They have good sustained dps too, but yes, mostly they’re burst, so what though? That burst is way too strong and clearly needs nerfs.
It’s hard ot tell if something is a joke these days given that some people seriously believe in some really really stupid thing (like Hexing’s attribute is ‘add 30% skill factor’ and not ‘increases dark damage by 30%’ as its tooltip say)
h3b1dp3 for single target its the best@doppel, about the top dps for boss its hop shinobi murmilo, a 7.5k patq murmilo did 14kk dmg in abou 14secs or so. yourwelcome.
Hey guys after all this discussion (seems like a dop thread here lol) can we somehow try to compile a top-tier DPS list for upcoming WB’s patch? Even though these lists tend to oversimplify stuff, they are usefull for setting up parameters I’d say.
From my experience, I guess I’d go with:
Tier 1 - Doppel3; Shinobi-Murmillo (for lower HP WBs especially)
Tier 2 - Fencer3; Fletcher3-Hacka/Mergen (seem to have better sustain against higher HP WBs)
Tier 3 - Monk3-Inquisitor; Ele3-WL2; Sadhu-PD2 (given you aren’t competing against other PDs)
You know that the Doppel Class is nerfed down to the ground like IMC doesn’t want it to spread like a virus.
On the other hand given items such as Glass Mole, Trans and gems really helps it compensate for the amount of reduction it has on it’s skill thanks to these “Justice patch”
So adding another nerf would just hinder the class even further. But after sometime, players will find a loophole from those nerf.
idk why They need to be lowered to the ground but seriously, some classes need more work and love than doppels. I mean look at the cleric class tree 
try fighting a 5 man cleric team in TBL and lets see who will cry a nerf for their class tree.
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If Archer/Wiz would do the same dmg it would make Doppel complete useless.
Its a melee glasscanon Wiz/Archer don´t need to get in the atack range from the bosses.
Doppel needs a babysitter archer wiz just can stay out of range and kite bosses.
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I’m not sure I understand you, but I’m not saying they need to be nerfed to the ground, people always assume this ■■■■ when you say something needs to be nerfed, it’s really frustrating.
Usually the highest damage goes to ranged chars, but I don’t agree with “highest possible damage” going to a class just because it’s melee or ranged.
Yeah in games with clear Healer/DD/Tank jobs.
Thats not the case in this game.
(Another reason why i play this game since i want to play DD but dislike Archer/Wiz)
IF Archer/Wiz would do the same dmg and are way easier to support why would anybody chose a doppel as DD?
Good point. Ranged DPS has the benefit of being able to mitigate a lot of damage by simply not needing to be in melee range against melee DPS enemies.
It doesn’t make sense for Melee to do less damage while taking the risk of being damaged by all DPS types (melee and ranged).
Melee does have an advantage with Flying types as it isn’t hindered by “ground moves” like Wizards and some Archer abilities, but I think that’s a problem in design of Flying types being way too strong in the first place.
I think the assumption here was that if Doppel did get a nerf, IMC would overdo it ridiculously, as they’ve done in the past to other classes.
Archers (with bows) do have a 50% damage bonus to flying mobs though and there are several archer skills which specifically hit flying mobs or deal additional damage to them, so they can do pretty well against flying enemies. Meanwhile, wizards get nothing super against flying mobs but most of their skills will hit them as long as they aren’t an elememe iirc.
Like if being ranged helped in this game… The monsters and bosses usually have attacks impossible to dodge in the first place regardless of the range that cause knockback too… Rafene per example.
By this logic Featherfoot, Rogue and Hacka should have the best damage in the game because they have to be in melee range, and all of then don’t have Pain Barrier or protect zone.
And then we have Fencer, that not only do less damage than Doppel but have an bad AoE too. Doppel is way too strong right now even in the swordman tree to be honest.
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I don’t see doppel being too strong. It’s just that fencer3 and especially dragoon2 are underwhelming. Corsair is too but its utility and PVP capabilities are really good. There’s also classes in the archer tree that are way too underwhelming as well.
So basically, doppels are not OP, its all the other classes that are underwhelming?
Runecaster + PSYK + CYRO
even world bosses dont stand a chance (more like half hp but still pretty good)
Basically agreeing that doppels are stronger than many other classes. I agree a way to fix the unbalance among these classes is buffing the the underwhelming ones, for sure, but that’d make the game even easier, so, nerfs for me.
It’s a stupidily strong combo for sure. But the reason I can’t even consider it a competitive tier build is simply cause it takes too much preparing and it’s too easy to cancel early (knockback/down, someone linking your shards and/or multihitting them intentionally etc.)
I am aware of that, but Archers have very limited AoE. You’re basically looking at Falconer C1 investment and aerial skills like Cannoneer for Flying types, but Cannon means using a Crossbow with the Cannon and not a 2H bow so no % bonus to Flying monsters.
Mergen does have some AoE but long cooldowns. Wugushi C2/C3 has extended poisons and some AoE, but long cooldowns. Same limitation for Sapper trap for vs Flying minus Broom trap. Hunter Snatching is good, but Hunter pet AI is buggy/bad sometimes.
It just feels like Archer has a very difficult time with AoE vs Flying mobs, something Swordsman doesn’t have an issue with since their attacks hit both flying and grounded types no matter what the skill.
That still doesn’t excuse the fact that Flying type mobs feel like they have little weaknesses. There should be more skills that capitalize on Flying-type mobs so they have a more apparent weakness.
Exactly and they will leave other classes such as inquisitor and other cleric class untouched. It’s like, they don’t want you to play a melee pure offense character.
Doppel is riduculously strong, for being top dps in both aoe and single target. Just look at fletchers, be it mergen or hacka, and also the old fencer. They have problem dealing aoe damage. Mergen aoe is not that impressive without falconer or enough AAR gears.
Doppel on the other hand, gets AAR from skills, has ridiculously high burst, and gets access to pain barrier!
What does fletcher (hacka especially) get? Good single target, bad aoe, no pain barrier, even with fletcher being range class, time used to land the magic arrow result in dps loss.
Idk man. Doppel definitively feels like, they get the best from both worlds.
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The only debuff you’re extending is Zwerchau, which might change (aka nerf/fix).
Cleave is an easy debuff to apply in both builds due to 3 overheats, and you should be reapplying it every 4 seconds because it also gives you the 50 crit rate which only lasts 4 seconds (same as debuff). So the only reason you go Barbarian C3, to get Warcry buff extension is for that one debuff that doesn’t even work for plate.
Frenzy is nice too, but consider buff limits and how often you have time to do 10 auto attacks on an ET boss to get the full effect. Only mentioning ET here since it seems to be your main focus here.
Then consider the abysmal damage skills like Seism, Helm Chopper, Pouncing etc. I would argue that Barbarian C3 is right now an utter joke compared to highlander C3. Wild buff is a terrible gimmick way to try and breathe some life into the terrible class and no one should be sprinting like an idiot to get minor buffs to their skills every 15 seconds.
Think about that for a while.