Tree of Savior Forum

About bringing RNG to the cash shop

General Discussion
#82

Dungeons can be done only a certain amount of times per day, though. And that’s on top of the chance of getting a scroll.
For an item that gives a random enchantment, thus something you’re supposed to use multiple times until you get a good enough one.
It is something that impacts gameplay and is made on purpose to push people to pay, rather than spend a ton of time (depending on the actual rate of drops and luck on getting the good enchantments).
And it brings quite some memories over how RO decayed over the years, i should add.

I don’t like it at all. I would rather pay a subscription (as i did for several games in the past - like with the good old euRo) if it means i don’t have to deal with gameplay mechanics made obnoxious for the only purpose of sucking real cash out of players.

2 Likes
#83

Poor children, can’t wait to see your cry here when IMC afect the fanboy’s like u.

See u again.

#84

As much as it would be nice for a sub model, the problem is that there are far too many cheap people who refuse to pay based on their self entitlement. People think they deserve everything for free, and that mentality does not provide profit, nor the numbers needed to even begin to produce.

The mechanic isn’t pay to win, its pay for convenience/time. This is not an issue, because dedicated players will attain what they need in the end anyway, so its not like theyre missing out if they don’t buy. It just takes longer.

I myself would love a sub model, or soft sub model, either way, the cash shop now is suitable the way it is, Im doing just fine even without exp potions, or any of the things they have in there. Shouldn’t be a concern for anyone wondering what its like in KR atm.

#85

About the RNG it’s really all about the mind. Gambling mechanics are a potent effect. Responses vary from individual to individual. Some people are born with chemistry that makes them gambling fiends some are not.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Variable_ratio

1 Like
#86

Lets count amount of RNG tied to these scrolls:

  1. Drop from cubes is random.
  2. Number of awakened options is random.
  3. Awakened stat types are random (we assume that each stat type has equal chance of appearing, but IMC might implement “weight” system with “better” stats having much less weight/chance).
  4. Awakened stat values are random (same as above, lower values might have higher chance of occurring. Players are at better position if they aim for mov speed and/or AoE att rate because they have only a single possible value if my concern in (3) isnt a thing).

All of this combined makes it almost impossible for normal player to get desired stats at acceptable levels via in-game methods which is border-line P2W. Things are a little bit better if these scrolls are tradeable.

3 Likes
#87

Its clear those are factors, but all it does is increase the time it takes, yes, it pushes towards making a purchase, but again you ‘dont have to’ in order to attain what you want.

I understand that there will be players frustrated with people advancing faster than they will, thats just nature. You’ve mentioned its borderline. I guess i still dont agree with that, because you as a non paying player can attain it. The minimal stat difference does not make someone ‘win’ its incredibly negligible at later levels, much like runes and masteries in lol, it makes a small difference, but not much.

Either way, the day the game will be p2w is the moment someone can achieve something a non paying player cant achieve by purchasing something. Until then, all these threads are and will continue to build fear for no reason.

I’m in the KRobt right now, and the concerns mentioned in this thread aren’t evident at all. Just give it time, its really not as bad as people make it out to be.

2 Likes
#88

Deez nuts kid. The one crying is you I already expressed that this is the kr version and it doesn’t reflect what imc may do to the international release. There’s also been enough kr stunts to generate a while lotta discussion on multiple threads about cash shop, p2w, a balanced game for both premium and non premium players.

Im sick of it, you aren’t generating new discussion, if your so keen on the community look at older threads. Obviously I’m all for a balanced game for both types of players, however crying wolf EVERY TIME kr does something. Then you get the people raging, again, threatening to leave like ppl care about em, again, when nothing is even set in stone.

So stop bugging me I don’t like you like that.

P.s. deez nuts fam

Sincerely, Fangalis, Laima hate child <3

2 Likes
#89

can drop its from boss? i mean world boss/Dun Boss? pepole can sell that to other pepole?
if yes i not worry
if no its real problem =(

#90

i think about that its look like hat enchant at ragnarok the enchant of cash pepole can use on style eq or donation hat
i mean that but at tos its for hat only? so its better
Yes at ro can do its free on some eq lets hope we can get its from bosss at TOS


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#91

Dungeon bosses last time I checked, may be for both but I’d rather have it not be.
No idea if they can be sold, would be neat.

#92

You’re just straight up lying. We don’t need this kind of bullshit in the forums here please.

#93

Well, its kinda true that some of the stats that you can get from enchant scroll is hard to get from normal items, BUT as someone mentioned it earlier, it’s not super balance breaking.

Without thoes enchanted hair costumes, you still can beat dungeons, missions and quest ‘Easily’ (if you r not an archer class or super weak classes). And honestly, i even don’t find any necessity of buying that enchant scroll cuz it doesn’t make much difference in the gameplay. I would go with the statement that the scroll is a convenience item.

But again, I must say that the reason i’m OK with this scroll is becuz

  1. it’s not super balance breaking.
  2. You can obtain it from boss cubes (by little chance)

Anyway it’s bit disappointing that enchant scroll is not a tradable item

#94

P2W is a relative term, so please, stop saying it is/isn’t, it’s your opinion, don’t shove it into other’s throats.

