Tree of Savior Forum

In leu of druid and exorcist - what do we do with Plague doctor now?

Class and Rank Cleric
#21

Ein sof restores SP and can affect up to 2 people. It’s a couple of steps more useful than healing factor, which is usually going to be consumed only by the caster. It’s great when soloing, don’t get me wrong, but hard to appreciate in groups. Besides, if you’re taking Disenchant then you probably aren’t going to have enough points to put 10 into this.

Bloodletting is nice for what it does, no complaints about that one, but I cannot often think of many situations where I feel like I need lv2 status prevention urgently in PVE.

BDS and Incinerate are outperformed pretty hard by exorcist’s Rubric as a core dps skill for a caster cleric. Which sucks because I find them way more satisfying. If you’re playing for damage, you’ll be taking Exo or Druid.

Methadone is nice, but remember that Exorcist also gets knockdown prevention, even if it’s got a shorter duration. So I don’t feel like it’s particularly unique to Plague Doctor here.

TBH though I really didn’t know Disenchant was used for bosses, because I never really see it used or haven’t used it much myself as someone who primarily plays PVE. Does it work every time you cast Disenchant, or is it based on the success rate?

#22

Exorcist is a damage class. It should outperform a support character in damage output (note: PD was doing both damage and support before Exorcist was introduced. A support class playing the role of a DPS class).

Engkrateia is ridiculous with that 6s duration. You have to precisely time its use, otherwise you will waste the skill. It is a 1-point skill that you use only if you really need and precisely time it. For this particular reason, Methadone is superior. If Engkrateia had more duration, it would then be far superior considering the damage reduction factor it provides.

Plague Doctor is not on the spotlight, but it is not a terrible class either. It doesn’t need a buff, it was playing incredibly well so far before last changes, heck it was most notable on the DPS side, which is not what the class was meant to do, just look at the skills kit. Exorcist came to fix this lack of Magic DPS option for the Cleric tree, that pretty much was being played by PDs.

What IMC needs to address now is Chortasmata OP changes that they did (which pack so many low classes all together in 2 Skills, Chortasmata and Sterea Trofh) and increase Rubric’s cooldown a little, then things will probably be more balanced.

#23

Like, I entirely agree that PD should not do as much damage as a pure damage focussed class like Exo, but I also don’t think PD is firmly cemented as a ‘support class’ enough to justify that kind of distinction. Prior to Exorcist being released, PD was one of the premier if not most popular pure damage option for caster mage-style clerics, along with druid and taoist.

What I’m saying is I’d prefer the ‘support’ PD offers to be a little more powerful and interesting. Dievderbys is what I’d consider to be a successful support. they have a very unique niche and a distinct class fantasy and flavor that’s appreciated by everybody.

I also don’t agree that Plague doctor was ‘not meant to’ be a DPS class. When I look at PD’s skills, I see BDS and Incinerate, and Pandemic. PD to me has always been about spreading high-powered status effects like poison and burning over large groups of enemies to deal damage, with some weaker supplementary support options on the side. I should be able to pick PD for offensive roles because I enjoy that status effect playstyle and focus on controlling groups of enemies instead of dealing pure raw damage, but the amount of status we can spread with pandemic is so limited. May as well just blast everything with Rubric.

#24

Exo is a bit too strong know.
Zealot with all the drawbacks should do more dmg.

But its funny Pd was always one of the best cls ingame and now its too weak? xD

#25

I was C2>P3>Chap>PD3
Back then I pick that route since i thought BDS and Incineration will make my job easier as support (spray those nasty plague, and let the monster rot away while I’m focusing myself doing support)
Also Blessing had attack count, so I picked Blessing at max. In short, I wanted to capitalize Blessing buff with damage-per-second skills.

