Lovely guide. The rationale is well thought of and explained. Keep up the good work!
1 Like
Sure, it also have a time limit.
Oh I see. Thanks 
Hey @Cathexis!
Thank you very much for making this guide. I always love new information and ideas from other players. Personally, I have followed your Hoplite guide to the letter during iCBT2. I loved the class and the experience. However, the play-style got a bit stale after playing the class for 3 ranks in succession. But anyway, I really appreciate your effort in doing this. You can bet your momâs brownies that Iâll be using this information as I play ToS 
Anywho, I have a question regarding âtankyness.â
Is Peltasta C1 sufficient enough to tank instance mobs and bosses at higher levels?
I have played iCBT2 for a bit as a Peltasta-Hoplite with a decent amount of CON and gears. And I have to admit, despite holding down the âCâ button for guard, the mobs and bosses still hurt. And I have to run to our resident cleric for heals. Now I know I canât just hold down the button, I have to move around and run from the bosses AoE. Which I do, but sometimes I get off guard and they hit me.
Anyway, you get the picture. Is there a way for me to be more of a tank without escaping by the skin of my teeth? Do you think this is just a problem with my play style? Or do you think this is a problem with not having access to more defensive skills?
2 Likes
Amazing work, thanks for writing this.
1 Like
thank you for the guide you cleared a lot of things (like the ammount of hits and damage difference on some skills)
well done
hope someone does the same for the other classes
it would help big time
1 Like
Thank you for the write up!!
1 Like
what do you think about this build? i dont think going to highlander c3 is that important since that 2 skill is not much of a use. Picked corsair for some pvp action, doppel for damage, and i really wanted to play shinobi. going for dex/con build.
A question to synchro thrusting if I may.
Would enchant fire and monstrance add an attack to each sources of damage, making it into a 6 attack skill?
If so, I wouldnât discard this skill so fast. If this works as I think it does, you would be able to stack a Lot of flat bonuses with that and as much as they would fall of later on, with concentration, gung ho, frenzy stacks, blessing, monstrance and enchant fire you could as much as double a crit damage from this skill.
If my math is correct, with a high str build and not super great gear ( ledas shield brandish ), with aforementioned buffs you could break 11k damage with a single skill. And itâs on overheat with 15s cooldown.
But as I said, I wouldnât jump the gun because I am unsure about the math myself.
Best guide ever! i hope after this people didnt ask same question over and oer again.
2 Likes
Not sure if it was pointed out before by someone, but I have some suggestions:
For Highlander Cartar Stroke level 3 is a great skill to get for farming and knockback.
For peltasta C2 C3 there is an option to go CON DEX build instead of full CON, that synergizes well with guardian. In that case the better option is NOT level HG past level 1 and max Umbro and Rim insteas. If used against staggered/frozen targets they will deal ~500% damage and even more if you crit. So they both can dish out some decent DPS even in late game.
Talking about Barbarian, cleave deals 3x damage vs stunned targets so there is an option to max it over Helm chopper, since it will deal more damage then HC. The only downside is that stun wonât work on bosses so HC is better against them. Same goes to PvP.
Regarding synchro thrusting, Iâd like to try Hoplite Fencer build but sadly itâs said on ToSbase that it wonât work with rapier. I wonder if IMC did that on purpose to remove Hop Fen synergy.
Regarding Rodelero, I was considering to make a Shield Push focused build, but as you say it wonât work on bosses itâs totally useless comparing to Skull Swing.
1 Like
I donât think this is accurate but I have no means right now to prove it wrong and since paid skill resets are on the way this will be tiresome to prove but I can vouch that 5 or so months ago it does indeed add up to 600. If it does not then it means that it is even more vital to max out the ability than leave it at say level 1 and let the attribute carry the skill over.
When iToS is open, or EU server is open (whenever that is, if ever) Iâll be recording the values very closely and come back with more information.
I do wish the skill descriptions in this game were more clear and didnât require people to literally data mine everything.
Thanks for the input.
2 Likes
@Cathexis Wow, amazing work there, I now see a lot more options being viable, thanks a bunch for this amazing guide, it helped me a lot and will surely help a lot of other players.
2 Likes
Cant say im a big swordsman fan but, good job on the guide very in depth.