Based on your reasoning, It’d be ok to do the following:

  • (Terrible Idea) Sell exp cards in the cash shop, and cap the experience your character can earn from killing mobs each day.
  • (Terrible Idea) Sell silver in the cash shop, and cap the amount of silver you can get from selling items and killing mobs each day.
  • (Terrible Idea) Sell drops in the cash shop, and cap the amount of drops you can get from mobs each day.

If the idea is bad, we should let IMC know, and the way these awakening scrolls are being handled… I’m not the only one that finds it lame, bad, and a fun-killer.

I woundn’t mind a sub model, either, even if you added a cosmetic cash shop to it, as long as stats and boosts stay completely out of the cash shop…

#95

Deez nut fanboy’s now u are trying to show u have a sense of notion?

Make me laugh more, first u say of don’t care about nothing and totally agree about the changes in the cash shop/comerce in game.

The only child here is you… I’ve say u represents the most of members kind here.
!
(This is only on KR version, let’s sit down and acept all these changes).

So, u are one of these Deez nuts kid’s/fanboy’s, some members and the reddit members hates guys of u kind (like these others members like u).
Prepare for fart some bucks, cuz u don’t care about anything (when u was sayd it).

#96

I’m not gonna pretend I fully understand your broken english but from what I understand you like roasted nuts cuz the flame ima bring to u boiii!

What I wrote was satire, I lurk the forums and thus clearly like the game and want it to succeed, whiny runts, much like you included. It seems your only point is that I’m a selfish, childish, probably idiotic ToS fanboy that likes rng in cash shop? lol okay cool with me. Next time brush up on the English and learn to read between lines.

My “notion” was established from the first paragraph. It began and ended at “Oh that’s Korean ToS being published by Nexon, so I’ll be patient. After all this doesn’t represent iMC/Steam and whatever plans they have.” If your that talt over it well that sucks. I do support imc because I played their beta, liked what I saw from the game, and follow it to see when more news (Kr or Inter) arrives.

Under the assumption that, imc did make everything p2w and the game gets boy-cotted by the fear-mongering, lie spreading, people I always see popping up in every Cash related yay fans? Lol no everyone loses. Even Maplestory with its ludicrous p2w model has been enjoying a lot of prosperity for years, so one could argue that it actually does work. That high paying customers can keep a crap game afloat and ultimately see it through success.

So long as the game is active, there is room for progress, and a dead-game gets nowhere. However I don’t think this means the company should bend completely to the consumer. If they implement a fair game in terms of cash-shop. Fine. However if it isn’t don’t worry you can piggy back off of my support and enjoy the game for free until you see things in it you like.

P.S. Deez nuts fam

#97

Please stop feeding attention to the troll… and stay on topic.

3 Likes
#98

It’s not that simple. You are gated by how many instanced dungeons you can do in a day. If you don’t get your scroll, just to have a chance at getting an enchant on your item, ( which is another chance to get the enchant you actually need ), you have to wait another day, just for a chance. Or you can just pay 8 TP. The difference between paying / playing is way too large.

These stat amounts are not “small” even at lvl 200+. And they will make a huge difference when it comes to fighting for boxes at world bosses. If you pay enough and can get 3 headgears with + elemental stats, you can get quite a big boost. ~30 elemental attack per enchant, 3 max on an item, 3 headgear items total, you can get +270 elemental attack. That is very strong and will increase your DPS by a ton, especially if you’re building a character around it. Why do you think people are so crazy about having an arde dagger / karacha dagger? That +153 elemental attack is very strong, and this extra enchant is 80% stronger than having an arde/karacha.

I’m playing in ktos as well, and I get that the culture is different. I don’t care about that. The international version needs to be different, and we should voice our concerns to make it clear that this should be the case. I don’t understand what good can come from “wait and see” over “voice your concern”. If they do implement it in the international version, there’s no going back. Once people have already paid into enchant scrolls, you can’t go back and remove them.

Having this feature in the game destroys a lot of motivation I have to play competitively, since I won’t be forced to pay to compete. It also doesn’t look good if there’s already a system where people can pay to quickly get optimized stats on their gear. What else is fair game if you can already pay to get enchants on your gear?

6 Likes
#99

I agreed, i dont like RNG things… For me RNG need to be used only for itens drops and some skills.

I cant understand a same item with different stats… you have 2 iron sword, one do + 20 Str and the another give you +20 Agi.

My best game played was Ragnarok Online and at the beginning of the game wasn’t RNG.

Best time of my life.

R.I.P.

If TOS go on like this more and more people will leave.

I’ve seen enough people currently speaking that will no longer play the game because of P2W stuffs.

Very sad about that.

2 Likes
#100

Lots of people SAY that the amount leaving is acutally much much smaller. Not saying that the rng route is right just that most of those im leaving people are full of ■■■■.

#101

I am confused because they leave iTOS because of what happened in kTOS.