Back to the topic, what makes me dropped PD3 from the build is the damage interval and the duration of both Incineration and BDS. It is too freaking long for nowadays content. I mean, those skills are fine for bosses, but sh!t for feeble generic mobs in party play. The one who actually focusing themselves on damage would have obliterated those infected mobs in seconds, rendering my (supposed to be) helpful damage to be obsolete. Since one of its selling point is to be paired with Pandemic, then Pandemic becomes obsolete too.
Look, I know PD is supposed to be Supportive circle, but have you ever seen them use Pandemic to help spreading debuffs or damage? Pure, direct damage is to go nowadays.

Ahh, it reminds me of how 5-min Priest buffs are nothing to heard of too in nowadays content.

Edit: I also remembered reading one of the Developer’s Note mentioning about CCs cannot be blocked by usual buffs (Omamori, Prophecy, Dispeller, Bloodletting etc). So hey, what’s the point of Bloodletting again?
[Take this with the grain of salt since I’m too lazy or hallucinating. Eh. Whatever man]

Edit2: Also I pick Kabbalist since it’s more mythical and on practical note, Kabbalist feels more ‘supportive’ and ‘unique’. Exactly, only a cherry on top (Nachash) of the main course (Rest of the Mathematics Skills). While PD? Like one-third or even the half of the class are dedicated to deal blight/burn which are nothing against actual DDs

#26

Not that it’s 'too weak, but it doesn’t have as much of a strong identity anymore. If you have two things that do the same or similar job, but one of those things is better at doing that job, then your only reasons for taking the inferior of the two is because you value the unique things it can provide, not counting things like personal preference which are generally subjective.

#27

From the beginning Pd was a class focused on DEbuffs.
Not in DPS the dps was a nice thing to have.

Its a hybrid and i dont think its bad for that its just that Everybody wants dps or Kaba C3.

Let bosses spread more lvl 3 Debuffs and the meta will change to Pd ~.~

#28

From the beginning, PD was nerfed a few times in a row because their offensive core was so effective. And what debuffs can PD even use? The two status effects it can provide are purely damaging ailments (poison and burning). Disenchant can apply a debuff that nullifies armor bonuses and boost the level of already existing ailments, which again in PD’s case are just DoT damage in ailment form.

That doesn’t seem like a ‘focused’ class on Debuffs to me. PD has a lot more skills that focus on ailment prevention and cure. This is why I would like to see some more actual debuffs, maybe as an added effect on top of Black Death Steam as an attribute or something.

#29

Example of a Plague Doctor character with damage-oriented class combination

1 Like
#31

Possession?

But either way, Rubric channeling for 40% of it’s CD is nothing too impressive when you consider how low its CD actually is.

But yeah, Druid is clearly a bit favored with the update and buffed a little recklessly perhaps. I don’t think Rubric needs to be changed at all. How about IMC buffs up some of the other classes who are lacking instead?

#32

Hey, now you mention that it seems not that bad. After all maybe it is the poor execution of the surrounding (i.e. content). Just like before Velcopter, people seems to not touching Kabbalist. But nowadays Kabbalist C3 is everywhere :tired:

@fabricio_polo How about party play? I mean, yeah, it is not a secret that PD2 and up is good for solo play.

#33

IMO, Plague Doctor is perfectly fine. R10 will open up many possible builds that cover a wide spectrum of party roles.

Cleric2 Bokor1 Sadhu3 PD2 Exo2 - AoE DPS
Cleric2 Priest2 Diev3 PD3 - Support
Cleric2 Priest3 Chaplain Sadhu3 PD2 - Hybrid support/AoE DPS
Cleric2 Krivis1 Priest3 Chaplain PD2 Inqui1 - Chap Inqui with more DoTs boosted by Goddess of Fire and Blessing
Cleric2 Diev1 Bokor1 Paladin3 PD3 - PD DoTs boosted by Sanctuary, also Effigy spam
Cleric2 Diev1 Bokor3 PD1 Kabba3 - Damballa build with Effigy spam in a small radius
Cleric1 Priest2 Paladin3 PD1 Kabba3 - probably able to tank AoE damage with Barrier without too much trouble
Cleric2 Diev3 Druid2 PD3 - oh no, the grass stings, burns and is poisonous!

