Just got a 3rd Vubbe Fighter’s Blood just wandering through the mines (Monday before maintenance).
@Bald_Dad I just remembered something that I used to do whenever I ran out of Green Gems: Farm them at Lizardman in Goddess Ancient Garden. Thought I’d share some stuff I’ve observed that might help.
Trusting TOSbase.com’s droprate value for the item (3.33%), by DPK standard it would mean that I need to kill 30 to get the gem each time.
I jump channels and in one rotation on that particular spot (where they’re concentrated) I’d get to kill about 8-15 of them. It was very rare to see another player there, and if there was ones just passing by to do some quest.
Weird thing is in a rotation I got 2 Green Gems between 3-4 kills. Same map, same channel.
Checking w/ your findings, the following does NOT seem to apply:
Not trying to debunk your findings but could it be a mix of RNG and DPK?
For example, on server reset, 10 monster X spawns on map (whether on just this channel or on all available channels) where server has already predetermined via RNG which of those 10 has the item. The next 10 spawns would be the same, whether they spawn at the same time or gradually replacing the dead batches, one of them having the item.
This could explain why a rare item could consecutively drop (ie. when there’s an overlap of 2 batches or more).
Thoughts?
Exactly like you said, there is a mix of RNG and DPK on this game. Back in ICBT TOSBASE.com got the hold of the drop table till monsters lv 198 if not mistaken. As you can see the green gem is RNG based. My post and explanation are valid for DPK items, for Lizardman that would be the bloodstone and brigadine armors.
2 Likes
Oh, I stand corrected and thanks for clarifying it.
The idea still saddens me though because if this is the case then bot armies are at an advantage.
p.s. Are mithril ores DPK items or not?
Most likely yes, cant test it due to competition.
No worries. It would indeed be very hard to test that particular item. XD
Hoping for more input from others.
Drop are on kill, not on spawn.
Drops are on kill, I’ve been testing to prove otherwise and my findings are not helping me prove my case xD
So that also means oracle skills work differently than I expected. They may lock-in what a monster would potentially drop, instead of showing the items that monster had spawned with. But I won’t be able to test until I get my cleric ranked up.
The test group I’ve been using has been rather slippery even though they only spawn in one zone and I can see most of them as they spawn.
Yay, the educational information is back.
Can’t be, because of Oracle skill they must already be determined beforehand.
The drops are on kill and the oracle’s skill likely functions as if the mob was killed at that moment; it then it proceeds to lock those items in.
2 Likes
^ Could be viable. /20 chars
Seems impossible to prove though. I just think it’s unlikely, because it seems weird to only save the drops in a “buffer” when the oracle skill was used.
We can at least say this:
after set amount of kills on a channel by any player, the next mob killedwill drop the item in case.
This allows us to say drops are not stored by spawning the mobs (this would be stupid anyway, if we assume there are like 200-600 mobs on each single map).
But do we know if DKP items can drop on shiny mobs?
Shining Hanamings do NOT drop their DKP items.
Yet I got my first blood from a shining Vubbe Fighter. - maybe this was just coincidence with the actual DKP at this point.
It Does sometimes but cant test enough due to rarity of them. Does not reset the actual kill count of that DPK item.
In that case, the item in question is part if a shinings fixed loot table and will always drop on same shining mobtype.
It does seem like it would be difficult to prove. However, from an efficiency standpoint, it would make sense for items to drop on kill. Let’s say items were determined at spawn: imagine when the servers are started up after maintenance (or on the rare occurrence that the servers might crash)… each generated mob would have its items set up at virtually the same time; that would be a bad idea and a poor choice to make (even if the overhead isn’t that costly). Mobs on maps that may not get killed for potentially hours would have their items determined at that moment. Now, however, if drops occur on kills, there isn’t such an overhead attached to the system.
As a programmer myself, I would definitely ensure that drops occurred on kill (I’d probably also increase the the amount of RNG in the DPK:RNG ratio), but I understand how the oracle’s skill would lead people to believe that the items are set in stone as a mob spawns.[quote=“dahdoczock, post:210, topic:304868”]
But do we know if DKP items can drop on shiny mobs?
[/quote]
During my boater hunting, I had a blue orb drop on a shiny mob (silver, not gold), and this was right at about the same time I was expecting the orb to drop. Only one of these dropped off of a shiny during the entire grind, and I cannot recall if I obtained another blue orb after that as it may have been close to the point when I obtained the hat (I’m 60% sure I obtained another blue orb 10k kills later, but I wouldn’t count on that statement).
If we’re referring to the RNG drops, a good way to prove it would be to find a monster that has a good chance of dropping at least 2 different items, and use Clairvoyance on that specific 1 monster about ~15 times. If the item stays the same all 15 times, then it’s on spawn. If it changes, then it’s not.
Maybe Aubrey from Mage Tower 1F?
Oh god.
Does that mean CHromadogs hat drop is on the DPK.
Remember way back farming Sitricius F2 with a group and didn’t get jack squat.
That’s a weird conclusion. If a rare item drops after 1200 kills of a monster it could be because:
a) When the 1200th monster was killed it rolled for the drop and determined that the rare item drops.
b) The game is setup that on every 1200th kill the item drops.
c) When the monster spawned, it rolled for its drop and determined that the monster will drop the rare item on kill.
d) Every 1200th monster that spawns get the rare item put into its drop list.
It can be any of those in that scenario. You can’t just scratch off one, especially not because you think it’s not the best implementation of the system. We are talking about IMC here, they don’t code like that.
It was probably more like: Originally they wanted to do it on kill. Then they added Oracle, so they had to rethink their system and calculate drops on spawn. But then there was too much memory used so they changed the system that each mob can only drop one item, so only one item needs to remembered per mob. Then they added shiny mobs so there are at least some mobs that drop multiple items.
That’s honestly the most likely scenario in my opinion.
The only thing we can safely say is that it can’t be a pure DPK system because sometimes a rare item drops twice within a short time. Everything else is just guessing. All of the findings could very easily be explained with a simple RNG system too.