2 Likes
Corsair: the main reason to max JR is increasing the chance of silver drop. JR lvl 15 seems to increase the chanse significantly comparing to lvl 1, so it may be a good alternative for squire 3 in pelt3 builds. Also buffs to pistol shot can be expected so it will become a viable option.
Doppel:
DOV: I wonder if the statement that you wonât lose stacks when recasting this skill is true, but it is a great skill anyway as it will decrease only pdef and not increase damage taken by 100%. Also you can max it, cyclone and Zucken(beware of SP cost, it skyrockets instanyly)/Redel while leaving 2-3 points for DPE and 1 point in remaining skills (0-1 for mordschlag).
Fencer:
Attaque Coquille lvl 3 is a good deal, since it will grant you 100% uptime on defense ignore, especially if you get +2 to Fencer skills Rapier(having 1 second over cd worth 1 point, I think).
Templar:
25 STR sure is not much, but it applies to every thingle guild member around. And itâll grant ~70 patk to high STR guild members so itâs worth to max it IMO.
Iâd suggest summon guild members at level 4 just to summon your party in emergency cases.
Also itâs recommended to have 2 or more templars at big Guilds to manage them properly. So second templar can get
reduce cast time buff, since they donât stack.
Also if higher ranks of those 2 skills(STR and Crafting) would be avialble they both will turn extremly useful.
Wonât argue about stat allocation too much, but I have a feeling that 9:1 wonât help too much. Iâve made some calculations for Cyclone damage and it has 2 pikes at 0 Dex and ~80 dex. Hop may be different but I think itâs rather full STR PvE or at least 80 DEX as well. Since the more crit rate you get the more negligible enemy crit drfense becomes.
For PvP for any melee class youâd probably want to have A LOT of CON, because every 40 points in CON increase your base HP by ~30%, so itâs ~200% more base HP at level 280.
Itâs especially relevant if you have some armor break skills/good equipment that will significantly boost your base damage.
Though high offense builds are also great but full STR will âonlyâ increase your DPS by 30-50%.
So finding a good balance is hard, probably offensive stat allocation will help you to burst enemy priest while itâs unprotected but make you defenseless vs enemy mages/archers/bokors as they will quickly kill you.
All around builds tend to fall off in terms of damage, so Iâd suggest to go âHighâ builds instead.
DEX CON can actually deal decent damage as well if you have a ways to overcome enemy defense. Peltasta2Rod3 for example can deal LOTS of burst damage if using maxed Umro Blow on staggered target under the effects of high kick and armor break with High Guard lvl1 activated, especially if itâll crit (more than 1000%). Sure itâs hard to have all of this at the same time, but even 500% is quite a lot.
4 Likes
@nasibubur12
Every Shinobi skill has an AoE Ratio of 0, except Mijin no Jutsu which has a value of 3.
Each bomb is 500 silver if I remember correctly (I will verify this shortly and edit this post if necessary).
To be honest, I have no idea. I donât think anyone has tested Shinobi with Doppelsoeldner yet.
My best guess is that they get interrupted. But I wouldnât be surprised if Cyclone still works once you drop down after Mokuton, IF it still has duration left.
Shinobi is still a fairly untested class, because of how few people have actually around to play with it. So there are many class interactions to be discovered when it comes to it.
@gene_d01
MmmâŚI see both as viable options.
The thing is that if you go Hoplite C3->Corsair, you will be missing on Doppelsoeldner, which is the path that I recommend for Hoplite C3. Without it, you are going to be lacking on new ways to deal damage at Rank 6 until you get to Dragoon and even though Throwing Spear is still a good filler, I think you might want to get more damage.
If you want Corsair for the costume, I think you would benefit more from picking Corsair C2 in this case, as you will trade a better Finestra and Throwing Spear for Hexen Dropper and other Corsair skills. Which I think is a fair trade as you gain new ways to deal damage.
Since you are not taking Doppelsoeldner with Hoplite C3, then you will have higher DPS with Hoplite C2->Corsair C2. That is what I would recommend.
You are welcome to ask anything you want on this thread!
Well, you canât use 2H Spear until you reach Dragoon with that build.
At that point you will want to use 2H Spear most of the time, and take out a shield when you have to tank or fight world bosses or even for some PvP situations.
As you said, 2H Spears have a higher Physical Attack and they will make a difference in your damage output. By the time you get to Dragoon you will be able to tell exactly when to use 2H and when to use 1H+Shield.
Yes, you can crit with physical skills.
