps than STR in PvE, but may be better in PvP(not against mages for sure).
CON is useless if you donāt die, because you lose dps while investing into it.
Actually I agree that full DEX sucks most of the time, cuz Hoplite would probably have more than 100% crit with full items and buffs(like krivis), so itās pointless. Much better is DEX>STR>CON build with Plate armor and shield from the list above working as a party tank.
Or another variant: go FULL STR>CON build with leather armor set and dagger which probably will provide much higher DPS, 1 more AOE ATTratio, but less tankiness.
In this case DEX>STR>CON build is obviously much safer though falls off a bit in terms of damage(which can be partially countered taking c1 doppel class) and fits better for tanky hoplites.
paladin should be on the fighter tree. it looks interesting but i donāt want any of the other half magic half healer jobs, so, iāll just stick to fighters.
That actually sounds usefull. If you have a pala 3 ā¦ you donāt need a tank anymore. And enemies will all hugg the shield area, before the stairs. Except ranged?
Cryo3, trauma 3 ā¦ that would be one heck of a tank.
If you can have 590 int at that time, and it converts it to 590 con ā¦ it becomes 826 con with the % buff of ranks.
Freaking 75k hp xDā¦ (you donāt even need doge, when you equip yourself with a good shield and plate armor. Priests will heal you so much ā¦)
Full int build afaik.
Does it work like that? I never checked for transpose, i made an tank cryo/trauma build ā¦ but only theoreticaly.
Actually itās specualted to be class type abriatted.
Archers are crit rate-crit resist/40 and others 60. But heck ā¦ no one profed that yet.
Hard to ā¦ if you donāt know the true crit resist of enemys.
And you would to hit them forever to see ādo i now hit 1000/1000 times with a crit ā¦ or not.ā, to be really sure.
Nice discussion about STR or DEXā¦ This open beta sounds really fun, but do you guys think that weāll need some tanky swordsman (full tank?) in the future? Maybe in Earth Tower now, idkā¦ I only played in Icbt2 and iām uninformed about the current state of the lategame in ktos 
And everyone is ok with the current cash system or nope?
Iāve asked some guy playing kOBT recently, he said that transpose right now has only 1 level. I doubt if he misunderstood it or they changed it. Anyway, even when it had 15 ranks, it resetted your hp to base max HP even if you recast it before the duration ends. But I hope they will change it in the future implementing mechanic like this into the game, because it feels superfun)
Also it still can be used by taking 1 lvl thaum+full glass cannon max damage build, spamming all you spells dealing insane damage and pulling aggro and then turning into meatwall constantly being healed by priest. Than rinse and repeat after 60 seconds.
xD trueā¦ but if you would heal on a changeā¦ That would make you so imbalanced in pve and pvp xD.
Literally. Hey im gonna hit you hard now.
! WAHA THIS HURTS! Iām gonna tell mom ā¦
buffs up
Instant heal and 75k hp.
Have fun killing that ā¦ while he still got cc or aoe dps that ticks around him.
There isnāt really an eventually.
STR scales better and better at higher levels due to the Rank bonus.
Dex scales the same at all levels.
Mechanics thread has Crit Rate as
(42 x (Crit rate - Crit Resistance))/yourlevel.
The higher your level the more Dex you need to Crit because the divisor is your level.
Aka each individual point of Dex becomes worth less as you reach higher levels and crit rate doesnāt really improve by adding Dex from when you added Dex at lower levels.
Again Crit is a 1.5x modifier + Critical attack.
IF you go full dex you wont have much for Critical attack anyways so youāre basically working with a 50% modifier that is only active sometimes, giving you a less then 50% damage increase on average as a result.
This game is rather linear for the most part (with exceptions), the status quo for Dex doesnāt really change much with level at all.
If you want a good crit rate, put green gems on your gear.
For example at level 600 based on the currently accepted formulaā¦ You only need 15 Crit rate (after crit-resist reductions) to have a 1% crit rate. So 1% per 15 crit rate at level 600. You can basically get an 18%-20% crit rate from green gems alone at level 600 and thats assuming 3 sockets, if we start getting 4 or 5 sockets? Good lord. With no Dex investment. The amount of Str you could have at that point would be in the thousands as would your Crit Attack.
Dex is valuable for high skill bases, and this game is throwing more and more multi-hits with lower bases. Get Dex because you well are looking for evasion + Crits. Get Str + Green gems and some Dex if youāre looking for heavy damage. Dex is even more meagre giving the Crit rate modifiers we have in this game. Swiftstep, Finestra, Monstrance, Sneak hit, skill crit modifiers like on Multi-shot. You get crit from so many places going Dex solely for crit is kind of foolish. If you want it for the evasion sure, but evasion canāt handle everything by itself anyways, unless youāve got like a Peltasta redirecting all the damage towards him, and given how many swords are going C2 Highlander or only Peltasta C1 instead of later Pel C2/C3 for more aggro controlā¦reality is ya need Con because Dex doesnāt really do jack for hit seeking magic.
You want Str and Crit rate for damage. You can get Crit rate from many other sources, or with a small amount of Dex. Str isnāt as easy to acquire in the same light.
Then thereās the whole issue of Block, which mandates Block penetration (SPR) if something is packing heavy block.
Sure healing on use would be OP, but maybe maintaining the HP you already healed wonāt be that OP. I mean if duration would be for example 80 seconds and cd 70, then you can recast it before duration ends, and avoid dropping your hp to the ground. That way you will need to heal only first time when you use a spell.
You donāt need ridiculous Con investment in PvE if you have a more traditional party set up that can mitigate incoming damage (Hello Safety Zone from C2+ clerics) or redirect it (peltasta C2/C3) to allow DPS focused players to well maximize their DPS.
Only thing is so much of the earlier game is done so well without real support/utility and soloability is emphasized so yeah take Con for that.
Granted I love having a Peltasta C3 in my group just makes things WAY cleaner to handle with that lvl 15 swashbuckling. No mess, no stress. Had one yesterday and life was good
really ? level 1 = 60s right ?
still op tough if combine with Plague Doctor
use transpose then heal
cast healing factor become a god at Pve and Pvp - invicible for 40s 