#34

Yeah keep in mind, I’m mostly basing my evaluation on PVE here, thinking about things like Velcoffer. For PVP players and ET or whatever I’m sure Plague Doctor’s benefits are more than enough to justify the class in their eyes. But as a long time Plague Doctor fan who’s always enjoyed playing as a DPS caster, I am trying to understand how to fix my PD next time a reset voucher becomes available.

#35

It was already mentioned that you can use disenchant, bloodletting (and methadone if C3), while keeping you or the tanker almost invicible with healing factor. Of course if you gonna follow a support path but, even with that, you can have BDS, pandemic and incineration, so you can offdamage during party play.

How your PD character will play depends on how you combine other classes with it. I showed a damaging variant cause it seems to be the main concern of this topic.

And we can agree that, if a build can solo Challenge Mode, it can well be a damage option for almost any content, I would even include Earth Tower 40F, maybe only velcoffer would be questionable.

Now, if you want your class build to be incredible in both support and damage, the you might be asking too much, cause this was always considered too much (as Druid2 is being considered now)

#36

Cleric2 Bokor1 Sadhu3 PD2 Exo2 - Is this worth missing out on Exo3 for a DPS build? You end up with two late circle classes at only C2, which seems iffy.

Cleric2 Priest2 Diev3 PD3 - Wouldn’t kabbalist be a better finisher to this build? Are we only taking PD here for status ailment prevention? Druid 3 would also provide more healing and support than PD in this build.

Cleric2 Priest3 Chaplain Sadhu3 PD2 - what does PD2 bring here that Exorcist2 or Druid 2 wouldn’t do better?

Cleric2 Krivis1 Priest3 Chaplain PD2 Inqui1 - why not take Kabbalist instead of PD2 to give an additional line of damage via Merkavah? If you need AOE damage for more dots on casting, then druid would be better.

Cleric2 Diev1 Bokor1 Paladin3 PD3 - this one I am legitimately very interested in, and the build I’ll probably change to for rank 10.

Cleric2 Diev1 Bokor3 PD1 Kabba3 - no problem here, PD1 is decent filler after all, but it’s not really a PD build, more of a Kabba build with filler.

Cleric2 Diev3 Druid2 PD3 - Wouldn’t Exorcist 3 be a better finisher for this build? burning grass is satisfying, but a rubric blast will probably still out damage it.

Basically, my problem is just that for many roles you’d pick PD for outside of specific things, exo or druid will do better. I want to know what those strong points of the class are so I can really build around it instead of just making an inferior exorcist.

#37

Oh, no, I’m not asking PDs to do damage as par as actual damage dealer circles
My (own) concern is by the time all the setup (BDS>Incinerate>Pandemic) had been done, the damage dealer(s) would have obliterated them. Which, in a way makes both BDS and incinerate ineffective (at least in my case, prior to cleric rebalancing). In short, the feel of usefulness of three rank I invested, which in part caused by nonexistent dangerous debuffs that need to be prevented (or cleansed)

#38

That build you showed seemed to be a mixture of PD and Exorcist though. Currently we won’t be able to have C3 of both until rank 12, and any exorcist build must have at least circle 2 of Exorcist or it just isn’t worth it.

That build is good for CM but would it be acceptable in Velcoffer over a dedicated Exo3? I don’t know and that’s what I’m concerned about. I don’t want to make a build that’s good for CM, I want a build that makes best use of the class’s strengths and identity so that I can say very confidently that I am using a Plague Doctor main.

#39

Velco isnt hard. You won’t be passed over in groups simply because you are a PD and you perceive Exo to be better.

Yes, Exo is better damage. PD is support/damage. Both are good.

#40

Status ailment was the word i didnt know in english sorrry :smiley:

#41

Ahh sorry for misunderstanding. They are similar terms.

Well this is true, PD has lots of ways to remove ailments, but not enough ailments you encounter in the game are so bad that they need a class dedicated to cleansing.