I consider Synchro Thrusting slow for the amount of damage it deals. But the main problem is that it has a very awkward hitbox, and it doesnât hit too many enemies. While it could potentially be better damage over a very long fight as it provides better sustained damage, it is also an unlikely scenario. The only long fights are bosses, and those die very quickly to a Hoplite, so Synchro Thrust doesnât have time to shine and that is why simply using Pierce and Stabbing is better.
Throwing Spear as a 0 cool-down skill is indeed a rotation filler, it still deals pretty good damage despite the animation required to use it, as long as you cast it at melee range. I do think it is worth maxing it now, simply because it is a great filler. But if you would rather stick to auto-attacks (which are still great), then you can add these points to Pierce/Stabbing instead.
For Pierce vs Stabbing:
Stabbing will always deal good damage, no matter if it is level 1 or level 15. My personal preference is to max Pierce because it is instant and you want to get the most out of it when using it, so it helps better on short fights as you will need less time to kill a mob (it can also Overkill with high enough damage). And no, I wouldnât sacrifice points from Finestra to level either of these up.
I have been thinking a lot about maxing Stabbing since it has a shorter cool-down now. But the thing is, against normal mobs it doesnât even get to fully cast, as they die very fast. And at higher levels, you will need many skills to bring down tough enemies, so the extra damage wonât really make a difference.
On the other hand, Pierce does need more points in it to become a useful skill, otherwise it is pretty weak. Since Stabbing doesnât really need those extra points, then I consider it fine to use them to help Pierce shine too instead.
You are right about Dragontoothâs channeling, but the most important thing is that Dragontooth has a much higher AoE impact than the other skills, as it is quite a big area it covers, so it can hit a lot of enemies.
For Highlander, I think you might want to wait, as there is a possibility that Sky Liner will have 15 seconds cool-down instead of a 0 seconds one.
For the highest DPS build, I think it depends on how long the fight lasts and the type of enemy you are fighting. But your build is certainly among the highest damage ones. The thing is that there is no clear âbest DPSâ build, as many of them are so close that they are equally strong but each shine in a different scenario.
Yeah, Doppelsoeldner C2 is just as strong as Dragoon at Rank 7. And a great choice if you are looking for a 2H Sword build (or if you simply donât want to use spear).
Thanks!
There are a lot of typos like that that I need to fix, difficult to keep track of everything with so much information to cover.
It is 300%.
Throwing Spear vs bosses is still a filler. It is usually better used when you have to hit multiple enemies, and I think it will depend on your ping whether using auto-attacks or Throwing Spear will be better as a damage source.
Squireâs Refreshment Table food works like this:
Salad: +10% max HP (+2.5% for each additional level)
Sandwich: +10% max SP (+2.5% for each additional level)
Yogurt: HP recovery time decreased by 1 second (-1 second for each additional level)
Soup: SP recovery time decreased by 1 second (-1 second for each additional level)
The problem with Hoplite C3 is that while Throwing Spear is a nice skill filler, you are going to need more damage for higher levels (from Corsair, Doppelsoeldner and Dragoon).
So it doesnât really matter if Squire increases your SP regen, as it is not really something that useful because SP potions cover your SP perfectly fine already.
If you want to make a Squire it is better to get to C3, otherwise your buffs/shops will get outclasses by other Squires who did get to C3.
So overall, I donât think it is a good idea to go Hoplite C3->Squire C2.
Even though Maintenance has a duration, it also has a hit count.
Each hit you deal decreases your counter by 1, so the buff will run out depending on what is over first, the duration or the number of hits.
So that Attribute doesnât add more damage, it simply increases the number of hits you can deal for the duration of the buff.
Peltasta C1 is more than enough to tank anything in the game (personally I have done it with 0 points in CON).
I think it could probably have been a problem with your ping? As lower ping makes it much easier to dodge attacks by moving and blocking at the right moment. Or perhaps all you need is to be more careful.
There is nothing else that could really help you but adding more CON to your build, so just add more points until you feel comfortable with your HP.
Also, your protection highly depends on the Cleric in your party, with buffs like Stone Skin, Safety Zone, Heals, etc. So if you feel that you are REALLY having troubles, then it might be your Cleric either slacking off or having a not very supportive build.
5 Likes
I think you should wait until we get confirmation on whether or not Highlander will get a nerf to Sky Liner (15 seconds cool-down instead of 0), before deciding on your build.
If that nerf does go through, I think you would end up having a better DPS build with Hoplite or Barbarian instead of Highlander.
From my experience, Synchro Thrust doesnât add any additional line of damage. So in the end it remains as 2 hits.
Thank you for your contribution.
The problem about Highlander is the pending confirmation on the final cool-down of Sky Liner. But even then, Catar Stroke scales extremely poorly in damage and it is replaced very fast by better skills, so it is not worth it to spend too many points into this.
Yeah, for Peltasta C2/C3 I do recommend DEX/CON, as I didnât even list Full CON on my Stat allocation section. The %s on skills, while high, still end up being a very disappointing amount of damage in the end, especially at high levels.
Yeah, Synchro Thrusting not only works with spear but it also requires a shield too. It is not flexible when it comes to that.
For Shield PushâŚthe thing is, if you want to decrease the defense, it is simply to get Armor Break because defense will never go lower than 0. And Shield Push requires a lot of points to remain relevant, while Armor Break skills simply do it with 1 level.
Thank you for your contribution. I will add the missing details to the Barbarian section shortly.
On Cleave I agree, I usually max it, but I left the option for some builds to leave it at level 1 for utility IF they wanted to get both Frenzy and War Cry. But most builds following the guidelines will end up with Cleave maxed out anyways.
The thing about Helm Chopper and the reason why I like to max it, is because it is extremely good as a source of Strike Damage. I do agree that it could be left at level 1, but I would suggest that for builds that add more STR to their builds.
The problem with Frenzy is that you still need to stack it up, and it takes quite a while. At level 240+ you donât have the time to really do it, as you gotta kill the mobs really fast otherwise they will kill you quickly instead. I did note it is mainly for particular scenarios like bosses. And no, it doesnât fall off if you use a skill like Seism, it only falls off with auto-attacks or the duration running out.
War Cry attributes do not add damage that way. I did a post about it in the past which you can find here:
So in the end, Level 10 War Cry with level 10 Attribute on 10 enemies only adds +330 Attack (which is the best, highest scenario). It is still a considerable amount, which is why I overall value it more than Frenzy. But in a build that gets both skills, it can add a significant amount of damage like you said, the only problem is getting the Frenzy stacks and at higher levels you donât find many mobs grouped together outside of dungeons.
And please do make some videos, we certainly needs lots of those and I canât cover videos for every class and every build out there.
Thanks!
To be honest, I am unsure as to whether or not more levels on Jolly Roger significantly increase the amount of Silver it drops. I would need to see some elaborate testing from someone so that I can confirm it as true and it include it in the guide.
The thing about Attaque Coquille at level 3 is that, 100% up-time isnât really necessary, considering how short of a cool-down it is and taking into consideration the animation of skills and different types of skills a Fencer build will have on itâs kit, those 3 extra seconds donât have any meaningful impact on the overall view of a build (especially for short fights, when mobs die in 2 seconds or less).
The Templar point is good, I will add it shortly. The problem is that there canât be any âbigâ guilds, because the amount of space each guild can have (even after leveling it up), is very small.
I would need to test for myself or have someone else test the range of Battle Orders, for us to determine if the +25 STR is worth it or not. But considering that it is only a choice between this or reduced crafting time, then if there are 2 Templars to cover one each of them, then it makes sense to get it.
The damage from a PeltastaC2+RodeleroC3 as in burst damage is extremely insignificant at higher levels, when mobs have so much HP it takes way more than entire rotation of full % skills to bring one of them down, let alone a group of them.
4 Likes
Thanks, I guess Iâll just put in some more dex on my build to cover up what I missed on Finestra 15/15.
1 Like
Wow! Nice guide dude, iâm following this up 
I have a question: some guys told me that the best build for PvP Swordman is Sw3 cata3 dragoon.
My point: restrain can be countered by plague doctors. And the physical attacks by the priest3. Whats the point to get swordman 3 while you can get iron hook from corsair, which cant be countered?
So, the best pvp build wouldnt be with a corsair path?
1 Like
I think that Swordsman C3->Cataphract C3->Dragoon is a one trick pony and it is not the best PvP build.
There is no âbest PvP buildâ. It comes down to the creativity and skill of the players (and ping), to outsmart their opponents.
But yeah, Corsair is a strong candidate for a good PvP build right now because of Iron Hook.
4 Likes